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	Comments on: Desperation in Clearwater	</title>
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	<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/</link>
	<description>Something Can Be Done About It</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2020 20:11:25 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Stefan		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-369069</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stefan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2020 20:11:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-369069</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-369000&quot;&gt;Elsa&lt;/a&gt;.

Jo, tror att kusligheten och mindre roligt och mer allvar med hela skiten började sommaren 1982 när David Miscavige och RTC tog över. Jag är fortfarande glad att vi var ett gäng som då lyckades lämna det hela. 
Nu snart 40 år senare är det intressant att följa hur hela skiten avslöjas alltmer.
Ha det gott:-)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-369000">Elsa</a>.</p>
<p>Jo, tror att kusligheten och mindre roligt och mer allvar med hela skiten började sommaren 1982 när David Miscavige och RTC tog över. Jag är fortfarande glad att vi var ett gäng som då lyckades lämna det hela.<br />
Nu snart 40 år senare är det intressant att följa hur hela skiten avslöjas alltmer.<br />
Ha det gott:-)</p>
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		<title>
		By: Elsa		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-369000</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Elsa]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2020 11:31:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-369000</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-368923&quot;&gt;Stefan&lt;/a&gt;.

Hej Stefan, haha, visste inte att Sven fick en stroke, det talade inte mamma om. 
Jag hälsade på Malin en gång för många år sedan och stannade en natt på Fort Harrison hotellet. Tyckte själv det var lite kusligt att bara vara inne i lokalen, eftersom jag readan då visste hur illa det var med CofS. 
Elsa]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-368923">Stefan</a>.</p>
<p>Hej Stefan, haha, visste inte att Sven fick en stroke, det talade inte mamma om.<br />
Jag hälsade på Malin en gång för många år sedan och stannade en natt på Fort Harrison hotellet. Tyckte själv det var lite kusligt att bara vara inne i lokalen, eftersom jag readan då visste hur illa det var med CofS.<br />
Elsa</p>
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		<title>
		By: Stefan		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-368923</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Stefan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2020 19:06:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-368923</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-368888&quot;&gt;Elsa&lt;/a&gt;.

Thank You Elsa for the answer!
I met her back in 1982 at Flag - Her colleague Ragnhild was my auditor there though.
As I come from Sweden we preferably had swedish auditors there.
I only have NICE memories of them:-)
I guess she unfortunately has to be disconnected from you.
Her brother Sven I had a phone conversation with some 2-3 years ago and he had had a stroke so he wasn´t in the best shape.
Regards, &quot;hälsningar&quot; from Sweden!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-368888">Elsa</a>.</p>
<p>Thank You Elsa for the answer!<br />
I met her back in 1982 at Flag &#8211; Her colleague Ragnhild was my auditor there though.<br />
As I come from Sweden we preferably had swedish auditors there.<br />
I only have NICE memories of them:-)<br />
I guess she unfortunately has to be disconnected from you.<br />
Her brother Sven I had a phone conversation with some 2-3 years ago and he had had a stroke so he wasn´t in the best shape.<br />
Regards, &#8220;hälsningar&#8221; from Sweden!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Elsa		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-368888</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Elsa]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2020 12:49:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-368888</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-250746&quot;&gt;Stefan&lt;/a&gt;.

Yes, Malin (my aunt) is still there.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-250746">Stefan</a>.</p>
<p>Yes, Malin (my aunt) is still there.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Blain		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251459</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Blain]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jan 2019 20:01:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-251459</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251029&quot;&gt;Idle Morgue&lt;/a&gt;.

How about a petition on this blog,say,that can be signed online and sent to the FBI, and IRS stating that we wish a review on Scientology&#039;s tax status, abuses, etc. It is pretty obvious that these agencies fear this cult for its fair game policies, and may well have scientologists on their payrolls ready to snitch out any anti scientology action. RICO act violations seem to abound in this cult. 
 &quot; First see what is right before your eyes, then all else will be known to you.&quot;- Jesus]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251029">Idle Morgue</a>.</p>
<p>How about a petition on this blog,say,that can be signed online and sent to the FBI, and IRS stating that we wish a review on Scientology&#8217;s tax status, abuses, etc. It is pretty obvious that these agencies fear this cult for its fair game policies, and may well have scientologists on their payrolls ready to snitch out any anti scientology action. RICO act violations seem to abound in this cult.<br />
 &#8221; First see what is right before your eyes, then all else will be known to you.&#8221;- Jesus</p>
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		<title>
		By: georgemwhite		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251197</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[georgemwhite]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jan 2019 12:44:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-251197</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251078&quot;&gt;Wynski&lt;/a&gt;.

Thanks,  I heard he was living in Texas or Arizona but avoiding public comment.  What years did you engage in Scientology?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251078">Wynski</a>.</p>
<p>Thanks,  I heard he was living in Texas or Arizona but avoiding public comment.  What years did you engage in Scientology?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Wynski		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251078</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Wynski]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2019 20:17:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-251078</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251016&quot;&gt;georgemwhite&lt;/a&gt;.

I don&#039;t know.  I heard that after leaving years ago, he no longer was a scientologist.  Just a rumor though.

Remember he was uplines his first post was D/CO Gold I think)and saw a lot of the DM crap.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251016">georgemwhite</a>.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know.  I heard that after leaving years ago, he no longer was a scientologist.  Just a rumor though.</p>
<p>Remember he was uplines his first post was D/CO Gold I think)and saw a lot of the DM crap.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Foolproof		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251052</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Foolproof]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2019 17:03:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-251052</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251024&quot;&gt;Richard&lt;/a&gt;.

