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	Comments on: They Would Rather Forget This &#8212; the Big Ideal Org Lie	</title>
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	<description>Something Can Be Done About It</description>
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		By: Sammy		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26917</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sammy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Dec 2013 04:11:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26917</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Mike, I am ex-Finance Office for one of those orgs that have since &quot;gone ideal&quot;, and every time I see one of those monolithic Idle Org photos, all I can think is: How are they going to pay that electric bill?&quot; 

Considering that FBOs are forced to take a huge cut off the top that goes away from local spending, as well as all the nasty little bits that are cut out beyond that (death from a thousand tiny cuts) before the locals are able to spend. I remember the electricity being an issue in the old building, and having to physically stop a worker from shutting off lights by waving a check at him.

How are they managing to now do it for these multiple story buildings? Looks like the only thing that ended up going 5.4X is the bills.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike, I am ex-Finance Office for one of those orgs that have since &#8220;gone ideal&#8221;, and every time I see one of those monolithic Idle Org photos, all I can think is: How are they going to pay that electric bill?&#8221; </p>
<p>Considering that FBOs are forced to take a huge cut off the top that goes away from local spending, as well as all the nasty little bits that are cut out beyond that (death from a thousand tiny cuts) before the locals are able to spend. I remember the electricity being an issue in the old building, and having to physically stop a worker from shutting off lights by waving a check at him.</p>
<p>How are they managing to now do it for these multiple story buildings? Looks like the only thing that ended up going 5.4X is the bills.</p>
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		By: Jane Doe		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26571</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jane Doe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Dec 2013 17:55:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26571</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26564&quot;&gt;Odd Thomas&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;Inside his own little bubble, his Whys are really nothing more than a reflection of his own outpoints.&quot;  Thank you for that great insight, Odd Thomas.  DM is running his case and his outpoints on everyone else.  He dramatizes his case and outpoints and deep down knows that it is something that needs to be handled, so he then tries to &quot;find&quot; tech to handle these aberrations, and then he generalizes it saying that &quot;everyone&quot; needs to handle &quot;this thing.&quot;  Very sad really.  If he had ever allowed an auditor to get near him, he could have truly done  the processes that would have given him case gain.  But that never happened as he refuses auditing.  LRH said in the PTS/SP Course that the Suppressive never shows up for auditing and if he does, he never gets case gain.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26564">Odd Thomas</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;Inside his own little bubble, his Whys are really nothing more than a reflection of his own outpoints.&#8221;  Thank you for that great insight, Odd Thomas.  DM is running his case and his outpoints on everyone else.  He dramatizes his case and outpoints and deep down knows that it is something that needs to be handled, so he then tries to &#8220;find&#8221; tech to handle these aberrations, and then he generalizes it saying that &#8220;everyone&#8221; needs to handle &#8220;this thing.&#8221;  Very sad really.  If he had ever allowed an auditor to get near him, he could have truly done  the processes that would have given him case gain.  But that never happened as he refuses auditing.  LRH said in the PTS/SP Course that the Suppressive never shows up for auditing and if he does, he never gets case gain.</p>
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		By: Odd Thomas		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26564</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Odd Thomas]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Dec 2013 17:14:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26564</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26350&quot;&gt;davefagen&lt;/a&gt;.

Interesting comments Dave. My take on it, is that it&#039;s all propaganda, as defined as follows:

&quot;...information, esp. of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view.&quot;

All propaganda needs is a little truth, a reasonable premise and repetition to succeed. We all know that Div 6 reaches out into the public. That if Div 6 was functioning at a higher level (from whatever it was doing at the time the article was written) everything would be better, improved. These are acceptable truths. Now we support these minor statements with a solution -- Ideal Orgs  -- and we have a plan. Ideal Orgs, operating from the same mindset as Nazi Germany&#039;s Joseph Goebbels (Minister of Propaganda) is all rather brilliant. It takes people&#039;s attention off past failures and onto current solutions. That these too will become failures as well, is irrelevant to those desperate for solutions -- for understanding.

I think most of us remember very clearly why we got into SCN, what made us believe in its potential. And I think most of us also wonder - what the fuck happened -- along the way?Why didn&#039;t that potential get realized? 

