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	<title>
	Comments on: L. Ron Hubbard: Messiah or Hypnotic Operator?	</title>
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	<description>Something Can Be Done About It</description>
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		<title>
		By: Brian Thomas Lambert		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-607554</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brian Thomas Lambert]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2025 15:41:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-607554</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-307901&quot;&gt;source&lt;/a&gt;.

Thank you for demonstrating the confusion technique of mind control.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-307901">source</a>.</p>
<p>Thank you for demonstrating the confusion technique of mind control.</p>
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		<title>
		By: source		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-307901</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[source]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Nov 2019 23:14:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-307901</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I used to be encouraged this site as a result of my own nephew. I&#039;m don&#039;t selected if it put up is definitely authored by methods of your ex seeing that nobody comprehend like highly accurate approximately my own dilemma.. beginner French You are amazing! Thanks a lot!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I used to be encouraged this site as a result of my own nephew. I&#8217;m don&#8217;t selected if it put up is definitely authored by methods of your ex seeing that nobody comprehend like highly accurate approximately my own dilemma.. beginner French You are amazing! Thanks a lot!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sheila M Huber		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-216692</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sheila M Huber]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Apr 2018 22:04:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-216692</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Terrific, Brian.  Spot on.  It gives me the willies reading this, and I agree with you that Hubbard did this to control others and it was extremely effective.It kind of freaks me out reading this, to realize it was basically that simple, but I see it all the time online, too.  Marty Rathbun did this on his blog, writing in a convoluted mess and using as many large words as he could (usually incorrectly), taking simple concepts and making them sound intricate and difficult.  He would endlessly claim he was present and personally knows about this or that, but only say so much, never give the details.  He even claimed on one of his tapes that he knew personally about an event that happened before he was in the Sea Org.  

Then Marty&#039;s followers would gush and praise him for being so smart, and Marty would tell them how they were smart, too, for seeing things that only they could see.  GAG!

So Hubbardesque.

There are many, many pretend authorities all over the Internet, there are even more followers who believe in these authorities for this or that.  Just talk in that weird, obscure fashion with absolute confidence and authority in the 3rd person (even when you have no idea what you&#039;re talking about) and BINGO! 

Very good article. Thanks.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Terrific, Brian.  Spot on.  It gives me the willies reading this, and I agree with you that Hubbard did this to control others and it was extremely effective.It kind of freaks me out reading this, to realize it was basically that simple, but I see it all the time online, too.  Marty Rathbun did this on his blog, writing in a convoluted mess and using as many large words as he could (usually incorrectly), taking simple concepts and making them sound intricate and difficult.  He would endlessly claim he was present and personally knows about this or that, but only say so much, never give the details.  He even claimed on one of his tapes that he knew personally about an event that happened before he was in the Sea Org.  </p>
<p>Then Marty&#8217;s followers would gush and praise him for being so smart, and Marty would tell them how they were smart, too, for seeing things that only they could see.  GAG!</p>
<p>So Hubbardesque.</p>
<p>There are many, many pretend authorities all over the Internet, there are even more followers who believe in these authorities for this or that.  Just talk in that weird, obscure fashion with absolute confidence and authority in the 3rd person (even when you have no idea what you&#8217;re talking about) and BINGO! </p>
<p>Very good article. Thanks.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Gene Trujillo		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-204666</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gene Trujillo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Dec 2017 23:46:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-204666</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174010&quot;&gt;Brian&lt;/a&gt;.

As far as I am concerned Jon Atack is the first to have peer reviewed Hubbard&#039;s complete works and is the first to show some of his tricks, for which we should all be grateful.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174010">Brian</a>.</p>
<p>As far as I am concerned Jon Atack is the first to have peer reviewed Hubbard&#8217;s complete works and is the first to show some of his tricks, for which we should all be grateful.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Gene Trujillo		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-204665</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gene Trujillo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Dec 2017 23:44:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-204665</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174203&quot;&gt;PeaceMaker&lt;/a&gt;.

Blavatsky was mentioned above. The Nazi&#039;s studied Theosophy and apparently got some of their ideas from Blavatsky, including use of the swastika iirc and some of the racial ideas.

Hubbard has talked about studying Rosicruciansim, and I believe the Rosicrucianists have acknowledge he took a certain number of lower level courses. I have not heard any such thing regarding Hubbard and Blavatsky, but it would not be surprising if he studied her and/or Hitler and just didn&#039;t mention it.

We here all know that just a bit prior to founding Dianetics Hubbard was doing Babylonian sex magick with Parsons designed to manifest the goddess and bring about matriarchy. Instead, it manifested Hubbard (apparently by &quot;channeling&quot; an aspect of the goddess Hathor who he described as a naked red haired woman wielding a sword) and made him a lot of money at the mere expense of baby killing, the destruction of families, the sacrifice of the lives of his followers...

