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	Comments on: The OT&#8217;s Saved Clearwater	</title>
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	<description>Something Can Be Done About It</description>
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		<title>
		By: Dead Man Talking		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-503781</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dead Man Talking]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Nov 2022 02:34:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-503781</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498977&quot;&gt;Dead Man Talking Bill Straass&lt;/a&gt;.

I can understand that. Bill; but is it not tue that CMDR Urquhart was the one who wrote the FO that established the RPF?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498977">Dead Man Talking Bill Straass</a>.</p>
<p>I can understand that. Bill; but is it not tue that CMDR Urquhart was the one who wrote the FO that established the RPF?</p>
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		<title>
		By: GL		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499451</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[GL]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Oct 2022 01:50:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499451</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498901&quot;&gt;OTD&lt;/a&gt;.

I still reckon he that he was visiting a French zoo (and trying to work out a name for his evil supervillain) he overheard a child saying, &quot;Ze gnu! I want to see ze gnu.&quot; That&#039;s it, he thought. I&#039;ll just swap the &quot;z&quot; for an &quot;x&quot; which makes the word sound so much spacey (not Kevin) and intergalacticky and evillier.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498901">OTD</a>.</p>
<p>I still reckon he that he was visiting a French zoo (and trying to work out a name for his evil supervillain) he overheard a child saying, &#8220;Ze gnu! I want to see ze gnu.&#8221; That&#8217;s it, he thought. I&#8217;ll just swap the &#8220;z&#8221; for an &#8220;x&#8221; which makes the word sound so much spacey (not Kevin) and intergalacticky and evillier.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aquamarine		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499137</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aquamarine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 22:19:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499137</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498912&quot;&gt;Todd Cray&lt;/a&gt;.

Right!  Or how about...&quot;...devastation all around us, but our synagogue was untouched.  We ARE the Chosen People!&quot;   I mean, can you even IMAGINE Jewish adherents posting something like that on social media, or American Muslims crowing about their mosque  not being harmed due to  the hurricane, nor would any adherents of any sane,  decent Christian denomination.  None of these people would EVER communicate this way on social media - to do so is at best in very bad taste, and at worst, cruel.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498912">Todd Cray</a>.</p>
<p>Right!  Or how about&#8230;&#8221;&#8230;devastation all around us, but our synagogue was untouched.  We ARE the Chosen People!&#8221;   I mean, can you even IMAGINE Jewish adherents posting something like that on social media, or American Muslims crowing about their mosque  not being harmed due to  the hurricane, nor would any adherents of any sane,  decent Christian denomination.  None of these people would EVER communicate this way on social media &#8211; to do so is at best in very bad taste, and at worst, cruel.</p>
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		<title>
		By: I Yawnalot		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499104</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[I Yawnalot]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 18:05:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499104</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499065&quot;&gt;safetyguy&lt;/a&gt;.

Laugh &#038; and a good one at that. It&#039;s very refreshing your &#039;just me&#039; gets straight to the point!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499065">safetyguy</a>.</p>
<p>Laugh &amp; and a good one at that. It&#8217;s very refreshing your &#8216;just me&#8217; gets straight to the point!</p>
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		<title>
		By: I Yawnalot		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499103</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[I Yawnalot]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 17:56:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499103</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499036&quot;&gt;Aquamarine&lt;/a&gt;.

Kind words Aqua, thank you, and they could only come from someone who sees such things as what poets, writers &#038; artists have for eons grappled to communicate. Religion, unfortunately has played on that too and created a quagmire of belief, then set it up as a pseudo sanctuary for the unwary.
Hubbard tapped into such areas of the human spirits desire to simply be itself. For all his apparent genius of observation he just could control himself and used it to dominate, and from my perspective got lost in the money &#038; power of it all. He had a huge chip on his shoulder and shoved it down everyone&#039;s throat. If he would have simply not tried to take the establishment on in a toe to toe &#039;fist fight&#039; and instead quietly got on with protecting the betterment he was capable of delivering with his more simpler auditing, we&#039;d all have a better chance of using it for some good.
But no, everything was about him and his delusions of grandeur,  no matter how much he lied to the contrary. It must have been a very dark shadow that passed over his soul when he realized he hadn&#039;t found the cure all, hence wasn&#039;t &#039;cause&#039; after all. Then went into hiding to die a lonely death. 
In simple terms. he fucked up badly and then let someone like Miscavige sit on his moldy throne.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499036">Aquamarine</a>.</p>
<p>Kind words Aqua, thank you, and they could only come from someone who sees such things as what poets, writers &amp; artists have for eons grappled to communicate. Religion, unfortunately has played on that too and created a quagmire of belief, then set it up as a pseudo sanctuary for the unwary.<br />
Hubbard tapped into such areas of the human spirits desire to simply be itself. For all his apparent genius of observation he just could control himself and used it to dominate, and from my perspective got lost in the money &amp; power of it all. He had a huge chip on his shoulder and shoved it down everyone&#8217;s throat. If he would have simply not tried to take the establishment on in a toe to toe &#8216;fist fight&#8217; and instead quietly got on with protecting the betterment he was capable of delivering with his more simpler auditing, we&#8217;d all have a better chance of using it for some good.<br />
But no, everything was about him and his delusions of grandeur,  no matter how much he lied to the contrary. It must have been a very dark shadow that passed over his soul when he realized he hadn&#8217;t found the cure all, hence wasn&#8217;t &#8217;cause&#8217; after all. Then went into hiding to die a lonely death.<br />
In simple terms. he fucked up badly and then let someone like Miscavige sit on his moldy throne.</p>
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		<title>
		By: safetyguy		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499065</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[safetyguy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 12:24:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499065</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499007&quot;&gt;Aquamarine&lt;/a&gt;.

