Drew and Dede Johnston Sales Pitch

pitchOnce upon a time, Drew and Dede Johnston were respected Scientology field auditors.

But they gave up that gig for the far more lucrative business of earning commissions from money squeezed out of their fellow kool aid drinkers.

Of course, they are going to promote the astonishing wonders of Super Power, just like they promoted the wonders of Objectives and Purif and reading the Basics and the Purif or whatever the latest blanket “why” is. So, here they go, superlatives, generalities and exclamation points cocked and loaded, giving their newest reg pitches in the guise of “success stories.”

But what I find most amazing is the quote at the end tacked on the “FSC”:

Super Power…This is the means that puts Scientologists into a new realm
  of ability enabling them to create the New World. It puts World Clearing
                        within reach in the future.”
                                   – LRH Ron’s Journal 30

These people apparently have no critical thought capacity whatsoever.

Really?  You are going to quote something from 1978 about how World Clearing is put within reach in the future.  THIRTY FIVE YEARS AGO!  

Had this actually been released to staff in the 6 weeks that LRH claimed it would be out (this is an example of hype, 6 weeks became 35 years) then “the future” would have come some time ago.  I guess she never stopped to think that the population of earth increased from 4.2 billion to 7.1 billion during that time.  But never mind, wondering about why the delay would just be “CI” and “entheta” so we just pretend it never happened.  

Really?  THE THING that would make “world clearing” a reality was swept under the rug for 35 years and nobody is supposed to mention it. 

It’s an endemic problem. Because the words of L. Ron Hubbard are considered sacred and unquestionable by fundamentalist Scientologists, they practice a refined sort of A=A=A. If he said it, it is therefore true. Any facts that seem out of alignment or contradictory thus cannot be true. And those untruths can be cast aside with impunity and not even given a second thought.

This is the “logic” that ensures orgs will not sign for registered mail “because it is off policy” but WILL sign for a FedEx envelope.  

Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2013 
From: Flag Office <fscnwus@earthlink.net>
Subject: New SuperPower Wins from Drew & Dede Johnston!!!!! c/o Sandy Dodwell

                        UNLEASH YOUR SUPER POWER!!!

                   Enter a brilliant new realm of ability

                        Super Power Success Stories
                            Drew & Dede Johnston
                        currently on Super Power!!!!

Success Story                                      Action: Consequences Rundown

I just emerged from what I thought was a “life” but it was a life that was far from complete and far from the Ideal Scene of what I really wanted; I discovered it was just one I decided to operate in and create despite it all.

Did I know that was the case??? No, I didn’t but now that I do I can see the future and I can figure out how to actually run the life I really want to live. This rundown has exteriorized me from the “Lions, Tigers and Bears!”

I can really see how my power of self is returning and emerging and I am so very happy about what I am shedding to bring about that result–because as I shed what has held me back I am releasing the power I have that can be used and used well.

My auditor, you are amazing the best of the best!

To my C/S, thank you for the perfect guidance.

Thanks to COB and RTC who have worked to ensure the tech is there for us all.

A huge Thank you to LRH who has made it possible for me to be saved from the darkness that I so creatively embroiled myself into for far, far too long.


Success Story                                      Action: Bright Think Rundown

The Bright Think Rd kicked my butt.

WOW, what a ride – one where I found myself down the track and back many times, interspersed with huge exteriorizations, valence shifts, perception changes, cognitions, and tons of other phenomena that was fascinating to experience.

This rundown had the power to grab my attention, double it and double it again and bring me back to the auditing room in a way I’ve never experienced.

What a rocket ride. So simple, yet so powerful. This rundown crushes reactivity while bringing about a greater sense of beingness, doingness and havingness and a greater sense of livingness. I feel more alive, with a greater reach.


Success Story                                   Action: The Super Study Rundown

All of my Super Power auditing has been remarkable – and this rundown is no exception. It is so basic, so fundamental – providing me with the opportunity to free up my ability to absorb knowledge and study. A horde of twists and turns of reactivity I was not even vaguely aware of have been exposed and resolved.

As learning is a common denominator to all life’s experiences – removing the trauma from learning on four flows has given me an exhilarating sense of well-being.

I’m truly astonished how skilled and competent my Flag trained Class IX Super Power Auditor is – her metering and auditor presence are exemplary.

In each and every session I feel my havingness is increasing by just being in session.

Thank you to my auditor, C/S, FSO, RTC, COB and LRH for this amazing opportunity.


SUCCESS STORY                                      Action: Bright Think Rundown


I could end my success story there but I will give you some more.

This rundown has exceeded any expectations I had going into it.

With this rundown LRH took me on a journey so personal, so very intimate it is a bit hard to find the words to adequately describe it.

I went on the perfect adventure on this rundown and following the road signs, voila, I found my way home!

This rundown has given me a new sense of myself. I will never be the same again.

Thank you to my auditor, my C/S, RTC, COB and of course to LRH!


Wow!!! Welcome to a new world, to a new era, where the technology is now in place to provide an amazing series of super fantastic confidential rundowns. You will experience ten rundowns like no other – ever. Ten rundowns in specific sequence in a space created exclusively for that purpose. 

These are unlike any rundowns you’ve ever experienced. What they address. How they are delivered. The unique and utterly spectacular results of each.

I am here for you and I am going to help you get there. You have a very powerful and caring team behind you: your Flag Office! 

Call me or e-mail me and let’s unleash your Super Power!!! Call me with any questions you have and I will answer them!

Sandy Dodwell
cell: (323) 893-6689

Super Power…This is the means that puts Scientologists into a new realm
  of ability enabling them to create the New World. It puts World Clearing
                        within reach in the future.”
                                   – LRH
                                     Ron’s Journal 30


  1. says

    “This is the “logic” that ensures orgs will not sign for registered mail “because it is off policy” but WILL sign for a FedEx envelope.”

    Haha, brilliant!

    • Michael Leonard Tilse says

      I think that Registered Mail counts as proof of service for legal documents, legally, while FedEx does not. So to avoid service in legal matters, they won’t accept registered mail.

      But the “Registered Agents” for the corporations, which is the lawyers usually, I think are required to accept the registered mail. And thus service of legal documents.

      • Michael Leonard Tilse says

        Alright, I’m wrong. It has to be handed to the person or Registered Agent of the corp.

        Were you and DM surprised that the Lenske’s accepted my registered mail “demand for refund and repayment”? One of the OSA bots I talked to seemed surprised.

      • DollarMorgue says

        I don’t know what it’s like in the US, but in a certain European country you may be deemed served within a stipulated period whether you are available to receive the documents or not. Being available is entirely your problem.

