This week, Leah and I had a wonderful time talking with my old and very dear friend Marc Headley —The BFG — on our Fair Game Podcast.
Marc not only has a phenomenal memory, he possesses a great sense of humor. Anyone who has read his book knows both of these things to be true. We covered plenty of ground — talking about the Int base and David Miscavige, the infamous musical chairs incident depicted in Going Clear and even how the Rinder bobblehead came to be. Throughout I mentioned including links, you will find them below.
This is definitely an episode you don’t want to miss.
First, here is his brilliant book, Blown for Good. If you have not yet read it, it is an absolute must.
This is The Aftermath episode where Leah and I went to Denver to see Marc and his wife Claire (and had the run-in with the PI’s) Season 1 Episode 5 Golden Era:
And we also spoke to Marc and Claire in this episode — Season 3 Episode 8 Gilman Springs Road:
Below are items available at the SP Shop — the proceeds go to benefit The Aftermath Foundation
The SP Bracelet:
Going Clear film by Alex Gibney on HBO
Marc and I heading to Sundance for the premiere of Going Clear in January 2015:
And some bonus material:
Marc shows off his SP bracelet while we were recording the podcast:
And his Rinder bobblehead:
Alicia RT says
Loved this last episode..and I’m holding out for a Leah bobblehead! I have faith in you Marc lol.
I do actually have a question. I was thinking of how insane it is that scientology infiltrated the government and if they can do that, how can you trust anyone? How do you know if the lawyer you paid to sue scientology isn’t actually one themselves and purposefully lose in court? Is there some sort of screening process you do when meeting someone? Okay I have a lot of questions lol.
I wanted to say Thanks to you and Leah for having Marc as your guest this week. It was, as usual, an excellent podcast. Marc has an animated/genuine way of communication. Basically, he’s a kick in the ass! Lol! I remember reading his book ‘Blown For Good’ a couple of years ago. It’s an awesome read. The ‘F’ bomb went through my mind too many times to count.
After listening to this I’ve decided to read it again.(I got the book back after loaning it to my cousin to read.) Thanks to Marc too for a fun filled hour. : )
Mike, pls excuse me if this turns out to be a duplicate post. I made this post before but cannot find any record of it. There is no message, “Your post is awaiting moderation.” So I can’t be certain that it was posted either before or after you got a chance to moderate it. Anyway, here it is:
I just listened to the podcast and I’d like to make a few comments.
At one point there was a discussion about, “who has done more to help the Aftermath Foundation”. Leah made the point that everyone who has done anything to help has done something important and valuable. I think that is an important way to view this issue and I would fully agree. If we all do whatever we can – regardless of how much or how little – we will be doing something important and valuable.
There was also a brief discussion about how this criminal cult can be brought down and what the best way would be to ensure we could terminate this terrible horror. Someone made the point that the best and maybe the only way to bring about the end of this cult is to keep on talking about all the horrors, abuses and atrocities that have been perpetrated by the cult. The more info that is put into the public domain, the more people will understand and will spread the word that whenever someone is interested in this cult, they should avoid it like the plague. There are many other expressions that describe what people should do – such as they should turn tail and run as fast as they can to avoid having anything to do with this cult.
So even if we cannot put an end to the cult, we can arrange for less and less people to get involved and in the end, that would be almost as good as terminating the whole rotten mess.
I found both of those discussions to be quite valuable.
Oops … as Stannis Baratheon would correct me …. it’s not “less and less people”. The proper usage is “fewer and fewer people”. I knew that looked wrong as soon as I wrote that but I just could not remember who it was that corrected that usage. Thank you Stannis!
O/T and quite frankly my version of Kremlinology, but I like to keep track of the status of Scientologists in the Nation of Islam.
I previously noted that Nation of Islam Minister Louis Farrakhan referred to Scientology Youth for Human Rights Award Winner NOI Brother Rizza Islam as “Dr. Rizza Islam,” awarding him with an honorary doctorate issued by the NOI.
Minister Farrakhan has now named Scientology Freedom Medal Winner NOI Minister Abdul Malik Sayyid Muhammad (aka Tony Muhammad) “Dr. Abdul Malik Sayyid Muhammad,” similarly awarding him with an honorary doctorate issued by the NOI.
This type of thing is significant in the Nation of Islam.
In addition to winning the Scientology Freedom Medal, Minister Abdul Malik Sayyid Muhammad (aka Tony Muhammad) is Clear, a Super Power Completion, and a Class 4 Auditor.
