Some of you may have noticed this item in the Sunday Funnies at the Underground Bunker.
I found it a bit disturbing, but not for the usual Valley money grubbing reasons.
This is the poster promoting the event:
James Barbour hasn’t been seen for many years.
Back in the mid 2000’s, he was one of the “A-list” musicians who was invited to perform on the Freewinds for MV.
But then he got himself into trouble. Big time.
Here is a summary from his Wikipedia page.
In April 2006, Barbour was arrested and charged with having inappropriate relations with a female minor five and half years prior. In the Fall of 2006, he was indicted by a grand jury in New York for said crime. In January 2008, he pleaded guilty to two misdemeanour counts of endangering the welfare of a minor in exchange for a lesser sentence of 60 days in jail and three years probation. Also, in accordance with his plea bargain, Barbour made a public allocution to these misdemeanors. He began his sixty-day jail sentence at Rikers Island on February 29, 2008.
He served his time. The point is not whether James Barbour is a good or bad person, or whether he has been rehabilitated. He probably should not be condemned to a life of a pariah. BUT, headlining a convicted sex offender at a fundraising event for a group of self-proclaimed “humanitarians” is at best a tremendous lapse in judgment.
The point is really this.
The church of scientology constantly proclaims it is composed of the most ethical people on earth and stands firm on family values. And yet, there is a distinct pattern emerging when it comes to those who engage in sex with minors, one of the few immoral acts that are pretty much condemned by EVERYONE. Add this to the two fairly recent stories we have covered, How Scientology Deals With Child Molesters and More Disconnection Hypocrisy and it is hard to not conclude that child molesting, unlike in the “wog” world, doesn’t seem to fall within scientology’s definition of immoral or unethical.
gato rojo says
More of the same crap I heard for many years well before I finally escaped—“JUST GET IT DONE! I DON’T CARE HOW YOU DO IT!! JUST GET IT DONE!!!”
And there ya have it.
The Dim Midget ha been very successful in turning this organization into one of the most disgusting on the planet.
Makes one’s skin crawl.
A “heart stopping” peformance.
I can only keep laughing when I read the list of the 21 donaters who got milked dry.
They did of course move up in “status” and this is what Scientology is ALL about today.
Give money, get status.
Its rather like donating to a political party.
Er well no, its no,t because if you donate to a rotten political movement at least you buy a bit of legislation for your own advantage or get some other plum out of it.
With the IAS you just get a bit of fucking wood with your name on it costing about $5.00
1984 is really here at last.
I shall have to start posting as Winston to keep up with all this editing of the Tech and Policy
“Posting as Winston”. Are you Winston Kao?
I think it would be important to know the the case and training level of James Barbour at the time of the incident. This way it would be easier to evaluate to which degreee he was on his road to “Clear” — and to which degree one can talk about a failure of the spiritual services offered.
Mike Rinder says
That’s only relevant if you buy into the idea that the higher you are I the grade chart the more ethical you are. Have not found much evidence that this correlation exists. That’s not to say that I don’t believe in general scientologists are decent people. I do. I think it has attracted people who find the professed aims of Scientology to be worthwhile. Just my view. I am sure a lot will disagree with my view that scientologists are generally good people, if gullible (partly because of that goodness).
I agree with you Mike. As we know, the fact of repeated secchecks on OT VII speaks for itself in terms of the organisation’s own belief in their system. — However it would be an interesting piece of information for professionals/academics who try to document fact vs. fiction of the professed gains and “spiritual advances” when one goes “up” the grade chart.
I agree 100% with your view on this Mike.
Although Scns are for the most part good people seeking to do good works and help, I have known OT VII’s who were so out ethics on the 2D that they had affairs with 3 people all at once and all the while hiding the fact of this from all three. When confronted by one of them, myself, he denied it and professed innocence and high ethics level. The one of “the other women” came to me and we compared notes and she also told me of the third one, and so then and only then when the smoking gun is found, does he confess to the truth. He was on OT VII, a poet, and the church didn’t take him off the level for this. He had a history of promiscuity that I found out after the fact. It was so bad that the MAA had made him sign a Promissory Note that he would not use his poetry as the net to draw in women for sex and also made him promise he wouldn’t have sex with women while on his upcoming poetry tour. He agreed to all that, signed the necessary papers, etc, and then went out and went out 2D on the first day with the woman who picked him up at the airport. I am not making this up! Scns are good people for the most part and are gullible, many of them, myself included (although I have woken up and hope to shed that part of the picture.) But to think someone is ethical based on their level on the Grade Chart is sheer folly. I have found “mere wogs” to be more ethical than some on OT VII and OT VIII. And I don’t use the word “wog” anymore as it is demeaning. I just used it here to make a point.
I’m going to be very controversial here and say that I hold it as a possibility that the fifteen year old girl could have been the aggressor in the sex.
In high school I knew a girl of 15 or 16 who’d been having consensual sex very happily since she was 13. She enjoyed it. She protected her self and knew what she was about. Mostly I think she engaged with boys in and around her own age but if she had liked a teacher or any older man I don’t think it would have been a problem for her. She cut a very wide swath. She just liked sex from her very first time. She had a horrible reputation and she didn’t give a damn.