        Trying to find logial explanations for these idiosyncracies shows you put a lot more thought into it than they do, but also misses what is actually going on. Mike is brilliantly highlighting the logical fallacies. Doing so will set off similar explanations as yours, but at some point it’ll get through to all but the most determined (I know you’ve been out a while, so this last isn’t directed at you).

    • Idle Morgue says

      I was only in a few years and these “success stories” sound the same for EVERYTHING Scientology $ells and supposedly delivers! “Caring team at Flag” ??? That is a loaded oxymoron phrase” – NO one cares for anyone at FLAG – Flag is the most vicious and insatiable place loaded with a bunch of people who go after MONEY and could care less what happens to you once you leave. Everything is so fake in Scientology: friendships and care are make believe!! I am so very grateful I am out of that madhouse. Have fun OSA – you can have your “church” and if you decide you are tired of it too – just take a good look standing outside of Scientology of the real Church of Scientology – and may you never be the same. It requires courage and strength – so we understand if you want to hide out and believe everything you are told!! If Scientology was “truth” – it would stand on its own and nothing could do anything to change it – so take a good hard look at your church…but you need to step outside of it in order to really SEE!!

  2. says

    Wasn’t field auditing killed dead by management ?

    “Once upon a time, Drew and Dede Johnston were respected Scientology field auditors.

    But they gave up that gig for the far more lucrative business of earning commissions from money squeezed out of their fellow kool aid drinkers.”

    • says

      It was actually doing pretty good from the late 90′s to late 2003 when the Auditor (De)Activation Chief Taz Kember canceled all our certs because GAT wasn’t a requirement for Field Auditors till then which caused a mass exodus of PCs who were unwilling to be subjected to the mindless robots of the Robotic Technology Center and have their F/Ns continually bypassed.

      Seems they were still applying the PLs “Field Auditors”, “Field Auditors Rights” and the “Org Services PL” back then.

      Of course IBetray was still ripping us off or more accurately extorting its 10% but the fact that we were getting all this new business sort of ameliorated their extortion

      Then Taz much like his mother decided that all these policies were getting in his way so he decided to enforce black on white (kinda like GO 1361) which was our original RTC Licensing agreement and the somewhat Independent Field Auditor party was over.

      Much like the relatively independent Franchise Network before us.


      We were told that in order to continue to audit we had to report to our local Reeducation Centers AKA orgs and be reeducated as auditors.

      You could call it the Church of Scientology’s version of the “Cultural Revolution” which pretty much wiped out Field Auditing.


      Since we are on the subject of Drew Johnston.

      He had already gone into selling real estate (as in “Ideal Orgs” and SP corner stones which according to his math added up to more than 1) long before this calamity.

      (Whether it was because he had some kinda “in” with the coup and thus knew which way the wind was gonna blow or he was just a greedy bastard masquerading as an auditor.

      I don’t know.

      Personally I think it was a combination of the two.

      But anyhoo….)

      I’ve found that the coup who took over will only apply policy if it is toward their own immediate interest, advantage and convenience. In other words rather cynically and selectively.

      Like the ones say on Field Auditors.

      Or for instance when I was working Non SO they were all over your ass about completing lower conditions even when your stats had recovered and were now above normal.

      (BTW “Completing Conditions” wasn’t even even a PL until some moron in AVC decided to paint some old OOD’s order green but anyhoo…)

      Yet they’ll totally ignore the stipulation in “Staff Member Reports” against having someone “donate” or more accurately *bribe* their way out of lower conditions.

      Also the PL on Registered Mail was never applied by the “Tax Audit Unit” since practically every communication they received from the IRS was sent by registered mail.

      (Who knows maybe if they ignored them the Church might have gotten a better deal than that sordid “Secret Closing Agreement” but that’s water under the bridge)

      And the one on Refunds.

      I mean fargetabotit!

      That policy was deep sixed back in ’93 when fees for services became “donations” of “no tangible value”. I mean just getting a RAP for most people is a total mind fuck operation.

      Now I see that even if you’ve got money on account you can’t use it for that chunk of spyware they call an “meter”.

      So much for “delivering what’s promised” which at one time used to be “Senior Policy” but not anymore.

      Like the “Service PL” which was tossed into the same burn bag.

      ‘Nuff said.

  3. Wendy M says

    Sandy Dodwell? Now there’s a blast from the past. ‘m pretty sure she was a reg in Joburg Org when it was in Commissioner Street in the early 90′s. She must be getting on in years.

    All this “WOW, WOW, WOW” is so overdone and anyway reminds me of a lawnmower that just won’t start. That said, I am happy for the cognitions obtained. I hope bright think leads to right think and some truly liberating consequences. That would be impressive.

    • KFrancis says

      That is hilarious Wendy! If you do run into this with your mower just be sure to properly prime the carburetor, use good clean gas and check your connection at the spark plug-No more wow, wow wow!

      Follow these simply rules and you will have an attractive yard that will be the envy of the neighborhood!

    • Black Panther says

      Hi Wendy – yes – Sandy Dodwell – one of the THE most corrupt regge”s (read fraudsters) to ever sully Joburg org – and yes it was Commissioner Street. She would use people’s credit cards details from the finance system, phone the bank, raise the credit limit and invoice the sale – without the public even being there or agreeing to the cycle. In other words, she would get the money and THEN do the reg cycle. I remember her doing this to a chap called Peter Dittberner (RIP) )- he was not to be messed with. He marched into the org totally livid, made her reverse the entire transaction and threatened to report her for fraud. I remember him almost going for her physically and he had to pulled away from her – he was that incensed – and to top it all the org threated to treat him as a refund case. She pulled a similar one with my father, found out what his credit was and then invoiced the KTL and LOC packs – for my mother – I have never seen my parents so close to a divorce after that. She was a slimy snake -I think Ken and Albert took a feather from her cap once she was bust back to the USA.

      • Wendy M says

        Hi BP. I can remember how she was “revered” for her stats, but having had only one comm cycle with her, I never understood what the magic was. Now I understand. Fraud in the name of money and stats is probably interpreted as the “greatest good for the greatest number”. Sandy ultimately appears to have been promoted to Flag. Makes complete sense when you understand the underlying “policy” of the church. Do they have no shame?

    • OLD TIMER says

      If I was walking down the road and found Sandy Dodwell on fire, I would not stop to help, even if I had a full bladder!!

      The shit she tried to pull on me!!

      And now she is part of the finest at FLAG!

      They deserve each other!