Well, at least yours was tongue in cheek and not head up butt like corn cobs would be.

But that is just me.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499007">Aquamarine</a>.</p>
<p>Well, at least yours was tongue in cheek and not head up butt like corn cobs would be.</p>
<p>But that is just me.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aquamarine		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499036</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aquamarine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 03:11:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499036</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499024&quot;&gt;I Yawnalot&lt;/a&gt;.

I love your comment because it comes right from the heart.  Yawn, don&#039;t regret what you did.  Don&#039;t regret the years you gave to the cult, because you cared, because you wanted to help people, because you wanted the world to be a better place for everyone.  This desire of yours - actually what might be not only a desire but a need to help, to make conditions better for mankind - its beautiful  It is &quot; OT&quot;  The natural, unstrained, help flow - it is the highest aesthetic.  At least, that&#039;s what eons of famous poets and philosophers including Shakespeare have said.   Be glad that you have this as part of you.   You haven&#039;t  wasted  it.   THEY wasted it.  They wasted this wonderful quality, this ability of yours to CARE about others - about people you possibly didn&#039;t even know - to care and dedicate yourself to the betterment of others.  There&#039;s no shame in this - for YOU.  The SHAME is THEIRS.  For not using what you offered.  For ABusing what you offered.  I&#039;ll bet plenty of people have recognized this quality in you and it has NOT been wasted on them.  This precious quality, this high ability to perceive that truly helping othesr is helping oneself - this is &quot;OT&quot;.  I mean, you can call it OT or you can call it whatever you like, but its the best of a person, the highest and best within each of us.    No, no you must never regret those years because you offered yourself to help and let yourself be vulnerable.   You were being yourself.  You were expressing yourself in a way that was very natural to you that also is - I&#039;m going to use this word, with no exaggeration - exalted.  The betterment of others being at the same time your betterment.  This is an exalted operating state.  Again, don&#039;t believe me; writers down the ages have all said this.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499024">I Yawnalot</a>.</p>
<p>I love your comment because it comes right from the heart.  Yawn, don&#8217;t regret what you did.  Don&#8217;t regret the years you gave to the cult, because you cared, because you wanted to help people, because you wanted the world to be a better place for everyone.  This desire of yours &#8211; actually what might be not only a desire but a need to help, to make conditions better for mankind &#8211; its beautiful  It is &#8221; OT&#8221;  The natural, unstrained, help flow &#8211; it is the highest aesthetic.  At least, that&#8217;s what eons of famous poets and philosophers including Shakespeare have said.   Be glad that you have this as part of you.   You haven&#8217;t  wasted  it.   THEY wasted it.  They wasted this wonderful quality, this ability of yours to CARE about others &#8211; about people you possibly didn&#8217;t even know &#8211; to care and dedicate yourself to the betterment of others.  There&#8217;s no shame in this &#8211; for YOU.  The SHAME is THEIRS.  For not using what you offered.  For ABusing what you offered.  I&#8217;ll bet plenty of people have recognized this quality in you and it has NOT been wasted on them.  This precious quality, this high ability to perceive that truly helping othesr is helping oneself &#8211; this is &#8220;OT&#8221;.  I mean, you can call it OT or you can call it whatever you like, but its the best of a person, the highest and best within each of us.    No, no you must never regret those years because you offered yourself to help and let yourself be vulnerable.   You were being yourself.  You were expressing yourself in a way that was very natural to you that also is &#8211; I&#8217;m going to use this word, with no exaggeration &#8211; exalted.  The betterment of others being at the same time your betterment.  This is an exalted operating state.  Again, don&#8217;t believe me; writers down the ages have all said this.</p>
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		<title>
		By: I Yawnalot		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499024</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[I Yawnalot]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 00:35:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499024</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499007&quot;&gt;Aquamarine&lt;/a&gt;.