I knew a girl who married at 20 as a virgin, and though she had graduated from college a year early and was very intelligent and well read she was quite innocent emotionally as well, in that she had never dated anyone except her husband to be. Her wedding nite was a very significant event for her. Today she is a grandmother and still has a kind of emotional innocence.
I knew another girl who grew up with loving parents – her parents were related to neighbors of ours – in a typical suburban town, got excellent grades in high school, skipped a grade in high school because she was so smart and graduated a year ahead of her class, had all the money she needed or wanted to attend college or learn whatever she fancied, and her first job at 18 was as a hooker in a massage parlour; she liked the money.
These are extreme examples I’m citing here and certainly the average American girl doesn’t fall into any of these categories, and most of the girls and women I know and have known don’t fall into these categories, nonetheless I cite them to make the following point:
There have to be laws and so we have the age of consent, and we have statutory rape. Children must be protected, no question. But when is a female past the age of menstruation no longer a child? I think it varies. But that doesn’t matter, legally, because a female under the age of consent is potential jailbait. Is she a child unable to grant consent to sex simply because she’s under 18? I would think that ain’t necessarily so, but that a man would be wisest and safest to follow the law and leave her alone.
And I do think this lounge lizard was disgusting in the whining public way he retaliated against the girl. He broke the law; take your lumps and shut up, was what he should have done.
I will add that I also believe there are many girls and women OVER the age of 18 who are actually not mentally or emotionally mature enough to consent to sex, however legal it may be.
Aquamarine — I am sure there are others who could say this better, but this argument doesn’t cut it. 18 may be an arbitrary age to consider someone an adult, but the line has to be drawn somewhere and our society has drawn that line clearly.
We’re talking about grown men – mostly with decades more life experience than these girls; not a 16 year old and 18 year old.
And you are kidding yourself if you don’t think that a 15 year old is vulnerable when it comes to having a sexual ‘relationship’ with an adult, even if the younger party pursued it or believes they want it. We are talking about children who frankly do not have enough life experience to truly comprehend a sexual relationship, even if they think they do.
It’s a red flag if a teen is putting themselves in such a position — instead of the adult taking advantage of this situation, they should seek help for the child – not just to avoid a ‘brush with the law’, but because it’s the right thing to do as a decent human being. Usually there is something else going on with the child, such as a history of abuse or severe neglect.
Many of the cases I’ve seen, including this one, involve adults in positions of power over the teenagers. In this case, the girl supposedly wanted to be an actress and Barbour’s experience put him in power. In the SO cases I have read about, it’s often the teenager’s senior who is the culprit.
And this excuse that the teenager was the seducer has been used over and over to justify brushing aside and covering up such incidents. Barbour used it to justify his repulsive behavior toward the girl in court and the media. This, by the way, is the type of scumbag who gets involved in sex with a 15 year old.
They should get Ted Nugent to open for him. He could do his “jailbait” song.
Not only is this showcasing in extremely poor taste, it also shows that they are desperate and reaching far into the depths as there is no one left to showcase but a man with a criminal record…oh, and he can sing too, I guess.
I recommend people read the New York Post and New York Daily News articles cited in the Wikipedia article.
I missed an article, and it is important:
To All Child Molesters, Pedophiles, Child Sex Perverts and Any Other Way you want to put it:
The Church of Secrecy will make sure that your child sex crimes will stay safe and private, no worries. We don’t like any bad PR associated with us and will do anything necessary to cover it up. We, the CoS, will be discreet and will provide you with the best care possible, to help you to not feel bad for your victim, just in case you are experiencing any shame, remorse or ‘misemotion’, such as grief over what you may have done. We are counting on you to be honest with us, but we know that you will probably re-offend. That’s okay, you will remain in good standing and will be allowed to participate in all church activities. Especially if you join staff and work for us, or have a large bank account with which you share with us. We will also protect you from SP’s. Like the ones who are on the Internet, flapping their jaws.
So, please come and join the Church of Secrecy, where pedophiles are welcome because we are the ONLY ONES who can ‘truly’ help, and don’t forget: We Know Best.
Hallie Jane says
I would like to say that this so called list of accomplishments is a big zero, a lie, a fallacy, a pretense. These are not accomplishments. You gleeful people are just throwing money at something and you’re not even taking responsibility, for where the money goes or if it’s handled responsibly. “Stupidity is the unknowness of consideration. Stupidity is unknowness of time, place, form and event.” (part of scn axiom 38) Millions have been wasted on lavish Scn buildings. Here’s an axiom for you: Scn axiom #51: “Postulates and live communication not being mest and being senior to mest can accomplish change in mest without bringing about a persistence of mest, thus auditing can occur.” Now if you all worked on that one instead of glorifying the dollar, I would be impressed. You’re in “must be contributed to” on the havingness scale. One would think the basics would be better understood by now with them crammed down everyone’s throat, in lieu of the bridge, for the last 8 years.