  4. Bela says

    I am curious as to what Dede’s case level is? Her success story from the “consequences rundown” makes it seem like a degrade to whatever earlier auditing and training she has done if she is only now realizing she was living a life that was far from complete and ideal and didn’t know it.

    • Roy Macgregor says

      Dede is New OT VIII. I had the same thought. The cogs and wins do not seem in line with what she should have experienced already. Knowing that she has already completed everything the Scientology bridge has to offer, this statement seems pretty disappointing:

      “I just emerged from what I thought was a “life” but it was a life that was far from complete and far from the Ideal Scene of what I really wanted”

      Really Dede? After all the training and auditing and reaching OT VIII this is what you got?

      I think this is probably endemic in the Radical C of S where all those still guzzling the kool aide have lost so much of their personal integrity and lost so much personal freedom of thought and action that their lives are far from complete and very far from what they really wanted.

      • statpush says

        Nowadays one has to not-is previous gains and knowledge to experience “wins” DM-style. Serious, you have veteran Scnists almost bragging about how stupid they are, like “never understood Dn”, or “didn’t really get what Scn was all about” – fer Chrissakes yer OT8!!

        You see nobody really knows anything, until DM.

        What does this tell you about their own personal certainty…about anything? They now “have” certainty because someone said they could now have it.

        It would interesting research to take one individual and collect all of their success stories from the bottom of the Bridge to the very top, and analyse their states of being. I think it would be shocking.

      • Joe Schmo says

        I had the exact same thoughts when I was reading these “success stories”. To me they are “Utter Fail Stories” because they document quite clearly that Scientology was an utter failure for these people until they got onto these new rundowns and now it’s all better. OMG – don’t they get what they are actually saying about the rest of The Bridge when they utter this inane tripe about Super Power? So much for not denigrating the states of Clear and OT! Well done Drew and Dede! Carry on!

      • Idle Morgue says

        Poor Dede – she is OTVIII? Wait until a few weeks pass and she wakes up to the fact that she probably spent $35,000 (min.) plus whatever Flag fleeced her for plus whatever regges at Flag fleeced her for plus whatever MAA Regges at Flag fleeced her for….to realize that NOTHING HAS CHANGED and people are leaving Scientology – not coming in!! Poor, pitiful Dede!!

      • WhatWall says

        Roy and statpush,

        Very good observations! According to the success stories of these OTs, they gradiently increase their knowledge and cause level over the years only to then invalidate it all in response to one of the new Miscavige releases.

        Based on what I’ve observed of the Miscavige-loyal OTs around me:
        - Some ill, dying or dead;
        - Some poor or bankrupt from chasing status and/or from Bridge costs;
        - Some engaged in pyramid schemes or fraudulent investment schemes;
        - Some silent and apparently introverted;
        - Some arrogant and self-important;
        these OTs never got the gains they were supposed to get, but can’t admit it.

        Observing the OTs around me over a 20 year period was the main thing that first made me realize that something was seriously wrong with the Church of Scientology and its leadership. These OTs were not manifesting the philosophy of Scientology as I understand it. They were not even successfully managing their families or finances.

  5. says

    Interestingly enough, no mentioning of the Ethics Repair List! Could it be that it is not part of the Super Power R/Ds at Flag? Being too dangerous for the existing management to be delivered?

    • Jane Doe says

      Good point Wolfgang. I wonder the same thing about the Ethics Repair List. I know Drew and Dede and you’re right. Drew used to be an awesome field auditor and CS, but now they, like most others, make their money regging and FSMing. Pat Mooney and husband, same story. And Mike is right that the success story is just a thinly disguised, hyped up reg come-on, per “come-on dissemination.”

      • says

        Back in my final days there and really one of the many reasons I decided to get the fuck outa Dodge under Sheriff Dave was that one’s “success story” had to be approved and any that were not submitted without some glowing endorsement of RTC was rejected even if it was considered a “Rave Success” back in the bad Ol’days.

        I fondly remember the D of T telling me to write such a “Success Story” after I had submitted myself to the torture of what they called the VI Certainty course so I could back in the chair and me telling him to go fuck himself.

        Well since I was the only graduate they had for GAT 6 at the time they let me slide :)

      • Jane Doe says

        Speaking of writing Success Stories, when the OT VI people would comp VI and be ready to go home with materials, they were instructed to include in their success story thanking RTC for making the tech pure etc. And when completing OT VII, you were asked to include in your success story how studying the Basics helped you get through OT VII or have more wins on OT VII. It’s all just PR.

    • says

      It would be interesting to look at Dede’s earlier success stories. For the price they paid for these rundowns, I would think that it would be more than recycling old wins. I think the SP rundowns have been super-hyped to the point where they couldn’t possibly meet expectations.

  6. LDW says

    This is one of the rundowns:

    “What would happen if you were apathetic?
    Repeat, etc.
    “What would happen if you got angry?”
    Repeat, etc.

    I have been using this process in Life Repairs on new people since around 1998. I would expect that if a person had never received it, and did it after going all the way through OT VIII, that he’d have some pretty good wins on it. It might even be effective from the viewpoint of doing it on a new PC, then doing it again after the PCs track was opened up and he could see more long range consequences of dramatizing each of the tone levels.

    What astonishes me is that Drew, an old class VIII would continue the sham that a 200 million dollar building was needed to deliver a process that has been around for decades and could easily be delivered in any academy co-audit.

    It also amazes me that he could justify an entire floor of a 200 million dollar building being used to run around a stupid pole. I really can’t imagine how badly they have to not-is the reality in order to accept an out-point of this magnitude.

    They will be selling the crap out of Superpower and making a ton of dough, knowing full well at each step of the way that any one of these rundowns could have been delivered at their local org for a fraction of the cost. They really should run out the long term consequences of perpetrating that overt on their fellow man in order to line their own pockets and glorify david miscavige.

  7. Sinar says

    Super Power…This is the means that puts Scientologists into a new realm
    of ability enabling them to create the New World. It puts World Clearing
    within reach in the future.”
    – LRH
    Ron’s Journal 30

    There is one minor detail which isn’t mentioned here. Superpower was intended by LRH for staff members to empower them so that this could happen. It is the staff of Orgs and Sea Orgs who train auditors and audit PCs and make Clears, not the PCs at the FSO.

      • says

        Ron put the rundown on the back burner after he discovered how badly out TRs were and personally put ‘em all on a TRs program.

        I mean back then most auditor trainees would cycle through the TRs once. Call it a “win” and go on to the next item on the check sheet.

        Some of them would skip ‘em and sign ‘em off ’cause they did the comm course back in ’72 or whatever.