You&#039;re not wrong about astounding abilities in people. You have to be tongue in cheek with Scios concept of OT (geezes... they invented that term and here we trying to relate to it, doh!). From what I have seen and experienced in Scientology is that they are pretty good at screwing up people&#039;s lives with how it&#039;s all bad and getting them to forgo their abilities to join the &quot;cause&quot;. Then get them to marvel that they knew where their car keys were or something like that and make them write long SS&#039;s about it! Scientology degrades the world people live in and supplants that with anything good about you is because of Scientology and how wonderful you are that you found Scientology! - that really sucks and is a whopping big lie! It&#039;s gaslighting! If you&#039;ve ever read the early PABs by Hubbard he raves on &#038; on about how the the invalidation of the PCs own home universe was the catalyst of their woes and their entrapment. What he really did was reverse and mask that with Scientology as being the only solution for you &quot;regaining your abilities.&quot; (What if you already have them?) Probably the perfect example is the Life Orientation Course. It is assumed and enforces you to accept you are in a lower condition and makes you do the ethics formulas to get yourself out - ha, what a cruel joke! The Truth Rdn, the Ls (all those nasty overts you have) are similar types of things. Then along with the creation of the SO to oversee and enforce all aspects of Scientology, it&#039;s just a big black pit. No one is permitted to be self determined or creative in Scientology. Reflect on their &#039;command intention&#039; enforcement of obedience for a sec. If there are exceptional people such as celebrities for example in Scientology, they were talented long before Scientology came along. Simple auditing is a nice thing, handles some upsets in life etc but it is turned around to be the carrot you&#039;re always chasing. You never get the initial buzz back the higher you go up the bridge. Insidious!
A friend of mine&#039;s daughter at about 10ish  was given a guitar. In a couple of weeks she was playing along with the radio and singing at the same time, she had no lessons. I wouldn&#039;t have believed it if I hadn&#039;t seen it myself. She was just a natural, a great kid and generally a bit quiet in a world of her own but her musical and art talents were remarkable. I asked her how could she hear a song and then play it? (I was jealous) and more or less she relied with a puzzled look on her face, &quot;that&#039;s the way it&#039;s supposed to be isn&#039;t it?&quot; She&#039;s very much an older teenager now, found boys and I rarely, if ever see her, except as a flash to get somewhere.
My comment was very much tongue in cheek too, my only real bummer about Scientology is I wouldn&#039;t mind the years they stole off me back. Now that would be an OT trick &#038; a 1/2 wouldn&#039;t it?
There&#039;s an old saying, &quot;if you have gotta ask what jazz is, you ain&#039;t ever going to know.&quot; Don&#039;t know if that applies here exactly, but there sure seems some magical type of thing occurs when anyone finds something they really like doing.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499007">Aquamarine</a>.</p>
<p>You&#8217;re not wrong about astounding abilities in people. You have to be tongue in cheek with Scios concept of OT (geezes&#8230; they invented that term and here we trying to relate to it, doh!). From what I have seen and experienced in Scientology is that they are pretty good at screwing up people&#8217;s lives with how it&#8217;s all bad and getting them to forgo their abilities to join the &#8220;cause&#8221;. Then get them to marvel that they knew where their car keys were or something like that and make them write long SS&#8217;s about it! Scientology degrades the world people live in and supplants that with anything good about you is because of Scientology and how wonderful you are that you found Scientology! &#8211; that really sucks and is a whopping big lie! It&#8217;s gaslighting! If you&#8217;ve ever read the early PABs by Hubbard he raves on &amp; on about how the the invalidation of the PCs own home universe was the catalyst of their woes and their entrapment. What he really did was reverse and mask that with Scientology as being the only solution for you &#8220;regaining your abilities.&#8221; (What if you already have them?) Probably the perfect example is the Life Orientation Course. It is assumed and enforces you to accept you are in a lower condition and makes you do the ethics formulas to get yourself out &#8211; ha, what a cruel joke! The Truth Rdn, the Ls (all those nasty overts you have) are similar types of things. Then along with the creation of the SO to oversee and enforce all aspects of Scientology, it&#8217;s just a big black pit. No one is permitted to be self determined or creative in Scientology. Reflect on their &#8216;command intention&#8217; enforcement of obedience for a sec. If there are exceptional people such as celebrities for example in Scientology, they were talented long before Scientology came along. Simple auditing is a nice thing, handles some upsets in life etc but it is turned around to be the carrot you&#8217;re always chasing. You never get the initial buzz back the higher you go up the bridge. Insidious!<br />
A friend of mine&#8217;s daughter at about 10ish  was given a guitar. In a couple of weeks she was playing along with the radio and singing at the same time, she had no lessons. I wouldn&#8217;t have believed it if I hadn&#8217;t seen it myself. She was just a natural, a great kid and generally a bit quiet in a world of her own but her musical and art talents were remarkable. I asked her how could she hear a song and then play it? (I was jealous) and more or less she relied with a puzzled look on her face, &#8220;that&#8217;s the way it&#8217;s supposed to be isn&#8217;t it?&#8221; She&#8217;s very much an older teenager now, found boys and I rarely, if ever see her, except as a flash to get somewhere.<br />
My comment was very much tongue in cheek too, my only real bummer about Scientology is I wouldn&#8217;t mind the years they stole off me back. Now that would be an OT trick &amp; a 1/2 wouldn&#8217;t it?<br />
There&#8217;s an old saying, &#8220;if you have gotta ask what jazz is, you ain&#8217;t ever going to know.&#8221; Don&#8217;t know if that applies here exactly, but there sure seems some magical type of thing occurs when anyone finds something they really like doing.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Aquamarine		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-499007</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Aquamarine]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 21:48:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-499007</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498964&quot;&gt;I Yawnalot&lt;/a&gt;.