Prior to that he claims to have had a mystical experience due to nitrous oxide consumption during a dental procedure where he claimed to have died and visited a place where all knowledge was revealed to him momentarily, before he was forced to return to life. DM even made a multimedia presentation about this event in the mid-90s.

So while Hubbard claimed to be a scientist, at least initially, he was actually some sort of revealed mystic, along the lines of a Blavatsky or a Crowley, who apparently channeled Thelema from an aspect of the god Horus, after performing the same ritual that Nibs said that Hubbard performed, the ritual of Abramelin, which is designed to put one in contact with one&#039;s holy guardian angel. 

Interestingly, Robert Anton Wilson also performed that ritual and also claims to have contacted a higher intelligence. It was due to reading him when I was young and his understanding of how conspiracies work that helped me understand what was going on in CofS in terms of information compartmentalization and things like that 

For instance, some of the darker writings that I was told initially had been cancelled and were no longer in use such as the HCO Manual of Justice were actually just locked up in the DSA&#039;s office where the general public couldn&#039;t see them. The DSA assured me that it was in full use. I was shocked. The person who told me that it was cancelled probably didn&#039;t know himself that it was still in use because CofS uses &quot;need to know&quot; data compartmentalization to keep the nasty parts away from all but the most loyal who will go along with crazy viciousness without question or protest, which Scientologists seem prone to doing, unfortunately.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174203">PeaceMaker</a>.</p>
<p>Blavatsky was mentioned above. The Nazi&#8217;s studied Theosophy and apparently got some of their ideas from Blavatsky, including use of the swastika iirc and some of the racial ideas.</p>
<p>Hubbard has talked about studying Rosicruciansim, and I believe the Rosicrucianists have acknowledge he took a certain number of lower level courses. I have not heard any such thing regarding Hubbard and Blavatsky, but it would not be surprising if he studied her and/or Hitler and just didn&#8217;t mention it.</p>
<p>We here all know that just a bit prior to founding Dianetics Hubbard was doing Babylonian sex magick with Parsons designed to manifest the goddess and bring about matriarchy. Instead, it manifested Hubbard (apparently by &#8220;channeling&#8221; an aspect of the goddess Hathor who he described as a naked red haired woman wielding a sword) and made him a lot of money at the mere expense of baby killing, the destruction of families, the sacrifice of the lives of his followers&#8230;</p>
<p>Prior to that he claims to have had a mystical experience due to nitrous oxide consumption during a dental procedure where he claimed to have died and visited a place where all knowledge was revealed to him momentarily, before he was forced to return to life. DM even made a multimedia presentation about this event in the mid-90s.</p>
<p>So while Hubbard claimed to be a scientist, at least initially, he was actually some sort of revealed mystic, along the lines of a Blavatsky or a Crowley, who apparently channeled Thelema from an aspect of the god Horus, after performing the same ritual that Nibs said that Hubbard performed, the ritual of Abramelin, which is designed to put one in contact with one&#8217;s holy guardian angel. </p>
<p>Interestingly, Robert Anton Wilson also performed that ritual and also claims to have contacted a higher intelligence. It was due to reading him when I was young and his understanding of how conspiracies work that helped me understand what was going on in CofS in terms of information compartmentalization and things like that </p>
<p>For instance, some of the darker writings that I was told initially had been cancelled and were no longer in use such as the HCO Manual of Justice were actually just locked up in the DSA&#8217;s office where the general public couldn&#8217;t see them. The DSA assured me that it was in full use. I was shocked. The person who told me that it was cancelled probably didn&#8217;t know himself that it was still in use because CofS uses &#8220;need to know&#8221; data compartmentalization to keep the nasty parts away from all but the most loyal who will go along with crazy viciousness without question or protest, which Scientologists seem prone to doing, unfortunately.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Gene Trujillo		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-204663</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gene Trujillo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Dec 2017 23:16:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-204663</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174009&quot;&gt;James Anglin&lt;/a&gt;.

It&#039;s the altitude backed by force that makes it hypnotic. Altitude backed by force makes one the &quot;pack leader&quot;. The leader has the ability beat up any other member of the pack and determine if they even remain a member of the pack. In a case like that, their teaching is hypnotic. 

If the person doesn&#039;t go along with the authority in CofS, they will have their family destroyed, their business destroyed, possibly kicked out of their home. The person who can do that is hypnotic on the person below them. The person they are abusing has to bend their will to the will of the authority or have their family destroyed or whatever, so they have to rationalize what they are doing as perfectly normal even when it clearly isn&#039;t to someone not under the same duress that they are under.