        Ya know “Fast Flow training” and all that.

        As I remember the only “handling” ever done on TR-4 back then was “Thank you for telling me that” which became an inside joke. While other “auditors” thought “TRs” interfered with them actually getting in comm with the PC.

        I mean hardly anyone back then made the connection between TRs and communication even though the Communication Course was called the Communication Course with the exception of a few who had done the old HQS course (written by that evil SP Mary Sue) which had the student clay demo how each TR related to the comm cycle.


        The Ol’man tended to be over optimistic at times and 6 weeks was the time he figured it would take to train auditors on Super Power if they had any semblance of TRs.

        Little did he know that most of the auditors arriving would make Joe Howard in the beginning of the TRs Tech film look like a paragon of Auditor Beingness.

        I mean there I was in Qual minding my own business FESing some staff member’s folder when the Telex Officer ran in with a 20 page telex which include the HCOB “TR Basics Resurrected” and I sorta knew at that point Super Power wasn’t going to be released anytime soon.

      • says

        Thank you! I like getting that insider’s viewpoint. Irregardless how long it was going to take to realistically get Superpower released. There was an original intention to release Superpower for use on the staff. Since that didn’t happen we can only speculate how that might of played out. Seems to me that Miscavige down deep doesn’t want anyone (especially staff) experiencing incredible gains. In fact there is a preponderance of evidence that everything has been changed and geared to controlling the group more tightly above all, I find it very suspicious that Miscavige took an active roll in Lisa McPherson’s auditing BEFORE she went type 3. I think his purpose is squish everyone else down while maintaining his power base (live, breath and eat Simon Bolivar.) If those inside the bubble were to experience true spiritual freedom they would never submit to this form of spiritual tyranny. This is Mike’s boiled frog concept, the current public and staff have been on slow boil for many years.

      • Peter says

        When I taught the comm course, I made it clear that bull baiting was a pseudo auditing session and that the job of the coach (auditor) was to get the student (pc) through the course on a win and that bull baiting was NOT a game/competition to see who could better get the student to blink/laugh/et al. I strove to develop great coaches who could really help their students.

      • says


        That’s the way it’s supposed to be done.

        But if you looked in most course rooms back then. It wasn’t being done that way.

        It was more like performance art ;)

  8. Rory Medford says

    All SCN should run from the new WOWS!!! Its just another flavor of the month moment. Wake up peeps you are getting more garbage shoved down your throat and what comes out the other end is a bunch of shit so you end up full of shit!!!!

  9. Tyler Bosserman says

    Too bad there isn’t a rundown, “how to use the english language in a creative and authentic way that doesn’t parrot L. Ron Hubbard (c) rundown”

    You can tell all of these success stories were written in under 5 minutes, which is, of course, the standard time of adequately expressing the truth of any life changing experience.

    I’m so sick of this shit ….

  10. Jane Doe says

    ” THE THING that would make “world clearing” a reality was swept under the rug for 35 years and nobody is supposed to mention it. “

  11. Jane Doe says

    Hey did you notice that the picture that Mike put up with the article looks like Steve Kemper, the former reg at AOLA? Wham Pow Wow . Holy hyperbole, Batman!

    • Michael Leonard Tilse says

      Yea it does! But it’s the “PC” guy from the Apple “Mac vs PC” television ads.

  12. Silvia says

    As you may have noticed, of the three success stories, only one did not ack COB and RTC.

    Well, based on past information of some ex members, if you did not acknowledge COB and RTC in the Success Story your next step was….? Yes, ethics. I am not making this up, it has happened.

    So, the exuberant, magnanimous, extra terrestrial wins of one person will end being made less as his ack did not include the Devil Moron.

    • says

      It is only because of the Benevolence of the Dark Lord that these rundowns are now available. Drew and Dede should carry pictures of DM around their necks to remind them of his greatness and how truly fortunate they are.

      • Joe Schmo says

        LMFAO. Seeing Scientologists walking around with pics of DM around their neck would actually complete the cult picture perfectly. And oddly, so fitting to their mindset now.

    • Jane Doe says

      I can back you up on that Silvia. I was told to include in my Success Story or announcement at graduation, to ack RTC and COB amongst the other stuff. And so were others. Maybe they will hang a picture of DM over LRH’s and have us clap and Hip Hip Hooray to the Midget now. Long Live COB, the cob.

  13. Alanzo says

    Mike wrote:

    This is the “logic” that ensures orgs will not sign for registered mail “because it is off policy” but WILL sign for a FedEx envelope.

    HA! That is hilarious, and so very true.

    What I love about Mike Rinder’s blog is that he takes these communications from Scientologists and he examines the thinking in them. This gets people whose thinking has been hijacked by Scientology to start questioning again.

    Questioning brings new life.

    This particular behavior of signing for FEDEXes is a great example of the real life logic problems you get into when you adopt an ideology – any ideology – and let it do your thinking for you.

    A Scientologist is taught, to within an inch of their lives, to “think with Scientology”. There are many punishments and coercive social techniques – as well as social rewards – for letting Scientology take over your own inner thoughts and feelings as a Scientologist.

    But once you do start thinking with Scientology, you are no longer thinking for yourself. Your thinking is trapped in a maze of fixed axioms, tired slogans, and stale quotes that never let you evaluate your own decision-making and how that decision-making might, or might not, align with your own self-interests. You can only evaluate your thinking against more Scientology.

    That is the trap.

    This is “drinking the kool-aide”. This is the blindness that only allows the Scientologist to see what confirms Scientology, and never allows them to see anything that would question it. This is what kills the self-reflection in people like Tom Cruise and Kirstie Alley, and it is what makes it impossible for them to see how pin-headed and fanatical they look to the rest of the world. They are asserting their Scientology thinking, and that Scientology thinking is all they can see.

    Scientology is not the only ideology that demands fanaticism: Communism, Christianity, National Socialism, even Buddhism, all have their fanatics. Scientology is the only ideology I know, however, where it is “out-ethics” to NOT be a fanatic.

    Scientology is the only philosophy I know where “reasonable” is a dirty word, where testing your own rationale and the soundness of your thinking is “Q&A, Man’s Deadliest Disease”.

    The antidote for thinking with Scientology contains another dirty word, “critical thinking”. Critical thinking contains the logic skills that any Scientologist needs to regain themselves and to start thinking for their own self-interests again. Even though that sounds irresponsible and “first-dynamic oriented”, it is the way to freedom and greater responsibility for yourself and for others after Scientology.

    Mike Rinder promotes, and demonstrates, critical thinking skills brilliantly.