Memorialized with screenshots on ESMBR at:
Rev. Louie says Dr. Rizza would be a good minister because he’s good looking and well spoken. Dr. Tony is well on his way to becoming an “OM”, Operating Muslim.
Tom Griffiths says
Looking forward to this latest instalment, as I am every week. As an Australian living in Norway, Mike, I am having trouble accessing your and Leah’s ‘Scientology: The Aftermath’ series. I managed to purchase series 1 on my Australian iTunes account, but can’t find series 2 or 3 in any accessible formats here. Happy to purchase them properly via whatever platform. Any tips?
I came across this whole phenomenon incidentally, listening to Louis Theroux’s podcast interview with Leah (who I had never heard of), and then got onto your blog, series 1 of the TV shows, read Leah’s book, and caught up on the Fair Game podcasts. I’m not sure what the fascination is, other than to see some form of justice prevail for the many victims, leaders held accountable, and proper regulation (and end of the tax exemption, etc) of whatever remains.
PS. Years ago in Australia I had a student enrolled in a Masters course I was teaching in an Education Faculty, who was working in a Scientology school, and recall how weird the submitted assignment work was, LRH was almost the only reference cited, and strange stuff about learning to read.
TT Greco says
try this it’s almost no cost at all
enroll and download the episodes you want
Tom Griffiths says
Thanks, but it would be nice to buy the series, with (hopefully) some of the money making its way to the makers of the program?! What about dvd’s (or a digital download version) via the SP shop!
Oat Tee Ate says
Marc Headley’s book blew my mind. It was the first book I read when I decided to once and for all get out of doubt. It helped me make the decision to blow for good too. Thanks Marc. You are awesome.
I love the podcasts Mike Rinder is doing. Please continue. They are so helpful for me to understand what happened to me in this evil cult.
The more you talk, Mike, you seem to be turning back into a compassionate Homo Sap. I mean that with love and kindness. You are so sincere and real. It helps me have faith that I too will shed myself of this horrible personaility implanted into me by Scientology and L Ron Hubbard’s tech. Yuck… it is a disgusting and a disingenous way to be.
One thing I am noticing as I reflect on the Scientology personality is how Scientology training indoctrinated me into being very manipulative. I thought this was super powers but it was just learning to be a con man too. Just un fricken believeable how insidous and covert the training is. I thought it was super powers I obtained by doing Scientology. It really is a personality you assume – a cult personality and at least for me, I felt I was above all other homo saps out there. cringe – cringe – cringe.
I am sorry to all of those people I hurt when I was a cult member of Scientology and even when I got out. I was a monster. I feel very bad about the things I did to people. Members who were trying.
Thanks for all you do Mike Rinder. You are my hero forever.
Oat Tee Ate – “I felt I was above all other homo saps out there.”
Even though I was far less indoctrinated and programmed than many other people, I still carried asense of superiority, the idea that I knew things other people couldn’t know. I guess it goes with the territory of being in a cult or fundamentalist religion.
Even after I blew and decided I had been in a cult a bit of that sense of superiority continued. A touch of ego? I think it’s all now gone – haha
amber miranda says
i just wonna ask are you ok.. ive never been involved but if u wonna talk im here
I loved Marc’s book. I also love everything that Mike does for us outer bankers.And Leah. Everyone please keep up all the hard work you do . Thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Radiantly happy faces – so different from the robotic scientology plastered on smiles.
Jerry Hack says
If you have not seen Marc’s interview with Patrick Bet-David on YouTube I highly recommend it. It’s one of the best interviews I have seen bar none. Looking forward to the podcast. Since I am on the west coast I get to hear it tonight. Nyah Nyah.
Even as a “Never In”….nothing gives me GREATER JOY & LAUGHTER than to think how ALL of you who have escaped/left/blown & found a new, fulfilling, & HAPPIER LIFE on the outside than you ever had or would have when you were still a part of this FIASCO.
David M must go to his “sleeping chamber” pacing the floor large glass of booze in hand since it’s the only way he can get some sleep…..imagine him, every night trying to figure out how he can bad mouth you, punish you, get even with you somehow. It IRKS HIM that you dumped his black hearted ASS without warning & he can never get you back in.
Stay well, stay happy, proper & live the BEST LIFE you can. THAT IS THE SWEESTED REVENGE!!!
