This email pretty much encapsulates the “think” of the fundamentalist scientologist.
Clubbed seals who have totally bought into the “ideal org” “strategy” and who firmly and stubbornly believe that they can do no wrong (i.e. “it isn’t an overt”) if they are forwarding the survival of “the church.”
See text in red below (all of it is wacky, the red bits especially so).
———- Forwarded message ———-
From: East US Ideal Org Team <email@example.com>
Date: Sun, May 10, 2015 at 4:44 PM
Subject: Getting Your Org Ideal
I want to give you my most sincere encouragement on your adventure to get your Ideal Org funded.
No sugar-coating, it is a hellishly hard job and requires a special brand of defiance and stubbornness against social norms, bank agreement and physical universe barriers. Add to all this that the stakes are beyond life and death, and you’ve got a real knee-slapper of a good time! What a remarkable game!
You will need every LRH datum you ever learned to get though this cycle of action. This is raw 3rd and 4th dynamic auditing over out-ruds and with no correction lists! However, a being always rises to match the size of the games he plays so when this is all over you will know you are a 10 ft tall OT Scientologist, and you will breathe fiery purpose and eat impossible barriers for breakfast. I could not have imagined the wins would be so amazing.
Here are a few useful concepts that I recommend to you on your journey:
1. You cannot pull in a motivator on something that is not an overt.
Just because you break the financial rules, middle class agreements and your accountant’s advice does not mean you will regret it. In fact, the regret comes from NOT stepping up and granting yourself the beingness to do what your honor and integrity demand.
2. Willingness trumps MEST.
As a leader, don’t focus on who controls the most MEST. Focus on who has the biggest purpose and willingness. Invest in willingness. The MEST will follow willingness as sure as dawn follows the night.
3. Choose wisely.
The ups and downs of building an ideal org can either be an adventure or a nightmare. The good news is you get to choose which one.
4. Positive postulate getting done every day, even when its ridiculous (especially when its ridiculous!).
If you do, one day it will be true. On the days when it did not yet come true, ignore the losses and start again the next day. The focus of an eagle and the memory of a goldfish are perfect for this kind of work.
5. Lead by example.
If you are reading this letter you are a leader in your group. That’s a fact. Non-leaders would not read down this far(!). Therefore you carry the responsibility of knowing that what you do will influence what others will do. You need to donate early and often. Lead the way. Show that you are committed to the purpose – even if you have to mock up the winning valence sometimes. Others will follow. If you hold back, they will sense it. I found that the less I resisted the entire cycle of action and my role in it, the more fun and wins I had. For maximum fun and adventure, go “All In”.
6. Finally, keep it up-tone.
Find reasons to laugh often. Eliminate seriousness in your space. If things get solid, put on a funny costume and some dance music. Raise tone first, then raise money.
Bigger than the prize of a shiny new org building is the real prize of true salvation for the people in your area. Maybe its not fair, but realize that they are COUNTING on you to wear your hat and bring off this win. The fate of millions rest on a few slim shoulders in each area.
LRH was the first Ideal Org builder. He went “all in” personally and made his own “credit creak” when establishing the building for St. Hill – the first ideal org. His boldness means that now we have the opportunity to follow directly in his footsteps and do the same for our own areas.
I promise you the victory you will achieve is worth far more than the cost of the battle. The momentary sacrifice now is well rewarded later in massive wins and the knowing confidence of achievement. Once you slay this dragon, you will never be the same. You won’t fear money or “impossible” goals. You’ll have seen the best of your fellow man and know he is worth saving. Your group will take on a beingness and power of its own and mankind will be that much closer to finding freedom.
I think the greatest gift a person can get is the chance to change the world and to be involved in something massive, meaningful and that echos throughout the ages. This is that chance. Grab it and go for it!
An additional comment about the second section highlighted in red.
Not sure where this came from, but I don’t doubt that these words were uttered by L. Ron Hubbard. Though the euphemistic “credit creaking” is not the same as “going into debt” and “filing bankruptcy” but no doubt this is how it is interpreted.