    Most Scientologists got into Scientology by seeking to live with the truth. That’s what gets most of them out of Scientology, too. Seeking to live with the truth is a worthy and quite rewarding path in life. It is a path that is way bigger than Scientology or any other ideology. Pretty soon you find that Scientology was just one of the stops along the way.

    There is no shame in that.

    Thanks for your blog, Mike.

    You are doing a lot of good for a lot of people.


    • statpush says

      Good post Alan. To me the missing element is “personal judgement”. In many ways KSW can destroy personal judgement, and promote parroted ronquotes. Staff members who can rattle off LRH quotes are looked upon as being on-source. And Source is Good.

      Without personal judgement the practitioner is never able to “think with the data”. He simply becomes part of the collective.

      To make matters worse the group stigmatizes mistakes as a PTS condition; so you can’t even freely learn from your mistakes.

      I can’t help but mention… When faced with a situation you don’t know how to handle, ask yourself – “What would Ron do?” Argggghhh!

      Hey, buddy – “What would YOU do?” The time to start thinking for yourself is now.

      • Alanzo says

        Statpush wrote:

        Without personal judgement the practitioner is never able to “think with the data”. He simply becomes part of the collective.

        “the collective” – I like that.

        While LRH often said that you have to use personal judgement and “learn to play the piano”, he ALSO made the 10 points of KSW HIGH CRIMES if you did not follow them, and created rewards and penalties, used “word clearing”, false data stripping, “ethics gradients”, etc. as socially coercive techniques to enforce fanatical obedience to his writings and lectures under the rubric of 100% Standard Tech, Ethics, and Admin.

        LRH repeatedly said one thing, and did another. His greatest forte was prestidigitation and the use of distraction techniques.

        I have decided that a cult is any group which uses socially coercive techniques to get a person to work against his own self-interests. The above are definitely socially coercive. Hell, even hinting to a human being – who is basically social – that he is “out-ethics” if he does not comply with some group policy is coercive to him. Being called “out-ethics” is the worst thing you can be, socially and with regard to your group, as a human being.

        I don’t think it is possible to be part of any ideological organization and retain your personal judgement. When you join an ideological organization like Scientology or the Catholic Church, or even a Zen Buddhist center, your personal judgement has to fit within the ideology they are surviving on. Your problem becomes that the infinite number of things that can happen to you in life are way too big to fit into the ideology the group is pushing.

        In any ideological organization, the ideology ALWAYS has to be right – even when it is not.

        To me, the basic human mistake was adopting an ideology. That’s where you begin molding your own thinking, limiting your own options and alternatives, and conforming to fixed ideas which can not ever predict all that you will face in life.

        Adopting an ideology was the primary mistake I made when I became a Scientologist.

        I did not know it at the time. I only found out later.

        But that has made all the difference.


      • Peter says

        I’m really enjoying your posts, Alanzo. For me, the defining moment on this subject came during Power Processing 5A. The final command on that is/was “Tell me a source.” LRH was my first response, but the needle was not free. Got the question again and this huge wave of satori rolled over me. “I am.” Though I did more in scio, I never forgot that particular win. All wins were MINE, not LRH’s, the auditor’s, the C/S’s, or anyone elses. The tech helped me look but it could not cognite for me, understand for me, do the work for me. And if you’re not “Doing the Work” in your life now, you’ve either stopped growning or have, at the least, hit a plateau. Doing the Work can be meditation, reading, trying out new techniques, improving your relationships, improving yourself, etc.

        The older scio got, the more assertive LRH became, the more controlling he was, the more insistent that ONLY his way would work and ONLY done exactly as he demanded. To do that was to turn over your thinking, your cognitive abilities, your personal awareness to his control via the group. Not good for growth.

      • Alanzo says

        Peter wrote:

        The older scio got, the more assertive LRH became, the more controlling he was, the more insistent that ONLY his way would work and ONLY done exactly as he demanded. To do that was to turn over your thinking, your cognitive abilities, your personal awareness to his control via the group. Not good for growth.

        Yes. That was the switcheroo!.

        Moving on after all those demands to turn over my thinking has been very good for me. And I have been able to take a few lessons with me from Scientology, too.

        The other day I was doing a new spiritual practice that I have learned and something appeared out of “nowhere” that scared the shit out of me. Right at that point I remembered my training in TR0 – and did not even flinch.

        Mostly, I have had to throw away a lot of what I learned in Scientology because it was either booby-trapped, totally wrong, or completely superfluous.

        But not that time.

        That time, my TR0 came in real handy.

        LRH would have not approved of what I was doing, of course.

        But then again, I don’t really approve of a lot that he did, either.



  14. says

    Simple yet powerful is code for “I really paid for this?? I could have done it on my own!!” Such as the Clear Certainty Rundown where you take a walk and look at things. Simple yet powerful.

    I’m doing a new special rundown my self . It is called “take a long walk by the river”. When I do this I mentally transport myself down the time track and cognite on amazing things. The wins I have doing this are unlike any I have had in any other auditing. After this process I am sure I will never be the same again. I now know that I am a spiritual Being and that I will always be around. Hip, hip hurray!!

    • LDW says

      I think you meant the Sunshine Rundown, Tony. But the point is made. $500 to go give yourself a locational.

      • says

        $500? – You may be dating yourself. I did a search and found a couple cost references to the Sunshine RD online saying it cost them $1300. I think mine was $800 (many years ago) and it took about 20 minutes. Like a dumbass, I didn’t even think about how ridiculous the price was until it got pointed out to me years later.

  15. Ozma says

    How funny.

    “I just emerged from what I thought was a “life” but it was a life that was far from complete and far from the Ideal Scene of what I really wanted; I discovered it was just one I decided to operate in and create despite it all.

    Did I know that was the case??? No, I didn’t but now that I do I can see the future and I can figure out how to actually run the life I really want to live. This rundown has exteriorized me from the “Lions, Tigers and Bears!”

    I can really see how my power of self is returning and emerging and I am so very happy about what I am shedding to bring about that result–because as I shed what has held me back I am releasing the power I have that can be used and used well.”

    This is EXACTLY what happened to me when I left scientology.

  16. Odd Thomas says

    Perhaps I have grown cynical through the years, but these success stories remind me of certain Liability Formulas I had to read while on staff.

    It usually started with someone being assigned a lower condition – that they totally disagreed with. After the tears, shouting and holes punched into the drywall, there came acceptance, that they were wrong about something – anything – just so long as they could see the end of the cycle. Then they eventually got around to Liability and getting signatures. Here is where the similarity to the above comes into play.