Hah! Ok! Yes I can take a joke. But as long as you know this dude is not a joke but a con. And why don&#039;t you read the Tech Volumes or something if you are still interested.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251024">Richard</a>.</p>
<p>Hah! Ok! Yes I can take a joke. But as long as you know this dude is not a joke but a con. And why don&#8217;t you read the Tech Volumes or something if you are still interested.</p>
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		<title>
		By: PeaceMaker		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251045</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[PeaceMaker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2019 16:33:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-251045</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251029&quot;&gt;Idle Morgue&lt;/a&gt;.

IM, I think the main issue in the US is that a rather extremist &quot;christian&quot; religious establishment holds a lot of sway, both believing in a radical notion of religious &quot;freedom&quot; that means unaccountability and even lawlessness, and fearing that government crackdowns on the most abusive &quot;religious&quot; groups, could lead to scrutiny of the questionable practices of quite a few others, and the airing of a lot of dirty laundry.  

For instance, Jerry Fallwell&#039;s (the &quot;moral majority&quot;) Liberty University policies such as forbidding interracial dating caused them to be banned from government financial aid programs including those for students, and though that policy has since been rescinded, theye&#039;ve had to walk a thin line and compromise on some other policies in order to protect their non-profit status and access to government programs; Bob Jones  University has had similar issues, and Brigham Young University doesn&#039;t qualify for government research grants.  Benny Hinn&#039;s prosperity gospel ministry was raided by the IRS and Postal Service investigators two years ago, after several skirmishes, and his practices were not much, if any, worse than those of a slew of other ministries still flying under the radar.

People in the US still seem to be unready to widely support accountability by groups designated as religious.  Many still belong to or support various groups, ministries and leaders who could themselves be called to account.

While I think there is some prospect of doing something about the most extreme and abusive groups like Scientology, and several examples including those of the FLDS and the Catholic church seem to provide some hope, it seems to me that it&#039;s likely going to require a generational change for people to be more willing to question and even confront religious groups.  Even the simplest accountability, such as requiring groups receiving religious-base tax exemption to have publicly available financial statements - as is required of other non-profits, is the law in many other countries, and is something that  would undercut abusive groups like Scientology by forcing them to reveal how they actually spend their  money - seems far off.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251029">Idle Morgue</a>.</p>
<p>IM, I think the main issue in the US is that a rather extremist &#8220;christian&#8221; religious establishment holds a lot of sway, both believing in a radical notion of religious &#8220;freedom&#8221; that means unaccountability and even lawlessness, and fearing that government crackdowns on the most abusive &#8220;religious&#8221; groups, could lead to scrutiny of the questionable practices of quite a few others, and the airing of a lot of dirty laundry.  </p>
<p>For instance, Jerry Fallwell&#8217;s (the &#8220;moral majority&#8221;) Liberty University policies such as forbidding interracial dating caused them to be banned from government financial aid programs including those for students, and though that policy has since been rescinded, theye&#8217;ve had to walk a thin line and compromise on some other policies in order to protect their non-profit status and access to government programs; Bob Jones  University has had similar issues, and Brigham Young University doesn&#8217;t qualify for government research grants.  Benny Hinn&#8217;s prosperity gospel ministry was raided by the IRS and Postal Service investigators two years ago, after several skirmishes, and his practices were not much, if any, worse than those of a slew of other ministries still flying under the radar.</p>
<p>People in the US still seem to be unready to widely support accountability by groups designated as religious.  Many still belong to or support various groups, ministries and leaders who could themselves be called to account.</p>
<p>While I think there is some prospect of doing something about the most extreme and abusive groups like Scientology, and several examples including those of the FLDS and the Catholic church seem to provide some hope, it seems to me that it&#8217;s likely going to require a generational change for people to be more willing to question and even confront religious groups.  Even the simplest accountability, such as requiring groups receiving religious-base tax exemption to have publicly available financial statements &#8211; as is required of other non-profits, is the law in many other countries, and is something that  would undercut abusive groups like Scientology by forcing them to reveal how they actually spend their  money &#8211; seems far off.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sharon		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251043</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sharon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jan 2019 16:15:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=960145#comment-251043</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251029&quot;&gt;Idle Morgue&lt;/a&gt;.

Thank you so much for your reply.  I was genuinely interested and appreciate your taking the time to respond.  I find the reaction to Scientology in the U.S. chilling.  As a result of this series I can at least be vigilant about this cult and if I ever hear anything about it making noise in Canada or trying to advance in any way, I will raise hell with our elected officials and ensure as many people as possible know about its dangerous methods of control.  Of course, Mike &#038; Leah&#039;s series has probably already reached millions of Canadians so they are, like me, more aware of what this cult is all about.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/desperation-in-clearwater/#comment-251029">Idle Morgue</a>.</p>
<p>Thank you so much for your reply.  I was genuinely interested and appreciate your taking the time to respond.  I find the reaction to Scientology in the U.S. chilling.  As a result of this series I can at least be vigilant about this cult and if I ever hear anything about it making noise in Canada or trying to advance in any way, I will raise hell with our elected officials and ensure as many people as possible know about its dangerous methods of control.  Of course, Mike &amp; Leah&#8217;s series has probably already reached millions of Canadians so they are, like me, more aware of what this cult is all about.</p>
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