Al Brown says
I really need to get a picture made of myself showing some chest hair with a lightning bolt behind me. I’m going to work on that right away.
Valley should get a copy of this lounge lizard’s Wikipedia page asking when he’ll be appearing again. LOL!
Al Brown says
Yeah Valley people. Throwing your money away with “verve!”
But. But. But. Didn’t you read the story at http://www.theweeklyvice.com/2008/01/disney-actor-james-barbour-blames-child.html
It was all the 15-year old victim’s fault according to Barbour.
Here are selected quotes. Sorry you don’t get the whole article, if you want truly pukeworthy quotes from a truly pukeworthy “ethical” person, read the thing yourself.
The sexual touching continued the next month when the girl visited him at his New York apartment. He admitted to the court that he had known that the girl was 15 at the time.
“Barbour agreed to the charges in exchange for a reduced sentence. 60 days in jail and three years of probation. Sentencing is currently scheduled for February 29th, 2008.
By pleading guilty to the arrangement, Barbour will not have to register as a sex offender. According to his attorney Ronald P. Fischetti, “By pleading guilty to misdemeanors, he doesn’t have to register, and that’s important. He wouldn’t have been able to travel without reporting, and he wouldn’t have been able to work with children.”
“Although Barbour admitted to sexually touching a minor child that he knew was under aged, he blames the child for the entire thing.
His Attorney publicly lashed out at the child, blaming her for Barbour’s legal troubles and questioning her motives. Barbour’s attorney issued a statement claiming “She initiated both of these sexual encounters and then waited five years before filing a complaint against him”.
Barbour, through his attorney took the blame a step further by attempting to publish the minor child’s name in newspaper ads in an attempt to solicit responses from other men who might have experienced the same supposed advances from the child.
The Court of Appeal’s Judge hearing the case was forced to ban Barbour from running the ads.”
princepuke among men.
That line of arguing echoes the one in Laura DeCrescenzo’s case.
This is priceless. I’ll bet the unfortunate soul who hired this guy is going to get face-ripped if not worse. I wonder how smug OSA volunteer and Vanguard With Honors Jim Meskiman and his demure wife are going to feel when they discover that the greasy-looking crooner hired to soften them up for the wallet rape did time for statutory rape! What a flap!
Local DSA, this is all your fault! Obviously, anyone who performs at a Scientology Event needs prior OSA clearance! Get on that immediately!
As he had appeared at IAS events and on the ship, Der Leader would have had to given his OK for him to be back. I seem to recall he’s been back a while (at least a couple of years, so this is nothing new.
Anything done in the name of RCo$ for the greatest (their) good is ok no matter what……..morons!
Mike, if it weren’t for you (& Tony, & Marty, etc,) so much would have remained a “secret.”
Thank you so very much!
Cat Daddy says
The highest purpose in the universe is the creation of an effect.
That makes Hitler a very Ethical Being
Vox Clamantes in Deserto says
What’s up with that?
I yawnalot says
Nothing in corporate Scn is an accident. At management level It’s either ignored because of the money or to a lesser degree incompetence. At the punter level – they are all starving for ARC – anything will do, they will welcome with open arms anyone who shares their reality, but put some glitz on it and bingo!. A bubble is an apt term but the common thing amongst them all is uninspected desperation. If I really looked at them I’d say the sheeple in the church are criminals in apathy – they have inverted reach..
Flag had a full time Way To Happiness reg. Married (to an OSA staff member) and middle aged. Also an “OT” and long time Sea Org member. He was given a very young girl to be runner for him. He had sex with her in his office.The girl was on the next plane to S. America. The reg who brought in about $75,000 a week stayed on post. It was kept very secret. Realize this reg yacked all day about the moral decay in society and how the solution was for public to give their savings to spead TWTH booklets. He held the post for years and brought in millions….
Jens TINGLEFF says
“Utilitarian Ethics.” Look it up. Then look up the HCO Policy letter about “Ethics protection.” And I quote “In short a staff member can get away with murder so long as his statistic is up”
And I bet a “clam” would tell “wogs” that LRH was kidding…
Cooper Kessel says
” a “clam” would tell “wogs” that LRH was kidding…”
all the while knowing LRH wouldn’t be …… and smiling about it.
Conversely, if you are not in a money-making area of Scn (and sometimes even if you are), you will be axed if your stats are up.
“He served his time. The point is not whether James Barbour is a good or bad person, or whether he has been rehabilitated. He probably should not be condemned to a life of a pariah.”
I, for one, feel that this shows an enormous amount of balance, insight and judgement on your part Mike.
It is for the system to decide and define the punishment for a crime, and tolerance of extra-judicial punishment, such as the common condoning of brutality in prisons (“because they deserve it”), is not justice, but its opposite.
It is nonetheless also poor judgement to headline him at a fund-raiser, and evidence of the lack of efficacy of the “tech”, on an individual and institutional level.
I wonder what $ amount (sorry”voluntary contribution”) they put on his “ethics transgression” to let him back in
GTBO – BINGO!!!!! You said it all in once sentence.