But the biggest difference is that when L. Ron Hubbard bought St. Hill Manor HE OWNED it. It was an investment for HIM. AND he then collected income from the activities that occurred there. AND he collected money from selling it to the church at an enormous profit. no “ideal org humanitarian” gets anything in return other than the “knowing confidence of achievement.”
Sort of omitted in the glowing rah-rah.
The “fate of millions” rest on their shoulders. And this IS what these people believe, and have been INDOCTRINATED into believing.
Right out of KSW#1 — The whole agonized future of this planet, every Man, Woman and Child on it, and your own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology.
The blind and incompetent are leading the blind incompetents.
I want all the whales to go “all in” in 2015 and then we will have enough Ideal Orgs for new public to flock in in their thousands! I thought these whales had received Scientology processing to overcome bank agreements, so why aren’t they going all in right now and getting this job done?
I Just pray ALL will snap out of it and say,hey wait a minute, david miscavage is not the gate keeper of spirit. Wtf,if I stop my communication with my mom who has the human right to not practice a religion if she feels it’s not a thing she personally wants,I please the Eternity of man? My destroying her maternal undying love,will please the gate keeper,the one that sent me to her to be born,now demands me to utterly destroy her if she doesn’t do what david miscavage says? This sounds more like satan than any beautiful afterlife or reincarnation fate. David miscavage is not the gatekeeper,wish they can just see that
Chris Thompson says
When I was a true believer, I could’ve written that letter.
“1. You cannot pull in a motivator on something that is not an overt.
Just because you break the financial rules,”
Has David “let him die” Miscaviage chnged the definition of and overt as he did with floating needles?
Surely this sentence is a contradiction in terms?
i remember this kind of fundraising.
dan drazich says
Sacramento Ideal Org is booming. I saw two staff when I drove by today.
I’m bogged down on an M/U regarding “the memory of a goldfish.”
1. Does it mean the ability of a goldfish to remember?
2. Does it mean someone’s remembrance of some pet goldfish?
3. And what does it have to with the topic?
I guess I had better spend about 40 hours looking up each word, doing a clay demo, getting Word Cleared on the meter, redo the Student Hat and Comm Course, buy an intensive or two of auditing, and see if that handles my problem with goldfish!
“You will need every LRH datum you ever learned”
What about LRH saying you should not engage in fundraising?
mimsey borogrove says
Re: the red. I thought that. I have the second mortgage to prove it with. And I’ll be paying for that idiocy for years to come. Mimsey
“can’t pull-in a motivator if you don’t commit an overt” Yea, well how about neglecting your family and your financial responsibilities by draining all of your resources so that idiots can waste your money. That my friend is a huge overt of incredible ignorance. Neglecting future consequences. A huge overt of omission. The mortgage, the kids college fund, retirement etc. Are all of no importance compared to giving it all to the church. Why is that? Because you my friend, are of no importance to the church.
Marie guerin says
Looking back , when I was “in” , I would have rolled my eyes upon reading this email , deleted it but feel helpless and threatened by the insanity of it.
Then Debbie Cook showed up and saved me…
Hmm, I’m wondering if our Mr. Nesbitt has a business and if does what his reaction would be if someone owed him money, and, instead of paying this debt to Mr. Nesbitt, the person used it for an Ideal Org donation instead. I am pondering how he’d like being ripped off by a fellow clam with such a donation as an excuse.
“Very well done on breaking this financial rule about paying me for my goods and services in order to make this stellar donation to your Ideal Org! You truly are a being who is NOT PTS to the middle class!”
Somehow I don’t think Mr. Nesbitt would be saying this, do you?
Yet, its fine to not pay your credit cards, your car payments, your mortgage, your taxes, etc. THESE people you can rip off – sure, that’s OK, not an overt, that’s fine.
Its really kind of sickening to confront. My mind keeps pulling me here and there to get off the subject.
Todd Cray says
WOW! Great read!
I’m so glad that “by reading this far down” I have proven myself a leader! Didn’t cost me a dime!
