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	Comments on: Clearwater Politicians Weigh In	</title>
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	<description>Something Can Be Done About It</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 24 Oct 2019 20:13:54 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Chee Chalker		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305910</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chee Chalker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Oct 2019 20:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305452&quot;&gt;Wynski&lt;/a&gt;.

I agree 100%
IMO, most people have a &#039;Schoolhouse Rock&#039; knowledge about not only the Constitution, but also the legal system in general
I was fortunate enough to go to law school.   We had one full year of Constitutional Law (Con Law I and Con Law II - very creative class titles there!)

Reading the Constitution is interesting and reading ancillary writings (Federalist Papers) helps to understanding some of the reasoning.

The challenging part is reading court cases that further define/interpret what the Constitution means - that is where the fun starts!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305452">Wynski</a>.</p>
<p>I agree 100%<br />
IMO, most people have a &#8216;Schoolhouse Rock&#8217; knowledge about not only the Constitution, but also the legal system in general<br />
I was fortunate enough to go to law school.   We had one full year of Constitutional Law (Con Law I and Con Law II &#8211; very creative class titles there!)</p>
<p>Reading the Constitution is interesting and reading ancillary writings (Federalist Papers) helps to understanding some of the reasoning.</p>
<p>The challenging part is reading court cases that further define/interpret what the Constitution means &#8211; that is where the fun starts!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Annie Oakley		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305602</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Annie Oakley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Oct 2019 14:24:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305602</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305388&quot;&gt;Chee Chalker&lt;/a&gt;.

Well-said!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305388">Chee Chalker</a>.</p>
<p>Well-said!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Skyler		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305588</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Skyler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Oct 2019 12:54:55 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305452&quot;&gt;Wynski&lt;/a&gt;.

The U.S. Constitution is also a real miracle. I cannot understand how a small group of people (maybe even only a handful of people) were able to create such a profound document in such a short period of time.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305452">Wynski</a>.</p>
<p>The U.S. Constitution is also a real miracle. I cannot understand how a small group of people (maybe even only a handful of people) were able to create such a profound document in such a short period of time.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Alice Thomas		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305474</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Alice Thomas]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 21:22:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305474</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[How can you know for sure if a business on Cleveland St. is not owned or operated by a Scientologist? What about Clear Sky and other restaurants and coffee shops.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How can you know for sure if a business on Cleveland St. is not owned or operated by a Scientologist? What about Clear Sky and other restaurants and coffee shops.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Wynski		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305452</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Wynski]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 19:12:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305452</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305388&quot;&gt;Chee Chalker&lt;/a&gt;.

Chee, MOST people are completely clueless about the US Constitution.  It is a SIMPLE  document. BUT, it DOES take a reading comprehension level of a schooled adult .. of the 18th century USA/UK.  Only about 5% of people today can read at that level and understand the definitions of the words as they were at that time.

Most atty&#039;s these days have NOT been through a lass that actually studies the Constitution as written.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305388">Chee Chalker</a>.</p>
<p>Chee, MOST people are completely clueless about the US Constitution.  It is a SIMPLE  document. BUT, it DOES take a reading comprehension level of a schooled adult .. of the 18th century USA/UK.  Only about 5% of people today can read at that level and understand the definitions of the words as they were at that time.</p>
<p>Most atty&#8217;s these days have NOT been through a lass that actually studies the Constitution as written.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Chee Chalker		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305388</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chee Chalker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 11:27:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305388</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305308&quot;&gt;jere Lull (39 years recovering)&lt;/a&gt;.

There is a lot of confusion about the purpose of Establishment Clause.
It was simply to prevent the government from establishing any kind of “state” religion (ie Church of England) - as you said, a theocracy.
However, not establishing a state religion is much different than freedom from religion.
The founders didn’t want freedom from religion -  just the opposite.  They wanted to ensure people had the freedom to practice any religion or none at all.   
IMO, banning religion is just as bad as enforcing a state religion because in both cases, there is no freedom of choice.

Just as other charities have exempt status under 501 (c)(3) Rules, so do religions who do actual charitable work. 
Just think about all the hospitals out there that were founded by certain religions (here in 
Chicago, for example, we have Presbyterian St Luke’s (now called Rush), Lutheran General, any one of the Catholic “St hospitals”, etc etc. 

There are many many genuine religious based charities who need tax exempt status to survive.   As I’m sure you know, the reasoning behind tax exempt status is that the charities alleviate some of the financial burden on all of us - the taxpayers.  
Because if those charities weren’t doing the work, guess who would pay for it?  
The problem is not in giving tax exempt status to genuine charitable organizations.  It’s giving abusive cults 501(c)(3) status and not monitoring them properly.

Can’t throw away the baby with the bathwater.
One bad apple don’t spoil the whole bunch girl.

Hmmm, can’t think of any other cliches at the moment, but you get the idea.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305308">jere Lull (39 years recovering)</a>.</p>
<p>There is a lot of confusion about the purpose of Establishment Clause.<br />
It was simply to prevent the government from establishing any kind of “state” religion (ie Church of England) &#8211; as you said, a theocracy.<br />
However, not establishing a state religion is much different than freedom from religion.<br />
The founders didn’t want freedom from religion &#8211;  just the opposite.  They wanted to ensure people had the freedom to practice any religion or none at all.<br />
IMO, banning religion is just as bad as enforcing a state religion because in both cases, there is no freedom of choice.</p>
<p>Just as other charities have exempt status under 501 (c)(3) Rules, so do religions who do actual charitable work.<br />
Just think about all the hospitals out there that were founded by certain religions (here in<br />
Chicago, for example, we have Presbyterian St Luke’s (now called Rush), Lutheran General, any one of the Catholic “St hospitals”, etc etc. </p>
<p>There are many many genuine religious based charities who need tax exempt status to survive.   As I’m sure you know, the reasoning behind tax exempt status is that the charities alleviate some of the financial burden on all of us &#8211; the taxpayers.<br />
Because if those charities weren’t doing the work, guess who would pay for it?<br />
The problem is not in giving tax exempt status to genuine charitable organizations.  It’s giving abusive cults 501(c)(3) status and not monitoring them properly.</p>
<p>Can’t throw away the baby with the bathwater.<br />
One bad apple don’t spoil the whole bunch girl.</p>
<p>Hmmm, can’t think of any other cliches at the moment, but you get the idea.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Provenzano		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305338</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Provenzano]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 05:53:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305338</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305313&quot;&gt;Mary Kahn&lt;/a&gt;.