I wonder who helped the victim have a happy, healthy life filled with love and intimacy and fearlessness.
Men do not really understand how young girls experience rape. It is an invasion of one’s soul. One’s spirit. It disorients the whole electrical system. Guys just get to stick it in and then be on their way. The young girl is pierced. Invaded. Forced to allow a bull into her china shop of emotions.
Ah, me… I rant-eth too much. Forgive me.. this struck a nerve. A nerve that is not talked about a lot.
Cooper Kessel says
Your rant is well received! Keep up the good work Zana.
Hallie Jane says
So true Zana, it can ruin a lifetime. Speak on!
sub1genius – I agree with your statement about the guy doing his time and the public not dragging him through the mud. As long as the guy has put a lid on his impulses and hasn’t molested ever again. Who knows if he has or hasn’t and that isn’t the question right now. I hope that his experience with ‘the system’ scared the crap out of him and brought him to his senses.
However, I would like to say something on behalf of the victim, the 15 year old. Life will not be the same for her. She definitely had an experience, that is known. Child molesters always think that their advances are welcome and desired by their victims. They often prey on kids who are vulnerable or lonely. Kids don’t forget these experiences. It can affect them adversely in the future, such as their ability to develop normal, healthy loving relationships, and they way they feel about themselves. I know I’m saying something that is commonly known. It’s just that I often see more focus on the perpetrator as far as being understanding and helping them, and the teen victim kinda swept under the rug. Not that you’re doing that here though. Just my own thing.
Yes, it’s very poor judgement to headline a convicted child molester at a CoS event. I don’t think any judgement was even involved because the secret has been kept and worse, the guy in good standing, so how would anyone know?
How would anyone know? Read his Wikipedia page, like Mike did.
Yes Dollar, true. But good Scientologists don’t read or investigate anything relating to Scientology or other Scientologists in good standing on the Internet. They stay safe within the Bubble.
sorry, I meant to add that even if a Scientologist read Wiki (which is dangerous waters for them), they wouldn’t pass along any bad news about another Scn because that would be “entheta”.
BTW, one of my kids went to a Scientology school and was told not to ever read Wiki. That it was full of lies and wasn’t a relevant source of information. Gee, I wonder why.
Pepper, as such I agree with you, scientologists stay safe within the bubble. However, I would expect the people in charge of organising this event (possibly including the DSA, as it is both a fundraiser and a PR stunt) to at least look at this information, either on Wikipedia or in his ethics file before choosing him. Then again, as others have said, molesting minors isn’t really much of a crime in this group. Withholding money, now that’s a different matter altogether.
Spot on Dollar. Withholding $$$$ is high in the list of crimes, right behind reading and posting about unapproved Scn on the Internet!
Child Molesting? Meh.
We have a few of these on record in South Africa too. Of course the victim (child) must have done something to pull it in, and needs to go write up their OW’s. Then on to amends project. repeatedly. The perpetrator gets away with it, because if it landed up in a court-case, it would be bad PR for the Church. So they “handle” it internally. In other words, shut up and hope it goes away.
“The victim does something to pull it in.” I was molested by my father as a baby. I lived in fear of him for my whole childhood and all of my adolescence until I moved out of the house. Did I “pull it in?” Did I have a choice? Could I move out at 3 years of age? Perhaps 8 years old is the magic number to move out and live on my own. There was nothing but insanity and fear. No safe place in the world. My mother just pretended it was not happening there in front of her nose. I have literally NO patience for these assholes. And ZERO patience for the stupid, unfeeling parents who ALLOW their children to be bait for these predators. !!
I’m fortunate to now have a wonderful life. However… my whole life has been about recovering from this crap, rather than fulfilling my talent and making a contribution to the world. I say we PROTECT our children so that they can align with their Source Energies and help HEAL THE WORLD with their love. We don’t have a lot of time left to empower them to make the changes this planet needs.
Our children are the ones who will be left with the challenges that we, as humanity, are creating now. I say we protect and EMPOWER our children! It starts with protecting our children’s vital source energy — which includes intelligence, creativity and, yes, their own sexuality. It’s THEIR sexuality. Fundamental to their own happy life. I’m FEROCIOUS about protecting children.
Cooper Kessel says
Well said Zana! This crap about “they pulled it in” is pure Sciencultology think by the sickest of the sick beings on this planet.
Bear with me, I sense a rant.
I had bad feelings about my daughter joining the SO at age 16. I didn’t follow my gut instincts and now she is among them, doing their bidding and believing she is saving the world. It is my error that she is in the CMO – IXU spending her days on the 5th floor of the HGB in Hollywood and I will never forget it.
My message to OSA and you other sick fucks that pedal the OSA/CULT think ………don’t ever relax. I won’t either and I will do everything I can to be sure the world knows just exactly how sick and pathetic you and your crappy little culty organization are.
Rant over ……… you can return to your regularly scheduled program!