It&#039;s like the greatest New York Yankees players ever, all come together as a team and play the 1961 New York Mets and lose 10-0. How did it happen? How did it not work out like we all thought it would?

Another datum comes to mind, this one from LRH and I&#039;m paraphrasing it, &quot; Complexity is directly proportional to the degree of non-confront.&quot;

David The Miscavige can&#039;t confront truth or anything that resembles it. So his solutions keep getting more and more complex and less and less effective. Inside his own little bubble, his Whys are really nothing more than a reflection of his own outpoints.

As an evaluator I have sort out Whys for my own understanding and as-is-ness and I&#039;ve come to the realization that there are actually hundreds of them. This subject is too complex for a single Why, as much as that would be clean and efficient to disseminate.

DM has his own Why for what he does and I&#039;m sure power, evil, stupidity and greed are somewhere within it. Well.. and size.

Odd]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26350">davefagen</a>.</p>
<p>Interesting comments Dave. My take on it, is that it&#8217;s all propaganda, as defined as follows:</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;information, esp. of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view.&#8221;</p>
<p>All propaganda needs is a little truth, a reasonable premise and repetition to succeed. We all know that Div 6 reaches out into the public. That if Div 6 was functioning at a higher level (from whatever it was doing at the time the article was written) everything would be better, improved. These are acceptable truths. Now we support these minor statements with a solution &#8212; Ideal Orgs  &#8212; and we have a plan. Ideal Orgs, operating from the same mindset as Nazi Germany&#8217;s Joseph Goebbels (Minister of Propaganda) is all rather brilliant. It takes people&#8217;s attention off past failures and onto current solutions. That these too will become failures as well, is irrelevant to those desperate for solutions &#8212; for understanding.</p>
<p>I think most of us remember very clearly why we got into SCN, what made us believe in its potential. And I think most of us also wonder &#8211; what the fuck happened &#8212; along the way?Why didn&#8217;t that potential get realized? </p>
<p>It&#8217;s like the greatest New York Yankees players ever, all come together as a team and play the 1961 New York Mets and lose 10-0. How did it happen? How did it not work out like we all thought it would?</p>
<p>Another datum comes to mind, this one from LRH and I&#8217;m paraphrasing it, &#8221; Complexity is directly proportional to the degree of non-confront.&#8221;</p>
<p>David The Miscavige can&#8217;t confront truth or anything that resembles it. So his solutions keep getting more and more complex and less and less effective. Inside his own little bubble, his Whys are really nothing more than a reflection of his own outpoints.</p>
<p>As an evaluator I have sort out Whys for my own understanding and as-is-ness and I&#8217;ve come to the realization that there are actually hundreds of them. This subject is too complex for a single Why, as much as that would be clean and efficient to disseminate.</p>
<p>DM has his own Why for what he does and I&#8217;m sure power, evil, stupidity and greed are somewhere within it. Well.. and size.</p>
<p>Odd</p>
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		By: jgg2012		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26519</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jgg2012]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 21:51:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26519</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Isn&#039;t the tech supposed to make you communicate better?  So why invest in empty buildings when you could have 1000s of online videos, tapes and interviews about how to communicate better.  Someday the orgs will be viewed the way the Egyptian pyramids (lavish graves for dead dictators) are viewed today.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn&#8217;t the tech supposed to make you communicate better?  So why invest in empty buildings when you could have 1000s of online videos, tapes and interviews about how to communicate better.  Someday the orgs will be viewed the way the Egyptian pyramids (lavish graves for dead dictators) are viewed today.</p>
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		By: jgg2012		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26518</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jgg2012]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 21:47:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26518</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26286&quot;&gt;Cat Daddy&lt;/a&gt;.

OK, so an empty building is what Scientology is all about?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26286">Cat Daddy</a>.</p>
<p>OK, so an empty building is what Scientology is all about?</p>
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		By: jgg2012		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26516</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jgg2012]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 21:45:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26516</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26282&quot;&gt;Jose Chung&lt;/a&gt;.