    I would read these write-ups and involuntarily my head would get cocked to one side as I tried to understand the logic. Invariably these poor souls (I was one of them) would latch onto one outpoint, one aspect of their life, their perception, something that could be corrected. Then came the gushing – how bad things were until they were assigned Treason or Confusion. This opened the door to tremendous change in abilities, perception, cause over MEST, on and on. Then came the thank yous to LRH for the Ethics Tech, to their senior for spotting what jerks they were, to the Dir I&R for slapping them around until they saw the light….

    I would read this sad missives, then look up into the desperate eyes of the staff member, who was hoping I wouldn’t or couldn’t spot the lies, the falsehoods, the obvious lack of gain – for there was no gain to be had with a wrongly enforced, punitive ethics cycle. I usually did spot the outpoints and tried kindness to at least get the application of the tech somewhat in. Eventually I stopped trying to fix things, and just signed it. It just got too painful.

    Yeah, I think Drew and Dede realized that there was something called Present Time and they slammed so hard into it, they became concussed and mistook their respective trauma for gains and cognitions.

    Back in the day (confession coming) I smoked a joint with someone, who went off like a rocket and started telling me how fantastic the grass was, how he was tripping, on and on. As it turns out – it was 99% Oregano and the only thing that would be affected by this shit would be some sliced tomatoes with a little olive oil. It was pure delusion – just like these two.


  17. says

    “It’s an endemic problem. Because the words of L. Ron Hubbard are considered sacred and unquestionable by fundamentalist Scientologists, they practice a refined sort of A=A=A. If he said it, it is therefore true. Any facts that seem out of alignment or contradictory thus cannot be true. And those untruths can be cast aside with impunity and not even given a second thought.”

    Well Mike, that pretty much sums it up.

    The problem, IMHO, is the very deception built into Scientology by LRH himself.

    First of all, Scientology is NOT its auditing technology. I agree, that is what it SHOULD be, but that is not what it IS.

    No, Scientology is the brainchild of its Founder, and it put together and packaged in the way HE wanted to make it, with all its conflicting and opposing goals suspended and frozen in time.

    It has a considerable portion of its “scriptures” as secret and privileged information. That alone makes LRH’s pronouncements about “Hidden Data Line” false and specious, as the most important part of a hidden data line is NOT if LRH wrote or not, but that it is HIDDEN.

    The careful hiding of LRH’s other goals, intentions and sources, including all the suppressive practices and policies that he introduced into it, all the way down to where he wanted to take his followers up the Bridge, is what makes Scientology practically impossible to be audited.

    In my view that is the main reason why the Qual function in the Church completely failed; because in order to have an effective quality control function, you have to be able to review ALL practices, policies and procedures, including that of its SOURCE and Founder. That has never been possible during LRH’s lifetime.

    The arguments about Scientology being a Religion, a Science or Spiritual Therapy, is part of the built in deception to throw a wide net, and catch a wide audience. It also produces a considerable amount of confusion in Scientologists or on anybody trying to understand it.

    The confusion is further amplified by the extensive use of propaganda, PR and outright manipulation, which have no business in a “Spiritual Grass Root Movement”.


    For who could intelligently be part of a spiritual movement, when its core Myth and practices are carefully hidden from most people?

    Scientologists act crazily and stupidly, because in order to regain their self-composure, they would have to break agreement with a lot of what LRH said, and actually take a hard look at him and his products and REJECT a significant portion of his writings.

    That has never been possible inside the Church, whether LRH was running it or not.

    • Odd Thomas says

      Conan — just saw this posting — thought I’d make a belated comment on it.

      I think a lot of people assumed that Scientology’s creation was very linear and happened over a few unfettered, uncomplicated years and eventually produced the result known broadly as – Scientology Tech. I think the same incorrect view applies to LRH himself – that he crafted the Tech, the Science, whatever we choose to call it – over a few years. That it resembles in some fashion, a freight train, with a succession of cars all neatly linked together.

      I don’t believe it happened like that at all. I believe SCN more closely resembles the old Winchester House in Santa Clara County, California. A house, essentially created by the widow of Oliver Winchester – Proud Papa of the Winchester Repeating Rifle. To appease the spirits of all those killed by her husband’s rifle, non-stop building took place at her residence for almost 40 years. This created a Mystery House with stairways leading nowhere, windows opening onto brick walls, and doorways leading to sheer drops into the garden four stories below.

      In other words very non-linear. LRH developed the Laws of Listing and Nulling that WORK! and he also wrote the policies on how to obliterate opponents. He showed incredible compassion for the average person and simultaneously showed a complete disconnect in what the average staff member’s life was like earning $5 a week in 1985,.

      The only thing consistent about SCN was that in practice, it was very inconsistent. But within it all is a core of data that works and works well. I for one, am more interested in the workability of that core data than I am with his foibles, his inconsistencies or his view of himself. In the long term, they’re irrelevant.


  18. Jens TINGLEFF says

    “I just emerged from what I thought was a “life” but it was a life that was far from complete and far from the Ideal Scene of what I really wanted; I discovered it was just one I decided to operate in and create despite it all.”

    Should have quit while they were behind…

  19. NoEyeDeer says

    “I just emerged from what I thought was a “life” but it was a life that was far from complete and far from the Ideal Scene of what I really wanted; I discovered it was just one I decided to operate in and create despite it all.”

    Hey wait a minute! Didn’t you already attest to “cause over life?” you OTVIII d-bag?

    This “success story” coming from an OTVIII proves what a sham it all is. Part of the reason I left is because I could see that many so-called OTs were not doing well in life and I did not feel the need to move “up” the bridge to operate at a lower level of ability like them.

  20. says

    Yes Roy – that would be correct for me. I loved my job and I loved my auditing and training but there was something missing and I knew it. I never have taken my eye off the goal and I truly thought I would achieve that in 40 years of scientology and nearly 20 years of staff at one of the most theta environments on the planet AOLA. I knew where I was from my goal but thinking it was just around the corner. Pretty soon the barriers of RPF, no libs, no family time, no leaves to visit family were just to much to live with and themselves became off purpose. It is a very rocky climb out of that which one agreed to… But is worth every bit of it.
    I could write success stories like this for my many wins from leaving it all behind.

  21. says

    Yes it does Jane Doe. Last I knew (2007)he was opening a marriage counseling group in LA. He wrote an excellent article for The Latest but that’s the last I’ve seen of Steve K. I worked with him at AOLA 19 years… was like a brother.

    • WhatWall says

      Pumpkin, did you know Paige (formerly Kuhn) at AOLA? I don’t know her current last name. AFAIK, she worked in Qual or Tech. I wish her well. She was one of the most caring people I met in my SO career.