After reading some comments I realized something-the child abusers that have walked the aisles of the Church get pardoned but, lets say a good staff or Sea Org member gets his stats down, or a failed project, or a management program failure and the hell breaks loose- Treason assignments, Comm Evs, RPF, Declares, shunned, demoted, make wrong and so on.
There is really no ethics within this group; lets kill, demoralize and nullify the good ones by making them wrong and protect the real criminals. It is so mind twisting but, even if hard to confront, is the core of this organization and that is why it has taken this path for so many, many years, unfortunately.
Tommy J says
The Church doesn’t discriminate based on age MIke. They fu@k everybody they can get their hands on. Sad but true
Mike Leopold says
My apologies. I missed your July 25 post, somehow.
Mike Leopold says
I wish you had written about OSA’s frantic efforts to distance Scientology from this, and the fact that the crimes occurred within yards of the New York Org. Was it Jennifer MacDonald, or John Carmichael who was involved?
Black Panther, when you see that pedophile who molested your family member, aim higher than the knees.
Black Panther says
Good idea Cindy! 🙂
Hallie Jane says
SP pariahs and bitter defrocked apostates get along very well. We love them here. 🙂
Yep. Above the knees and below the naval. Whammy.
Black Panther says
I personally know of 4 victims of paedophilia perpetrated by Scientologists. One such miscreant was with LRH on Mission into Time and he loved little boys. I am not willing to mention names in order to protect their victim’s identity.
One of these victims was a member of my family, and it was known about but all swept under the carpet by the “Church”. This dipshit is still friends with many Scientologists (including current Joburg Org staff) and they KNOW what he did, yet choose to remain in comm with him while I am the big SP pariah.
If I ever see him in the street, I will personally break his knee-caps. In fact I might just organise this one day – and show my TRUE SP colours.
Old Surfer Dude says
Break one of his knee caps for me, too. Church of Child Molesters is alive and well…
” I am not willing to mention names in order to protect their victim’s identity.”
I doubt this is enough of a possibility to justify silence, especially to the authorities, yet you would commit a crime of vengeance.
I, for one, do not approve of the threat of violence..
The Dark Avenger says
I always liked the apocryphal story told about Cornelius Vanderbilt after he died, that he wrote the following:
You have undertaken to cheat me. I won’t sue you, for law is too slow. I’ll ruin you.
1subgenius, you need not be concerned. As per their own rules, it is the responsibility of the victim because they pulled it in.
BP, since you voiced the idea, you may have to wait in a long line-up (first come, first served).
I would LOVE to see these names go public. Just the raw footage of what they did and who they are. Publicize the suppression. Make it known. THAT would bust more than his knee caps. If he got away with molesting little boys so long ago… he’s probably been molesting more of them since then. The crime is in how they distort the child’s experience of their own sexuality.
Human sexuality is a gift from God. But when a child is subjected to the shame and destruction that a pedophile can wreck… the child can go their whole lifetime without experiencing the natural healing powers of loving sex. There might NEVER be loving sex for that victim. It is a crime of ravaging and stealing a child’s greatest joy. Turning the child against her/himself and his own life-force. It is way beyond just sex… it is an attack on the Life force itself flowing through a little being. That kind of trauma can stunt an entire lifetime.
I’m sure that DM doesn’t mind these ravagers. He, himself, is a ravager of souls. He gobbles them up for breakfast and enjoys breaking them into small pieces to jam into his evening pie. That is probably just sport for him to watch these “big beings” be part of the Co$ parade of “most ethical people on the planet.” Whadda racket.
“I’m sure that DM doesn’t mind these ravagers. He, himself, is a ravager of souls. He gobbles them up for breakfast and enjoys breaking them into small pieces to jam into his evening pie.”
Wow zana. Well put.
Recap: I count 50 people max. on the group photo.
Mr Barbour: He probably is a good singer, and all he needs to do is woo money from the ageing crowd.
Btw, its not only the most ethical group on the planet, it’s also THE SANEST!
And of those 50 people, I am guessing not one of them is under the age of 50 (with the exception of “management”). The herd is thinning (literally) and this is a big tell of the dwindling membership of the “Church”.
Those folks are sooooo old I might have known them when I was in in the early ’70s!
Sad thing is that they are still there drinking Kool-Aid as if it were Geritol…
In addition to the pattern of ‘cover it up where possible, let time pass, act as though nothing has happened’, another pattern is to blame the victim in these particular sort of incidents.
I have learned of several cases now where adults in Scientology (and mostly involving staff and SO members) had sex with minors as young as 12 or 13 and yet called it ‘consensual’. Most of these incidents involved 15-16 year old girls who were accused of ‘seducing’ the much older men.
Barbour at least did his time, but I agree with Mike that it is a serious lapse of judgment having someone with such a record be celebrated by a self-labeled ‘most ethical group on the planet’. Additionally, based on the articles linked from his wiki page, Barbour claimed that it was the 15 year old girl who went after him (and he said that she told him she was 16, like that is better). Barbour’s lawyer claimed that the girl was a gold-digger. He claimed they never had actual intercourse, though ‘she was willing’. Poor guy, having some young girl throwing herself at him, what else could he do but submit to her advances?