Awesome. Ever since the podcast started I’ve been hoping you would have Marc Headley on at some point. Look forward to listening!
Gordon Weir says
Marc Headley is very entertaining and an outstanding story teller. Continued success and happiness to the Headley family.
Dotey OT says
We have a couple clear bracelets locked away. I would gladly take the money from disposing of these and contribute to a caper that promotes broadly in an effort to end scientology.
Get them checked to see if they really are all gold or if it is just gold plate.
TT Greco says
Clear bracelets were never made of gold
This is news to me. What were they made like? I had one that certainly was gold and it looked real. But maybe it was gold plate? Doesn’t surprise me that they’d try to pawn something of as real gold when it wasn’t.
Basically the Oh Tea Ate bracelets are or were 18 carat gold. At the time the 3K bracelet contained about $1250 worth of gold. I melted mine down into two nice rings.
TT Greco says
The gold ones were meant for the OT levels up to 7, the OT8 one was specifically made and sold for 5000$
Rip Van Winkle says
Looking forward to it!
Brainstorm: I’d love to upcycle my 2 clear bracelets. Do we have any silversmiths or metal workers in our various circles?
Send in your clear bracelet and have the S and Double Triangle carved into a big old SP or some such.
….. so many ideas teeming as to what could be etched on that baby.
Ms. B. Haven says
I was never unfortunate enough to earn a ‘clear’ bracelet. I was always a ‘no case gain’ dog ‘pc’ who had lots of auditing but was never able to run out engrams. In fact, I was never able to really find an engram to run. This caused endless frustration for myself and my poor ‘auditors’. Gawd knows we all tried our damnedest.
What to do with worthless ‘clear’ bracelets reminds me of a pure silver scientology cross neckless I acquired early on. I bought it from a student in the academy who was an old hippie silversmith/jeweler. He was trying to earn a few bucks. That turned out to be a big NO, NO. Why? Money he made thru his own sweat and labor wasn’t going into the cult coffers so that was regarded as some sort of financial crime. Fortunately for him, that was his incentive to bail out of Cultsville and take his wooden case Mark V meter with him. Unfortunately for me I didn’t catch a clue when that red flag flew and it would be another decade before I finally wised up and blew for good. Sometimes I’m a slow learner. But I do learn. One day I’ll sell my silver cult cross to someone to melt down and make something worthy of wearing without being embarrassed.
Rip Van Winkle says
LOCAL CULT JEWELRY. YES!!!
I’d forgotten about that. We had some real artists making some nice stuff.
All monies must flow to L. Ron Allah
George M White says
After the Maiden Voyage in 1988, Miscavige promised to totally fix OT VII and OT VII. He wrote that famous BS article in thirty six pages which was nonsense. Although I was already out, I remember the intense pressure on OT VII friends of mine to complete the level. I I remember correctly, some of them did solo auditing for seven or more years. Well, everyone knew the outcome, Miscavige’s changes produced nothing. OT VIII was watered down to just another level. When Mark left in 2005, the pressure by failure Miscavige must have been great. This was the second death blow to Scientology. The third came with the Aftermath.
Tory Christman says
What was the first, that you consider? 2008 when Anonymous and many ex’s/ Mark & family took on $cientology? I met Mark at the 1st picket of 9,000 people, in every major city. “Hi Magoo…I’m Mark Headley/BlownforGood”– I’ll never forget that!
Of course many ex-scios & critics had worked world wide to expose $cientology’s abuses, for years before Anonymous arrived.
I think of Gerry Armstrong as ~the~ first. What do you think? My best to all! Tory/ Magoo
George M White says
The first death blow to Scientology, in my opinion, was the Maiden Voyage disaster. If I remember, there were several deaths a few months after. Lynn Irons’ wife got very very sick. Do not know if she recovered. My FSM was dead of cancer in less than a year.
O/T. Louis Farrakhan says Rizza Islam is excellent as a potential great Minister in the Nation of Islam.
The Nation of Islam Saviours’ Day Keynote Address yesterday, 2/28/21, was delivered by NOI Minister Ishmael Muhammad. Minister Louis Farrakhan came out to speak at the conclusion of Minister Ishmael’s message.
Minister Farrakhan praised Brother Rizza Islam’s lecture on the Covid-19 vaccine and said:
“Brother Rizza… is excellent as a potential great Minister of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad.”