  22. says

    I forget which rundown it was that uses the chair that looks like it’s right out of an “Implant Station.” Has anyone reported wins form this procedure?. I’m expecting something like “It’s so great, whenever I think a critical thought about David Miscavige and get sick an have to vomit and then I make a donation to the IAS and feel orgasmic.”

  23. Michael Leonard Tilse says

    I wonder if it occurs to scientologists who have been in a long time, that new members are spending FAR FAR less to go up the ‘bridge’ than they did?

    Usually, the first people into a new subject or a new stock, benefit more.

    But these long term members have had to pay for their ‘bridge’ 4 or 5 times over. And now have to pay to do it again. They don’t seem to get credit for what they did before.

    These new people, if there are any, can supposedly do it just ONCE and get the amazing gains and OT powers these old-timers have been reaching for time and time again.

    When will this sink in? And will these new people buy it again the next time the bridge is re-built? That finally, NOW, after all these years the real bridge is here!

    And that the original bridge Ron sold them wasn’t the real deal.

  24. DollarMorgue says

    I actually hope for those two they really had those wins. It means they’d be on their way out about now, bags packed or no.

    Anyway, this isn’t just about A=A=A and discarding any uncomfortable facts. It is also about finding a ‘plausible’ explanation (dub in), such as, well yes, LRH wrote this in 78 but he was so far ahead of his time and mere Earth technology that it had to catch up first (my, aren’t WE just a superior lot?) and it took NASA (imagine that?) to make it happen. I mean, it’s got to blow your socks off. But I really like Odd Thomas’s explanation, too. Maybe they were doing lowers. I never got far, but writing a success story always felt like a ‘do or die’ thing for me. It had to have just enough whoop in it to come off true, who wanted to be seen with bad indicators and NCG and maybe end up in ethics for trying to improve one’s life? Of course, in a bubble where you’re not allowed to evaluate, there’s no feedback on how you sound and you never notice the point you lost touch with reality. There’s no one there who’ll tell you.

    • Peter says

      “Writing a success story” ended cycle on whatever the win had been. I faked them so that I could sit with the win, play with it, see where else it might take me. It quite often took me much further and expanded greatly. This, too, was taking responsibility for MY wins, not those of LRH or anyone else.

      • Odd Thomas says

        +1 Dude. I recall doing my NOTs at AOLA in 2005. I would step out of the Examiner’s office (where I was struggling with the guy on the other side of the shield – staring at the meter for 20-40-60 seconds – waiting for an F/N. That wasn’t enough – noooo. As soon as I got out, right as I was trying to reset the win I had, I’d be confronted by IAS regges who wanted to talk about my next level. Man I hadn’t even gotten my shoes back on and there they were, howling for me. Talk about having the cognition process zapped and killed.

        I finally met with the PES, who was trying to reg me and told her “No, No way, Not ever” with sufficient intention, that she just left me alone.

        Talk about a “Refused Reality.”


  25. Madora P says

    To an outsider these people sound like they’ve been subjected to exploitative mental exercises designed to make them forgo their own will and submit in total propitiation.

  26. Madora P says

    I truly thought that “thinking with the tech” meant making the correct decision about which of the conflicting and extreme platitudes to apply to a life problem. Because the tech is a mass of contradictions and blanket statements.

    I didn’t know that meant to “stop critical thinking and submit you know-nothing idiot!” But it did have that effect.

  27. statpush says

    Has anyone noticed a strong emphasis on exteriorization with the recent success stories? Not that there’s anything wrong with exteriorization. But, it seems everyone is exteriorizing out of this or that. A previous promo email said something like “achieve exteriorization while still in a body” – Huh?

    Whether it’s Super Power or Case Resurgence, the purported wins are “out of this world”, which seems to align with just about anything coming out of RCS. So spectacular, one wonders what anyone could hope to achieve afterwards.

    • overrunincalif says

      Yea, absolutely. The go to win; exterior with full perception.
      Only ” I’ll tell you about it, otherwise I’m going to keep it secret and never demonstrate it to anyone, even though if I did, people would come in and sign up in droves. But I’m exterior with full perception, wow wow wow !!!!!!. You’ll just have to take my word for it.

  28. Still on your side says

    If New OT VIIIs have lost that status, and now have to re-start (for the second time), that should validate the decision to leave of every OT VIII, or lower, that has left. I can imagine that there were some who left wondering whether they had wasted years of their life. How comforting to know that they are the ones that did not waste those years because they kept their gains by leaving. How insane that those OT VIIIs still with Miscavige who so willingly throw years of their life away, over and over again, are afraid to talk to an Indie (or any other Ex) for fear of losing their eternity. Does that mean they had their eternity when they were being “mislead” before GAT I, and after GAT I? If they had their eternity, then why is GAT II and Super Power necessary? This whole fiasco is very reminiscent of the Spanish Inquisition when the church members lived in terror that they would offend one of the Inquisitors by not knowing which answer was the right answer that particular day.

    • Peter says

      I still am boggled by the concept of “losing my eternity”. LOL Just how is that possible if I am, indeed, a spiritual being??? They manage to make it both irrational and illogical at the same time. LOL

  29. Formost says

    I’m truly astonished how skilled and competent my Flag trained Class IX Super Power Auditor is – her metering and auditor presence are exemplary.

    I don’t think the auditor is supposed to sit beside you.

  30. says

    I got my “consequences rundown” at 14, upon being checked into juvenile hall. I also “emerged from what I thought was a “life” but it was a life that was far from complete and far from the Ideal Scene of what I really wanted” . And the experience was a gift from the state!

  31. overrunincalif says

    I think one of the reasons the long in “die hard” Scntlgsts stay in is because it’s been such a long journey. Very hard to give up when you’ve gone so far, sacrificed so much. OK, you’ve been sailing for 11 months and haven’t found land yet, another ship passes by and people aboard tell you, ” there’s no land that way” No matter how convincing they are, you’ve traveled all this way for so long, you’ve just got to see for yourself, even against better judgement. So they continue. Some of the more observant ones jump in the life boats and start rowing in another direction. Sooner or later, all will realize there is no land. Complete with casualties. And then it will be time to start again in a new unit of time.

    • Alanzo says

      Overrunincalif wrote:

      Sooner or later, all will realize there is no land. Complete with casualties. And then it will be time to start again in a new unit of time.


      A thetan can do anything!