A teenager is not an adult, and the idea that a 15 or 16 year old could have ‘consensual’ sex with someone decades their senior is absurd. Most people recognize this. But yet the church continues to treat children as though they were fully adult, justifying all manner of abuse.
Precisely what I told my 13 y-o when he “explained” to me that the girl (15) who was raped by Wally Hanks had engaged in “consensual” sex. I also opined that a 15 year-old girl being raped by a 50ish man armed with both fire arms and machete, not to mention life or death control granted by Scn. is by definition NON-consensual!
Which is why the CoS would recruit a 12 year-old for a billion year Sea Org Contract too. The mind-set views children as ‘billion year-old thetans’, not children. So if there’s any “consideration” about having sex with a minor teen, it’s only a body-thing. The “Being” / kid wanted it and was seducing the adult in question. Therefore, the kid has responsibility. Minors cannot legally consent to sex, no matter what the perpetrator has in his or her twisted mind. Child Molesters always think that kids want to have sex with them and that they like it too. Child Molesters cannot be fixed; only conditioned to withold on perpetrating the act – the ones who want to stop hurting kids anyway. The thoughts and impulses to have sex with the young ones never goes away.
Don’t worry I’m a Scientologist .. and I paid a lot of money for it to be one .. so believe me, whatever I will do to you .. it is all god purpose anyway ..
good Purpose .. not god purpose
Good Freudian slip 😉
Cognited and Out says
Another recent humanitarian – Freddie Berger née Minkoff – yes, her brother is Lisa McPherson’s doctor David Minkoff. Humanitarianism runs in that family.
I’ll bet the Dwarf had Dear Dr. M. and his whole family set up for life with OSA hush money. “Yes, your IAS donations, keeping peoples’ mouths shut – er, keeping Scientology working!
Come on kiddies, let’s play Doctor, I’m a Doctor of Scientology and your body is just a toy doll, and you are a spiritual being – not a young girl. Just lay down here and I’ll examine you.
Hmmmm, I see what’s lacking. Your toy doll needs sexual stimulation !!
Don’t worry I’m a Scientologist.
It is soooo disgusting. It’s not a physical thing… it’s an invasion of a child’s soul. It’s dismembering her spirit. Alienating her against herself. This is not about sex. This is about demolition of a child’s Being-ness. This leads a child to NEVER be able to trust anyone ever again. If she doesn’t have any support from parents or other parts of her culture… she will never be able to get her life on track in this department. And if you can’t get life on track in love and homelife… then it will forever be like trying to balance a raw egg on a fork. You can’t do it. Just try to balance a raw egg on a fork someday… you will see how it feels to be the victim of molestation. Your life wobbles at some deep level forever, no matter what you do.
Bonnie DiMartino says
“Don’t worry I’m a Scientologist”
That about sums it up.
I recall an incident where a public Scientologist in Philadelphia, Dick Marks, worked as a school teacher and for whatever reason decided to take a piss behind the bleachers during some school-time event.
Sadly for Dick, this was within view of some of the school girls, who reported him for exposing himself. Turns out many of the students at the school didn’t like Dick very much (ahem).
The cops came and arrested him on the school grounds. As he was being escorted away by the police, Dick tried to smooth it all over by explaining, “No, no officers, you don’t understand, I’m a Scientologist!”.
I kid you not.
The DSA gave him an earful later for bringing up SCIENTOLOGY as he was being dragged off to jail.
Silly wogs. They just don’t understand!!!! Only Scientologists have the power to help! Car accidents, floods, earthquakes, crime, illiteracy, you name it!
I looked at the pictures of these folks and I couldn’t help but think to myself, “Well there they are, …all the fresh road-kill produced by the Ideal Org program.”
I don’t know which is worse in the valley, the thriving porn industry or the Ideal Org fundraising. The porn kings are at least upfront that their goal is your money and don’t try to mask it.
Did anyone notice that Michael Fairman was one of the recipients of flowers and a big plaque for his big donations? And yet when he started questioning, it was ” Off with his head!” and out he goes. Which gives me an idea. We should target a mailing campaign to the big whales to get the truth to them. If any whales then take up on the suggestion and start reading the internet, looking with their own eyes at what is actually happening now in their “church” some of them will either defect, or stop giving money or question the church and be excommunicated. Sounds like a great plan. It saves the whale from more suppression and it cuts off the money supply to Der Leader. Anyone want to pursue this?
Oops I was mistaken. Upon looking again at the pics, it was Jim Meskimen in that pic and not Michael Fairman. My bad. But the idea is still a good one: to target the whales with truth.
More than any of us, the whales can afford Internet access.
It’s a great idea Cindy. Many of the whales businesses and even home address are available with a just little time spent searching on ……..wait for it………The Internet !!!
Has a Declare Order been issued for The Internet yet? It’s clearly a suppressive tool that bitter,defrocked types are using to hurt Dave.