See the video of the address at 3:23:30:
This was Minister Farrakhan’s way of saying that Brother Rizza is excellent as a potential great Minister in the Nation of Islam. For Minister Farrakhan to say that at the conclusion of the Saviours’ Day Keynote Address was a huge honor. Every member of the NOI will watch this video. Every member of the NOI will know about Minister Farrakhan’s praise for Brother Rizza.
To recap some recent NOI news:
— Brother Rizza was selected as a presenter for the NOI Saviours’ Day 2/27/21 Plenary Session “COVID-19 — The Virus and the Vaccine.”
— During the 2/27/21 Plenary Session, Minister Farrakhan referred to Brother Rizza as “Dr. Rizza Islam,” awarding Brother Rizza an honorary doctorate.
— At the conclusion of the 2/28/21 Keynote Address, Minister Farrakhan said that Brother Rizza “is excellent as a potential great Minister of the Honorable Elijah Muhammad” — i.e., is excellent as a potential great Minister in the Nation of Islam.
This is relevant to Scientology because Rizza Islam is a Scientologist, a Scientology Youth For Human Rights Award Winner, a former International Ambassador for the Scientology front-group World Literacy Crusade, and a former Director of Museum Promotions for the Scientology front-group Citizens Commission on Human Rights (CCHR).
The fact that the keynote address itself was delivered by Minister Ishmael is also important for the following reasons.
Earlier, Minister Ishmael participated in the 2/26/21 seminar on Disaster Preparedness. At 2:03:14 in the video of part one of the seminar, he makes a point of promoting Dianetics:
Minister Ishmael’s statement promoting Dianetics is significant given the fact that he was selected by Minister Farrakhan to deliver the keynote address. Minister Ishmael is the National Assistant Minister to Minister Farrakhan and the Minister at Mosque Maryam, the headquarters of the NOI. A 2011 New York Times story states that Minister Ishmael “is sometimes considered the most likely successor” to Minister Farrakhan. Finally, the video of the keynote address shows that Minister Farrakhan appears to be in poor health. Minister Farrakhan’s poor health seems to be confirmed by the fact that this is the first time that he hasn’t delivered the keynote address in the 40 years that he has led the Nation of Islam.
Bottom.line: The Nation of Islam may soon be led by a Minister, Ishmael Muhammad, who recently promoted Dianeticts.
Scientology Youth for Human Rights Award Winner Nation of Islam Brother Rizza Islam has now posted Twitter and Instagram video of Minister Louis Farrakhan speaking about him:
George M White says
This is a great development. The more NOI Ministers in Scientology the better. Some of them are using Dianetics in an effort to repair the Black Family. NOT Ministers have not been in the streets in East Tampa in two weeks. When Farrakhan passes, the activity will start. I hope Islam unites to get rid of Miscavige.
If we give Scientology to NOI, it might satisfy their policy for reparations.
Mike, do you have any update on Rizza Islam and his mom going to court to be tried for the massive insurance fraud where they bilked millions of dollars illegally? Jeff Augustine reported on some of the early stuff. Any update for us on what’s happening on their trial etc?
Mike Rinder says
Ortega keeps track of all the ongoing legal cases. It’s on his blog.
Under the heading “Full Court Press: What we’re watching at the Underground Bunker,” Tony Ortega reports on his blog:
— Hanan and Rizza Islam and other family members, Medi-Cal fraud: Trial scheduled for May 20 in Los Angeles
George M White says
Hopefully, Scientology can settle this lawsuit out of Court and pay the initiators a large sum of money. Then it will be possible to get more NOI ministers into Scientology.
Ms. B. Haven says
George, giving someone the “gift” of scientology would be like passing them a blanket full of smallpox virus like conquistadors did when they came to the Americas to pillage and plunder. That’s no gift at all despite it’s touted appearances. If someone needs some sort of reparations, they should probably be able to choose what would work best for them.
George M White says
I did not mean to imply I was giving the gift of Scientology. What I meant to say is that the average Black NOI Minister could lift Miscavige by the throat with one hand.
Rather than taking over the CofS if the NOI ever get enough trained people they might start up their own squirrel groups.
The First Independent Nation of Islam Scientology Mosque
George M White says
entirely possible because Miscavige will try to crush the NOI Ministers.
Mary Kahn says
Oh Goodie. Marc is a wealth of information on all things scientology. I cannot wait to hear not only what he has to say but also the way he will say it. I know I can count on a good laugh.