    • Odd Thomas says

      Well put — Overrun. It reminds me of gamblers who are on a losing streak and get lost. That there’s such a thing as a “streak” eludes them. That they been losing consistently – just a fluke. That they’re almost broke — all it takes is one big win. They feel so close to something they’ve been yearning for, they’ve lost sight of the fact, that a win, just isn’t likely when so much is going wrong.

      I think people in the RCS have to actually go through the process of unmocking their previous wins and gains, to make room for these “new wins.” You have to admit to yourself, you didn’t get what you thought you did, because it’s here now.

      If that isn’t suppressive, I don’t know what is.


  32. NoEyeDeer says

    Yes overrinincalif – it is hard to confront that one has had his or her head up his or her “arse” for the better part of his or her adult life as is the case with so many church die hards. But admitting that you had it wrong is the first step to rising from the ashes.

    • Jane Doe says

      We should make our own Indie Self Help Group with 12 steps and all (just like AA). And step 1 would be Recognition that you had it wrong and had yoru head up your “arse” for the better part of your adult life.

  33. Rory Medford says

    Scientology has one goal and that is to try and extract as much money they can with each member until they go dead broke, are dead or the person waves the white flag and says no mas. Then they are off to their next victim, next cycle, next sucker!!!! So people who are reading this and still IN the fold, hold on to your wallets, credit cards, homes, cars, kids because they will try and suck you dry until you are no longer of any use to this cult!!!
    Run for the hills and make sure you for sure don’t get cornered or suckered into another reg cycle by the crazy regges of SCN!!! Your future and your spirit depends on you staying far far away from this crazy cult they call Scientology.

    • Jane Doe says

      Hold on to your kids most of all! Don’t let the bastards recruit them for staff or SO. They prey on the Scn schools and those schools are just the breeding ground and they groom the kids for SO and staff. And they black PR the idea of going to college and getting a degree because being on staff is so much more “on purpose” and “worthwhile.” Mabye in the old days before DM took over, but not now. “Mama don’t let your babies grow up to be cowboys or Scientologists.” No slight intended to cowboys… it’s just the line of a good song.

  34. Joe Pendleton says

    And Dede’s power of self still needed to return and emerge after almost 40 years of being an OT and being at the top of the Grade Chart??????

  35. KFrancis says

    ThetaPotata you may be on to something. In the Catholic Church we wore scapulars around our necks (not everyone of course) which often carried the picture of the Virgin Mary.It was made of cloth and was a bit large than a postage stamp.

    Dave could steal this idea, give the Virgin Mary the boot and place his own likeness on these. The scapular has fallen out of fashion so the church could resurrect (pardon the pun) these and create new income stream while paying homage to DM at the same time.


    1. A badge worn by affiliates of certain religious orders, consisting of two pieces of cloth joined by shoulder bands and worn under the clothing on the chest and back.

    • says

      I actually used to work with these Rajneesh guys who’s spiritual lead was the Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh. They all wore his picture in a bead necklace. They were actually really hard working guys who seemed quite enlightened. In some ways there was some similarities to what happened to the C of S. The Bhagwan moved off the line and there was a power struggle. Many of the members were dissatisfied with the new management and the organization soon crumbled. The Bhagwan was deported from the U.S. and died in India a few years later. Too bad we can’t get Miscavige deported to Antarctica or maybe the Sith home world.

  36. NoEyeDeer says

    Ha ha Jane Doe. But sadly it is true. After spending many years as a die hard, I had to admit to myself that my “church” was a crock of shit and that I was going nowhere spiritually. It is never too late to jump ship and I now enjoy a beautiful life.

    • Jane Doe says

      Thank you NoEyeDeer. I look forward to meeting you and the others. I’ll have a coming out story in a month or two.

  37. says

    I knew Dede and Drew years ago and to hear them tell it, their life was already perfect. I am embarrassed to admit I was taken in by their BS. Oh well

    • Jane Doe says

      You weren’t the only one taken in by their BS. So was I. Drew is still a good guy, although misguided and ignorant. They have swallowed every KA that came down the pike. When the church took away or changed commission structure of how FSM’s are paid, Drew told me that 70% of his income disappeared overnight. I asked why he didn’t fight it cuz it was obviously not what LRH wrote on how FSM’s were to be paid. He said he just went and created more income and acted like it was not that big a deal. Now we hear just how fucked up their lives were as OT VIII’s and Class VIII in Drew’s case, via their “Success Stories.” Amazing that they have to admit that they weren’t doing that well, or maybe they just lied and made up the over the top success stories as a reg come-on to get more people to FSM and reg. I hope one day Drew sees the light and leaves the church.

  38. says

    Yes, of course. Her last last name I knew was Kemper. Of course they split when Steve left. Yes, she is a sweet heart as was Griffy. Both C/Ses. Griffy left with GAT1 and died shortly thereafter. Paige is likely still there.

    • WhatWall says

      Pumpkin, Thank you for the update on Paige. It saddens me to think that she is still in. I hope she is getting adequate food & rest and is not under much stress. She was Qual Sec in the Pac Estates Org (known as CESO back then) before AOLA. She was pretty much the only hope that CESO staff had for any personal enhancement, medical care or compassion of any kind.

  39. Pepper says

    Roy and WhatWall,

    I agree with your points and feel the same way. I think Drew and Dede have been in this mindset for a long time now. I met them 10 years ago, and found them to be Very Serious and Not Fun.

    I only met them once, so maybe it’s not fair to base it all on one meeting. This was at a dinner party and there were about 10 people there. Drew and Dede did nothing but talk about Scientology the WHOLE evening, particulay about themselves and what they have done.

    They didn’t show interest in anyone else there, certainly didn’t flow it anyway.

    Drew went on to inquire about other Scientologists as to “what are they contributing now?” meaning more about activity, not money.

    He then dissed Liz Bayback for being “just a housewife”, who’s “raising a couple of boys”. I don’t know Liz personally, but thought to myself: what did Liz Bayback ever do to him?

    Maybe it’s just sour grapes. Liz is wealthy and doesn’t have to work. But if any woman wants to be a housewife, why is it anyone else’s business? It’s her choice in life.

    Fast forward to about six months later at the next event at the PAC base parking lot. Liz Bayback gets an “OT Award” for her work at CC getting people on the Bridge and to Flag. When that “just a housewife” went up on stage I laughed to myself and thought, Good for you, Liz! I couldn’t help but think what Drew must be thinking now. Drew, your plate is crow is ready.

    • Hallie Jane says

      Yeah creating a nice home for a family and responsibly raising children is such a waste of time. She could be regging for idle orgs and the ias to save the planet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Except for the children of course because they’re not important. grrrrrrrrrrrr