Yawn, my whole comment was tongue in cheek.  What I truly believe is that each of us has our own individual &quot;OT&quot; abilities and perceptions which vary in degree and type, person to person, and can vary in degree and type as well within an individual as well, depending upon the situation he or she may be in. 

What about that woman who lifted a car off of her son and saved his life?  How did she, a small woman, do that?

How about Beethoven who composed the most hauntingly beautiful and complicated music although he was mostly deaf?

The above are examples of extreme &quot;OT&quot;ness but infinite examples of unexplained perceptions and unknown abilities exist within all of us.   A mundane example:

One of my Aunts, my mother&#039;s youngest sister, could, from the time she could sit up straight on a piano bench, play chords on the piano.  Someone could sing a melody and from the time she was a small child she could play chords that accompanied that tune very well.  Never had a lesson.  She could just do it. There were 8 children, the family was scraping by in those days and the piano had been left in their small, cramped 5th floor walk up apartment by the former tenants.  All the children banged on the piano but Petra, from the age of 3 or 4, could play chords, and accompany someone singing in any key.  How did she do that?  No one knew.  She just could.

I&#039;m sure you have your own, innate &quot;OT&quot; abilities and perceptions Yawn.  I believe every one of us does.  Now, how these can manifest and where and when and to what degree they manifest can vary a great deal.  

Do I understand this?  No.  But I&#039;ve observed my share of OTness in people who had no certificates on their wall.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498964">I Yawnalot</a>.</p>
<p>Yawn, my whole comment was tongue in cheek.  What I truly believe is that each of us has our own individual &#8220;OT&#8221; abilities and perceptions which vary in degree and type, person to person, and can vary in degree and type as well within an individual as well, depending upon the situation he or she may be in. </p>
<p>What about that woman who lifted a car off of her son and saved his life?  How did she, a small woman, do that?</p>
<p>How about Beethoven who composed the most hauntingly beautiful and complicated music although he was mostly deaf?</p>
<p>The above are examples of extreme &#8220;OT&#8221;ness but infinite examples of unexplained perceptions and unknown abilities exist within all of us.   A mundane example:</p>
<p>One of my Aunts, my mother&#8217;s youngest sister, could, from the time she could sit up straight on a piano bench, play chords on the piano.  Someone could sing a melody and from the time she was a small child she could play chords that accompanied that tune very well.  Never had a lesson.  She could just do it. There were 8 children, the family was scraping by in those days and the piano had been left in their small, cramped 5th floor walk up apartment by the former tenants.  All the children banged on the piano but Petra, from the age of 3 or 4, could play chords, and accompany someone singing in any key.  How did she do that?  No one knew.  She just could.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure you have your own, innate &#8220;OT&#8221; abilities and perceptions Yawn.  I believe every one of us does.  Now, how these can manifest and where and when and to what degree they manifest can vary a great deal.  </p>
<p>Do I understand this?  No.  But I&#8217;ve observed my share of OTness in people who had no certificates on their wall.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dead Man Talking Bill Straass		</title>
		<link>https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498985</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dead Man Talking Bill Straass]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 14:52:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.mikerindersblog.org/?p=2616986#comment-498985</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498833&quot;&gt;Mary Kahn&lt;/a&gt;.

That is what they were doing, Mary.
     The MAA received a Knowledge Report that a girl who left because she refused to abort her child was headed that way.
    It was the greatest good for the greatest number of DM&#039;s dynamics that she get swept out to sea.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://www.mikerindersblog.org/the-ots-saved-clearwater/#comment-498833">Mary Kahn</a>.</p>
<p>That is what they were doing, Mary.<br />
     The MAA received a Knowledge Report that a girl who left because she refused to abort her child was headed that way.<br />
    It was the greatest good for the greatest number of DM&#8217;s dynamics that she get swept out to sea.</p>
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