Thanks for clarifying. I am sure the money came from him.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305313">Mary Kahn</a>.</p>
<p>Thanks for clarifying. I am sure the money came from him.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aquamarine		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305333</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aquamarine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 04:58:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305333</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305308&quot;&gt;jere Lull (39 years recovering)&lt;/a&gt;.

I think what occurred in Clearwater over the decades since the 70s when the cult bought the first building and with them taking over more and more ever since  could have occurred in any of thousands of economically vulnerable,  small American cities.  The cult chose Clearwater because of the name, I read somewhere. And the climate, maybe?  And the price was right?   But for whatever reason LRH chose CW, what happened there could have happened elsewhere.  I think its too late for Clearwater now - the toxic waste has spilled; it can only be contained.  But to prevent the same takeover occurring elsewhere, the economic vulnerability of the targeted town or area has to be addressed and handled, I would think.  Look, you don&#039;t see the Dwarf gobbling  up property in prosperous cities and suburbs.  He goes for economically depressed areas.  This is no slur on Clearwater, please.  Before becoming a Scientologist I was there briefly in the early 80s visiting family friends. They took us to the beach - what a fabulous, pristine beach!  Pure blue-green water, endless soft, clean white sand - wow!  What resort area potential.  Back then I wondered why it wasn&#039;t packed with hotels, teeming with vacationers.  The town was quiet - very quiet, back then.  I&#039;m thinking, somehow, Clearwater was very vulnerable to this type of take-over.  Someone who knows the area please feel free to jump in here and add to this, or whatever, correct me if/as necessary.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305308">jere Lull (39 years recovering)</a>.</p>
<p>I think what occurred in Clearwater over the decades since the 70s when the cult bought the first building and with them taking over more and more ever since  could have occurred in any of thousands of economically vulnerable,  small American cities.  The cult chose Clearwater because of the name, I read somewhere. And the climate, maybe?  And the price was right?   But for whatever reason LRH chose CW, what happened there could have happened elsewhere.  I think its too late for Clearwater now &#8211; the toxic waste has spilled; it can only be contained.  But to prevent the same takeover occurring elsewhere, the economic vulnerability of the targeted town or area has to be addressed and handled, I would think.  Look, you don&#8217;t see the Dwarf gobbling  up property in prosperous cities and suburbs.  He goes for economically depressed areas.  This is no slur on Clearwater, please.  Before becoming a Scientologist I was there briefly in the early 80s visiting family friends. They took us to the beach &#8211; what a fabulous, pristine beach!  Pure blue-green water, endless soft, clean white sand &#8211; wow!  What resort area potential.  Back then I wondered why it wasn&#8217;t packed with hotels, teeming with vacationers.  The town was quiet &#8211; very quiet, back then.  I&#8217;m thinking, somehow, Clearwater was very vulnerable to this type of take-over.  Someone who knows the area please feel free to jump in here and add to this, or whatever, correct me if/as necessary.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mary Kahn		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305313</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mary Kahn]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 00:48:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305313</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305292&quot;&gt;Tom Provenzano&lt;/a&gt;.

Her husband, Norm, is part owner of a multimillion dollar company located in Palm Harbor.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305292">Tom Provenzano</a>.</p>
<p>Her husband, Norm, is part owner of a multimillion dollar company located in Palm Harbor.</p>
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		<title>
		By: jere Lull (39 years recovering)		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305308</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jere Lull (39 years recovering)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Oct 2019 00:08:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2230041#comment-305308</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305221&quot;&gt;Mary Kahn&lt;/a&gt;.

IMO, the IRS 501c(3) exemptions violate the establishment clause of the first Amendment: &quot;Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, ....&quot;

Strictly speaking, that is what should give us freedom FROM religion; ensuring that we don&#039;t devolve into some sort of theocracy.

I had a nightmare a while back, imagining what life would be like if scientology DID take over some country somehow.  It was bad enough in the Sea Org; imagine if Dwarfenführer&#039;s whim could sentence anyone to a work-detail prison like the RPF.... 

SORRY if I just gave anyone else nightmare material.

 Just keep remembering: It&#039;s ALL a dream, it&#039;s just a dream.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/clearwater-politicians-weigh-in/#comment-305221">Mary Kahn</a>.</p>
<p>IMO, the IRS 501c(3) exemptions violate the establishment clause of the first Amendment: &#8220;Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, &#8230;.&#8221;</p>
<p>Strictly speaking, that is what should give us freedom FROM religion; ensuring that we don&#8217;t devolve into some sort of theocracy.</p>
<p>I had a nightmare a while back, imagining what life would be like if scientology DID take over some country somehow.  It was bad enough in the Sea Org; imagine if Dwarfenführer&#8217;s whim could sentence anyone to a work-detail prison like the RPF&#8230;. </p>
<p>SORRY if I just gave anyone else nightmare material.</p>
<p> Just keep remembering: It&#8217;s ALL a dream, it&#8217;s just a dream.</p>
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