Even in the Navy I would imagine if you disagreed too hard with an instructor you could find yourself in serious trouble, so Hubbard indeed could have got some of his understanding of how to do this to his followers from his Naval times. However, I think today&#039;s Navy is more civilized than Hubbard and wouldn&#039;t go along with throwing people overboard as a punishment if they ever make a single mistake like Hubbard did to his followers. I would sure hope so, at least.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174009">James Anglin</a>.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s the altitude backed by force that makes it hypnotic. Altitude backed by force makes one the &#8220;pack leader&#8221;. The leader has the ability beat up any other member of the pack and determine if they even remain a member of the pack. In a case like that, their teaching is hypnotic. </p>
<p>If the person doesn&#8217;t go along with the authority in CofS, they will have their family destroyed, their business destroyed, possibly kicked out of their home. The person who can do that is hypnotic on the person below them. The person they are abusing has to bend their will to the will of the authority or have their family destroyed or whatever, so they have to rationalize what they are doing as perfectly normal even when it clearly isn&#8217;t to someone not under the same duress that they are under.</p>
<p>Even in the Navy I would imagine if you disagreed too hard with an instructor you could find yourself in serious trouble, so Hubbard indeed could have got some of his understanding of how to do this to his followers from his Naval times. However, I think today&#8217;s Navy is more civilized than Hubbard and wouldn&#8217;t go along with throwing people overboard as a punishment if they ever make a single mistake like Hubbard did to his followers. I would sure hope so, at least.</p>
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		<title>
		By: PeaceMaker		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174206</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[PeaceMaker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 May 2017 05:25:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-174206</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174049&quot;&gt;Marcel Wenger&lt;/a&gt;.

Marcel, that sounds like the logic that Hubbard and Scientology promotes.  The problem is, that it obfuscates by mis-defining the terms, because Scientology is a complex organization that has multiple technologies, all of which have extended and complex implications to evaluate.

The question isn&#039;t whether Scientology may have delivered one thing that it said it would, but what is the totality of what it did and what that cost. It&#039;s an old trick to give people a little bit that is actually of value, and then use that as a lure to get them into something that in the long run does more harm than good; untrustworthy people from con artists to budding dictators, have used those tricks since time immemorial.

If Scientology really just delivered something good, at a reasonable cost, and did nothing else and cost people nothing more, then it wouldn&#039;t be attacked like it is - and there would certainly be good reason to question the motives of any attackers.  The problem is, that it&#039;s not that simple, or so beneficial.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174049">Marcel Wenger</a>.</p>
<p>Marcel, that sounds like the logic that Hubbard and Scientology promotes.  The problem is, that it obfuscates by mis-defining the terms, because Scientology is a complex organization that has multiple technologies, all of which have extended and complex implications to evaluate.</p>
<p>The question isn&#8217;t whether Scientology may have delivered one thing that it said it would, but what is the totality of what it did and what that cost. It&#8217;s an old trick to give people a little bit that is actually of value, and then use that as a lure to get them into something that in the long run does more harm than good; untrustworthy people from con artists to budding dictators, have used those tricks since time immemorial.</p>
<p>If Scientology really just delivered something good, at a reasonable cost, and did nothing else and cost people nothing more, then it wouldn&#8217;t be attacked like it is &#8211; and there would certainly be good reason to question the motives of any attackers.  The problem is, that it&#8217;s not that simple, or so beneficial.</p>
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		<title>
		By: PeaceMaker		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174203</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[PeaceMaker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 May 2017 03:10:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-174203</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174077&quot;&gt;George M. White&lt;/a&gt;.

George, I want to add here that I think that the problem of Hubbard&#039;s sources is almost exponentially complex.  He got a lot of things through secondary sources like Theosophy, and other more obscure ones that would be hard to figure out, rather than from the original sources themselves - maybe even rarely from the original sources, he may have been too intellectually lazy for that.  I suspect he also picked up bits and pieces at lectures, discussions and cocktail parties, particularly when he was hanging around Jack Parsons&#039; mansion.  Then there is the aspect that is all too easy to forget, of Hubbard&#039;s now-banished early collaborators and contributors, who introduced their own knowledge and perhaps training to an extent that we will never know - and that may be far greater than is obvious.  The more I delve into it, the less I think that Hubbard really came up with himself.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174077">George M. White</a>.</p>
<p>George, I want to add here that I think that the problem of Hubbard&#8217;s sources is almost exponentially complex.  He got a lot of things through secondary sources like Theosophy, and other more obscure ones that would be hard to figure out, rather than from the original sources themselves &#8211; maybe even rarely from the original sources, he may have been too intellectually lazy for that.  I suspect he also picked up bits and pieces at lectures, discussions and cocktail parties, particularly when he was hanging around Jack Parsons&#8217; mansion.  Then there is the aspect that is all too easy to forget, of Hubbard&#8217;s now-banished early collaborators and contributors, who introduced their own knowledge and perhaps training to an extent that we will never know &#8211; and that may be far greater than is obvious.  The more I delve into it, the less I think that Hubbard really came up with himself.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Richard		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174082</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Richard]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 May 2017 18:46:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-174082</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174055&quot;&gt;Richard&lt;/a&gt;.