Toilet paper never punched anyone.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26282">Jose Chung</a>.</p>
<p>Toilet paper never punched anyone.</p>
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		<title>
		By: freespirit		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26496</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[freespirit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 18:54:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26496</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26316&quot;&gt;Madora Pennington&lt;/a&gt;.

I think you raise a really good point. In all the postings I&#039;ve read, not enough is said about Miscavige&#039;s personal finances. It is reported that he is worth at least  $50M. But he had nothing and this money was made while he was in the SO (mostly after he made himself COB). So how is it that most SO members live in stark poverty and this man has millions made while he has been in the SO despite the heavy restrictions of staff involvement with external influences laid out in policies. Can someone please explain this to me?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26316">Madora Pennington</a>.</p>
<p>I think you raise a really good point. In all the postings I&#8217;ve read, not enough is said about Miscavige&#8217;s personal finances. It is reported that he is worth at least  $50M. But he had nothing and this money was made while he was in the SO (mostly after he made himself COB). So how is it that most SO members live in stark poverty and this man has millions made while he has been in the SO despite the heavy restrictions of staff involvement with external influences laid out in policies. Can someone please explain this to me?</p>
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		By: hiatus57		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26454</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[hiatus57]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 11:46:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26454</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[LRH was a very astute business man and if the COB creature followed Green on white there would be no problems.

But like most humanoids he simply cannot do it. Knows best (Out Grade IV like most cases)as usual

I have never undrstood why people cannot simply read a policy letter, duplicate it and follow it.  I remember back on staff thinking how great this stuff is you don&#039;t even have to think about it.  Everythings already laid on and makes life easy.

Simplicity is the key, LRh has done all the work, Oh I fogot he wrote it down in simple to understand forms and this upset people as they never managed to do this or he nicked it from somewhere else.

So bloody what if it works use it and stop whinging like a an old tart.

LOL]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LRH was a very astute business man and if the COB creature followed Green on white there would be no problems.</p>
<p>But like most humanoids he simply cannot do it. Knows best (Out Grade IV like most cases)as usual</p>
<p>I have never undrstood why people cannot simply read a policy letter, duplicate it and follow it.  I remember back on staff thinking how great this stuff is you don&#8217;t even have to think about it.  Everythings already laid on and makes life easy.</p>
<p>Simplicity is the key, LRh has done all the work, Oh I fogot he wrote it down in simple to understand forms and this upset people as they never managed to do this or he nicked it from somewhere else.</p>
<p>So bloody what if it works use it and stop whinging like a an old tart.</p>
<p>LOL</p>
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		By: remoteviewed		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26419</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[remoteviewed]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 04:25:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26419</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26399&quot;&gt;ThetaPotata&lt;/a&gt;.

I totally understand Theta.

No matter how many times Ron tells regs that they are supposed to sell auditing not results. They seem to get some idea in the head to give PCs wild expectations AKA Hidden Standards on what certain are supposed to do.

I remember doing a D of P on a guy who actually believed that levitation was the EP of a certain RD he was on.

I mean .....

Sheeesh!

One of the few times in my life that I was left totally speechless ;)

The HRD is a perfect example of RD or action becoming a fad( and I&#039;ve seen quite a few of them come and go except the current fad which seems to go on forever and that is the PC has withholds or evil purposes toward COB or whatever anyhoo..) that would handle everything that was wrong with a case.

Mayo and his inner circle was a big promoter of this idea. I mean there was some crazy shit like they&#039;d continue to do the RD over out int, lists, ruds, engrams, PTS, ethics whatever because the RD would eventually sort all this out.

You know as if the guy was in the Non Interference zone after starting the Rundown!

FPRD same thing even with Mayo gone.

Why?

Because there are a lot of auditors and C/Ses who have what the Ol&#039;man calls a &quot;magical complex&quot; in C/S Series 2.

New RD gets issued and immediately some idiots think its the solution to everything.

You see the same thing on the administrative level with &quot;Ideal Orgs&quot;.

I mean if there is a conspiracy beyond the one many of us theorize about. It is a conspiracy of stupidity and lunacy which is evident in all those emails that Mike was posting on his blog and this one.