K Francis, yes, we’ll be seeing goldenrod on the internet soon. 🙂
It would be good to target them with fliers and publications that imitate the stuff that comes out of Co$… big, glossy crap. Then they will start to read it… rather than just throw it away. They could start with the beauty and classiness of COB’s amazing offices (that they paid for). Also the re-do’s and the tanning bed. That will get them in slowly. Then they can hear the wonderful report about James Barbour… and in his resume talk about his jail time for child molestation. By that time they are already in shock and riveted… and can, perhaps, start reading about the RPF and the RPF’s RPF for 3, 6 or 12 years. And the abortions. Then the 23 high profile attorneys that Co$ is waging against Mosie Rathbun’s one attorney. How much is that costing? Thank goodness for the IAS “war chest”. How about a report about what the IAS is doing with their money. Uphs…. hmmm… there doesn’t seem to BE any report. And on and on. Start them on an easy gradient… like cooking a frog. Do it slowly so that they don’t jump out of the pot. Before they can “turn off the entheta” they are hooked.
If they only knew what their money is supporting.
Cindy – I have always thought we need a DM dead agent pack in the same sort of vein or “punch” that Debbie Cook’s Email had on the Church membership, and Steve Hall has a letter from Royal Jandreau on his site which lists some of these under a numbering system on the page. The link is:
Of course much more can be added and such could be sent either via email or as flyers.
Thank you for that great link, Foolproof. I enjoyed reading the story. It will make a good thing to email to KA drinkers.
Wow, this is quite revealing and I had no clue of the matter. I guess if you are in an organization led by a sociopath who commits his own crimes you can attract and accept similar characters who, in turn, are criminal and are condoned of their actions.
The falsehoods prevail and the few remaining still BELIEVE all is just fine, however, WUS is spread with many ex-Scientologists that openly or quietly have retired their support to such crimes. The charade will end soon and these and other crimes will come to light. Karma will take its share in handling those that abused others. Hypocrisy won’t last forever.
Old Surfer Dude says
I’m sure if they all come together and really, really try, they can do worse. Child molesters being coddled is nothing new. Besides, kids are viewed as thetans in little bodies. So what if someone molests an underage child. They’re not their bodies!
Disgusting beyond words…
Ronn S. says
Or, Surfer, it could be… “it is just a body”. To be sure it takes a sick head to justify this level of insanity, in fact evil. Psychiatry would have you believe it is incurable much like alcoholism. I dono about all that, but would you trust him with your kid or grand children? Fricken nuts PR to hire this dude as Mike says.
I’ve always found it ironic that I have never committed any crime, much less a sex crime. My “crime” was asking too many questions and openly disagreeing. As a result, people like Barbour are afforded far more rights than I enjoy. So, apparently in the eyes of the church, dissent is far worse than statutory rape. Go figure.
Yep, you said it, Statpush! In the eyes of DM and the Cof$, questioning and looking and dissent are far worse than statutory rape and child molestation of young kids. Oh, he has a criminal conviction on his record? Minor detail ; just look at the big picture and do “the greatest good for the…..” barf.
I’m so glad this is all coming out. Rape and child molestation are crimes that last a lifetime for the victim. The glib asshole molester does a few months of jail time and community service. The recipient of the crime does a lifetime of terror, insecurity and inability to create intimate relationships. Who gets the worst punishment?
I have NO sympathy for molesters and rapists. None. And I’m a big sweetie pie who loves practically everyone. A child molester is ravaging war on a child. Disorienting, terrorizing and demeaning. Damaging (in most cases) for life. The fact that Scientology condones child molesters and turns the other cheek while holding them up for admiration and applause… well, there is almost nothing worse that you can say about Co$. Except… that it seems to keep getting more and more despicable every day.
Like I said before Mike, Scientology is a haven for perverts. An absolute paradise. They are welcome with open arms. As long as they have big wallets. Secrecy is of the utmost importance to a child molester. Scientology is the Capitol of Secrets. The grand pooba I’d you will of secret making and keeping. It is a match made in disgusting, loathsome, heaven.
True points, but it’s not just the secrecy. It’s the built in protection of crimes. A scientologist who reports crimes to the authorities is declared, shunned, harassed. The criminal is protected with the right amount of cash, as you say, or with the right leverage, but protected, unrestrained to continue the crimes.
IMO, headlining a convicted sex offender at a fundraising event group or in any group under any circumstances is not a lapse of judgement. It’s implicit approval and inferred support of a convicted sex offender. In any other world, when a criminal is featured at your group’s event, the group realizes they are supporting a criminal organization and leaves. No philosophizing on what’s the right thing to do. They just do it.
Old Surfer Dude says
thdne, they’re just like the Mafia…
Amen. Well said.
They are also criminals of Spelling: someone mis-spelled “dissipated” as “dicipated” in their flier.
They not only support criminals, they are (at the very least) uneducated or just plain too stupid or lazy to use spell-check. Amazing. It stands to reason how they might be too ignorant, stupid or lazy to keep pedophiles and child molesters off their stage.
This gets more and more bizarre as the spinning top wobbles more and more out of control.