Process is one of those words with multiple usages. Processing occurs in sausage factories and also in auditing rooms. There are similarities.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174055">Richard</a>.</p>
<p>Process is one of those words with multiple usages. Processing occurs in sausage factories and also in auditing rooms. There are similarities.</p>
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		By: George M. White		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174077</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[George M. White]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 May 2017 18:01:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=33206#comment-174077</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174053&quot;&gt;Brian&lt;/a&gt;.

Hi Brian!
   Yes, bro we are tracking together on this one in regard to an overall pattern that Hubbard had and to his copies of Hitler&#039;s statements.
This pattern of copying and changing the idea to suit his needs is what, IMO, made Hubbard the biggest thief in history.
You are discovering that he copied Hitler.  I have discovered that he copied most of this Theology from Hindu sources and the 19th Century spiritualist movement.  I recently discovered that the word &quot;Cognition&quot; was copied point blank from Rudolph Steiner.
    I never really understood Hubbard until I started to track down his statements to historical sources.   Take, for example, Theta and the Time Track.  All he did was read Occult sources and change the terms.  People always say Crowley.  This is True.  He took tons from Crowley.  But Hubbard stole from everyone who wrote anything.  He just changed the words.  Hubbard at least gave credit to the Veda for some of Scientology.  But this is mostly false.  The Veda had become ritualistic dominated by the high priests.  Hubbard actually stole most of his theology from esoteric Hunduism, Jainism, and Kabballah.  It is impossible to consider Hubbard in any sort of original Buddhist tradition.  You might track Buddha back to esoteric Buddhism but most of this research is subject to questions.  
   IMO, Hubbard was really dumb and ignorant.  He read some material and put together what he thought was a consistent religion.  But Scientology always was just a partial view of Theology.  You can prove this with one simple point.  In his OT VIII theory Hubbard suddenly thinks in 1980 that OT VIII&#039;s should audit the GE.  There are at least fifty religious traditions since the Egyptians who solved that problem earlier.  The fact that it ended Hubbard in a contradiction, proves that he did not have a valid religion.  Then Hubbard claims that he is the synthesis of Eastern and Western religion which is pure nonsense.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/l-ron-hubbard-messiah-or-hypnotic-operator/#comment-174053">Brian</a>.</p>
<p>Hi Brian!<br />
   Yes, bro we are tracking together on this one in regard to an overall pattern that Hubbard had and to his copies of Hitler&#8217;s statements.<br />
This pattern of copying and changing the idea to suit his needs is what, IMO, made Hubbard the biggest thief in history.<br />
You are discovering that he copied Hitler.  I have discovered that he copied most of this Theology from Hindu sources and the 19th Century spiritualist movement.  I recently discovered that the word &#8220;Cognition&#8221; was copied point blank from Rudolph Steiner.<br />
    I never really understood Hubbard until I started to track down his statements to historical sources.   Take, for example, Theta and the Time Track.  All he did was read Occult sources and change the terms.  People always say Crowley.  This is True.  He took tons from Crowley.  But Hubbard stole from everyone who wrote anything.  He just changed the words.  Hubbard at least gave credit to the Veda for some of Scientology.  But this is mostly false.  The Veda had become ritualistic dominated by the high priests.  Hubbard actually stole most of his theology from esoteric Hunduism, Jainism, and Kabballah.  It is impossible to consider Hubbard in any sort of original Buddhist tradition.  You might track Buddha back to esoteric Buddhism but most of this research is subject to questions.<br />
   IMO, Hubbard was really dumb and ignorant.  He read some material and put together what he thought was a consistent religion.  But Scientology always was just a partial view of Theology.  You can prove this with one simple point.  In his OT VIII theory Hubbard suddenly thinks in 1980 that OT VIII&#8217;s should audit the GE.  There are at least fifty religious traditions since the Egyptians who solved that problem earlier.  The fact that it ended Hubbard in a contradiction, proves that he did not have a valid religion.  Then Hubbard claims that he is the synthesis of Eastern and Western religion which is pure nonsense.</p>
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