Sheeesh.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26399">ThetaPotata</a>.</p>
<p>I totally understand Theta.</p>
<p>No matter how many times Ron tells regs that they are supposed to sell auditing not results. They seem to get some idea in the head to give PCs wild expectations AKA Hidden Standards on what certain are supposed to do.</p>
<p>I remember doing a D of P on a guy who actually believed that levitation was the EP of a certain RD he was on.</p>
<p>I mean &#8230;..</p>
<p>Sheeesh!</p>
<p>One of the few times in my life that I was left totally speechless 😉</p>
<p>The HRD is a perfect example of RD or action becoming a fad( and I&#8217;ve seen quite a few of them come and go except the current fad which seems to go on forever and that is the PC has withholds or evil purposes toward COB or whatever anyhoo..) that would handle everything that was wrong with a case.</p>
<p>Mayo and his inner circle was a big promoter of this idea. I mean there was some crazy shit like they&#8217;d continue to do the RD over out int, lists, ruds, engrams, PTS, ethics whatever because the RD would eventually sort all this out.</p>
<p>You know as if the guy was in the Non Interference zone after starting the Rundown!</p>
<p>FPRD same thing even with Mayo gone.</p>
<p>Why?</p>
<p>Because there are a lot of auditors and C/Ses who have what the Ol&#8217;man calls a &#8220;magical complex&#8221; in C/S Series 2.</p>
<p>New RD gets issued and immediately some idiots think its the solution to everything.</p>
<p>You see the same thing on the administrative level with &#8220;Ideal Orgs&#8221;.</p>
<p>I mean if there is a conspiracy beyond the one many of us theorize about. It is a conspiracy of stupidity and lunacy which is evident in all those emails that Mike was posting on his blog and this one.</p>
<p>Sheeesh.</p>
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		By: indie8million		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/they-would-rather-forget-this/#comment-26410</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[indie8million]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Nov 2013 04:03:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=15425#comment-26410</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Ralph Hilton (commented on The Kool Aid Circus Is In Town).

in response to indie8million:

    One thing that I’m keenly interested in is IF DM left in the supposed FIRST step of Super Power – the Justice Rundown. “Justice has been such a disturbance on the whole track, the first thing is to clear up all of the thetan’s injustices.” I remember reading something about this in a promo piece. [...]

It was called the Ethics Repair List. I saw the original in 1978 at Flag and still have a copy :-)
_________________________

Hey Ralph - Sure would like to see THAT repair list. Can you link us to a copy anywhere? 

I would be so amazed if DM left it in as-is.

What was LRH&#039;s stated EP for that, Ralph?  If He leaves it in, I&#039;m sure he&#039;ll use it for endless sec checking so that the people are spending their first 100 hours of Super Power in confessionals instead of repairing injustices they have experienced. 

Ha ha. If it does address past injustices, well, the PC can say &quot;the org treated me badly,&quot; the MAA takes it up with him/her, they are sentenced to another 100 hours of confessionals and THEN declared. 

DM&#039;s super power.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ralph Hilton (commented on The Kool Aid Circus Is In Town).</p>
<p>in response to indie8million:</p>
<p>    One thing that I’m keenly interested in is IF DM left in the supposed FIRST step of Super Power – the Justice Rundown. “Justice has been such a disturbance on the whole track, the first thing is to clear up all of the thetan’s injustices.” I remember reading something about this in a promo piece. [&#8230;]</p>
<p>It was called the Ethics Repair List. I saw the original in 1978 at Flag and still have a copy 🙂<br />
_________________________</p>
<p>Hey Ralph &#8211; Sure would like to see THAT repair list. Can you link us to a copy anywhere? </p>
<p>I would be so amazed if DM left it in as-is.</p>
<p>What was LRH&#8217;s stated EP for that, Ralph?  If He leaves it in, I&#8217;m sure he&#8217;ll use it for endless sec checking so that the people are spending their first 100 hours of Super Power in confessionals instead of repairing injustices they have experienced. </p>
<p>Ha ha. If it does address past injustices, well, the PC can say &#8220;the org treated me badly,&#8221; the MAA takes it up with him/her, they are sentenced to another 100 hours of confessionals and THEN declared. </p>
<p>DM&#8217;s super power.</p>
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