Cooper Kessel says
You’re being kinda tough on the Mafia don’t ya think. Those guys might get pissed being lumped into the same category as a $cientologist!
Beware: Opinion follows…..
The mafia has it’s code of honor and ethics. The cult will sell anyone down the river at any time and for any whim or reason. After the Cult collapses, you will want to be very aware of those who remained IN to the end, wanting to befriend you, help you, talk to you or expect some form of assistance or help from you ……………… because they were duped and didn’t know.
I don’t mean to say that assistance should not be provided but there must be evidence of a change of condition. It will be the job of those who left to get the ethics in on those who remain(ed).
I agree Coop. Those who remained in to the bitter end were obviously in lower conditions and lowered awareness. They will need to do conditions to bring them up to the point of not being a liability to everyone around them. We will all hands it at that time I’m sure.
THDNE, depending on the Scientologist, you can’t even report crimes to other Scientologists without being shunned, et. al. Some people are supposed to be able to get away with things because they have the big bucks. You only report the crimes of the people who are not spending the big bucks, then only internally.
Hallie Jane says
This is interesting to me Basketballjane. Something always seemed missing as far as why young teens and preteens were heavily regged into the SO. I always thought the explanation of “bodies in the SO shop” was not an adequate statement that would justify the excessive aggression that I’ve seen. Recruiters refusing to leave someone’s house without the child and like stories. It seemed to me that the work of having so many immature and undereducated people to deal with, didn’t offset the use of the kids. I was concerned they were just cheap labor. I felt something was hidden and untoward but had not observed anything myself. Thanks for your input on this important topic.
Yeah Hallie, I think that is definitely part of it. The PR line was recruiting children was necessary because they were “clean” they hadn’t had time to rack up overts on the 3rd and 4th and most importantly the 2nd dynamic. Most girls who come to the SO are virgins. And they are still in puberty. So you have a pack of children with raging hormones, who have no experience with sex and aren’t allowed to gain any or even decide for themselves if they like or want it. You can’t do the normal things like,having a crush on someone and the first time you go to third base with someone. Because 3rd base is only allowed on your wedding night. What if your husband, or wife for that matter, is TERRIBLE in bed? What if your bits and pieces really aren’t a good match? What if they like something you don’t like? TOO FUCKING BAD! Because the last thing that is important in the Sea Org is being happy AT ALL. And yes, let’s face it, a group of pubescent, virginal girls (remember what it was like to be a teenage girl for a minute) just wanting to be loved, being looked at by a 20-30 something man like you are the most beautiful person in the world is EXCITING as hell. But also gross and illegal. But it is encouraged. Especially if the Man is a senior executive, the “Cleaner” his wife is the better. But OH HELL NO if you are a woman. If you are 22 and you are lusting after a 16 year old you may as well pack your shit up! THAT is RPF type shit. ALSO illegal and gross but only enforced on women.
Joe Pendleton says
Yes, BB Jane, mostly any of these acts are overlooked by the CoS except for the two great crimes of the universe ……. being gay or making truthful comments about the CoS on the internet …. then one is either tagged a “suppressive” or just deemed too low to accept on service ….. EXCEPT if one is willing to bankrupt oneself in an attempt to “make amends” ….. then one will be offered a TEMPORARY reprieve from banishment (until the money runs out of course).
Everything in $cientology is geared to making money and anyone who helps make money gets ‘ethics’ protection. There are lots of examples of such behavior over the years and it does seem to be ingrained in the conduct of the clampire. Jan Eastgate could testify to that, or maybe she could if allowed to.
Publicizing James Barbour’s convictions at least warns the public to take care. Will the event people keep Barbour under their eye to prevent any other ‘problems’? Or have the children ‘brought it on themselves’? The only thing for certain is Barbour gets a pay check for that nights work. Or is he on commission?
Doug Parent says
Mike I was just reflecting this morning on how they regard themselves as the most ethical group on the planet and you have this featured on your blog today. It speaks for itself. The only other thing I would like to add is how Scientologists inside the bubble willfully ignore the fact that legions of long time Scientologists have been declared suppressive by the church. It’s criminal negligence.
What’s that about the greater good against the greater…….ohh, never mind, snark, snark!
Mike I read the earlier entries that touched upon this topic within the Church. Although I never encountered it, it was obviously present and covered up by the Church (including OSA type people such as DSA’s). As COOSAI did it ever hit your plate as a potential flap cycle to be hushed up (an org public or staff member being the perp?)
Mike, this is a bit off thread here, but hope it’s OK to tell people to also go to Tony O’s site to see the excellent video interview that Jeff does with Mareka Brousseau. Bring a box of Kleenex tissue with you. These human rights violations need as much air time as possible. I hope you republish it on your site so that media pick it up and that it might cause an investigation to come down on the Cadet Org and babysitting places in the church.
w. martin says
Scientology ethics is an oxymoron.
Old Surfer Dude says
And I always thought an oxymoron was a stupid ox. Live & learn. But, w., you’re absolutely right!
I’ve been called worse.