About LRH’s “credit creak:” He is indeed an example. He never missed an opportunity to cheat anybody he met out of money, from trying to steal Jack Parson’s boat, to mooching off the VA, to unpaid this and unpaid that–usually all done to “friends!” If you ever had any business with the guy, you WOULD end up getting ripped off! That included providing (or failing to) for his ex-wives and own children!
And if you didn’t have money he could snatch from you, he’d gladly make you into a free-labor slave. A true example, that one! You couldn’t shake his hand without counting your fingers afterward!
But if more proof for the scn “success plan” is needed, all they have to do is google Richie Acunto–the guy who was rolling in the dough, gave $10 million and ended up being unable to even pay the rent for the storage locker where he kept his gaudy trophies. Needless to say, once the money was gone, scn dropped Richie like a hot potato!
If that’s not enough, the stories of several cultists come to mind who ended up killing themselves under severe financial duress. So if you’re standing tall” as promised, it may be because you’re standing on the ledge of a tall building, ready to jump!
John Locke says
Todd, what ever happened to Richie? He dropped me as a contact after I told him about what was happening in the cult (about 9 years ago). If he’d listened to me he’s still be a multi-millionaire and living in that nice BH mansion. I really liked that place too. smh
I have never heard or read anything about willingness trumping MEST. I regret every dime and the cost of lost opportunities that I spent on Scientology. Trying to live on under $6,000/year has no reward, no positive outcome – it is a painful and dark existence that no amount of auditing or delusion about serving a higher purpose can hide. That I can now eat well and have a decent place to live and have time to spend with my family and friends is something I appreciate every day. This is not the result of anything to do with Scientology, but through my own self-determinism and the immediate result of escaping from the control and influence of the people running the Church.
A fervent “Amen”, RK.
Gus Cox says
And hearty “Hear Hear!” here! Life is good now 🙂
So one can’t pull in a motivator if one does not commit an overt.
Buying things and not paying for them is not an overt.
Using goods and services with the agreement that one will pay for them, and then not paying for them, and instead, using that money to buy David Miscavige some real estate, is not an overt.
(It isn’t? Wouldn’t this be the definition of criminal exchange? Getting something for nothing?…Oh, I see! Ordinarily, yes, but in this instance, absolutely not!)
Ergo, because one has not committed any overt, no motivator can be pulled in.
(Um, are you sure? Because there’s a tow truck in my driveway with some guy who says he’s repossessing my car. Are you sure I didn’t pull this in?)
If they want to reach out to the public and solicit Ideal Org donations through a sponsored suicidathon then I would be willing to chip in a few Euros and I guess a lot of other wog public as well. This is maybe one route for them to consider.
The Oracle says
All of this “Ideal Org” standard is malarky. Not one reference anywhere from Hubbard about staff beggars. The money all goes to David Miscavige. He decides how and when to shop.
Why can’t these people just own up to what they are doing and write checks directly to DM? Why can’t someone hold one of these events and ask people to throw money at Davis Micavige?
The Orgs do NOT belong to them. They are NOT buying ANYTHING for themselves. If International Management was SUCCESSFUL they wouldn’t NEED BEGGARS in the first place.
I personally loved the part where the best thing to have as the donate button was being pushed was the memory of a goldfish…that was the only honest thing said in that diatribe.
Rick Mycroft says
The focus of an eagle, the memory of a goldfish, and the brain of a stunned rabbit.
Have a question if someone has a moment to respond. How is ones “eternity” risked if one reads negative data about Scientology? What does “eternity” mean to a Scientologist?
Mike Rinder says
WHOEVER YOU ARE, PLEASE DONT POST COMMENTS UNDER MY NAME. I DONT KNOW WHY YOU WOULD THINK THIS IS A GOOD IDEA?
Grace24/7, according to what the Cult’s scriptures say, there would be no threat to the “eternity” of the spiritual being if one reads negative data about the cult. But, the Cult is full of data points that are in direct conflict with each other. Insanity cannot always be logically parsed…
Ann B Watson says
Hi Mike, YEAH! The minute I read that post I said WTF & I don’t usually say that except under extreme duress. ff forever Ann B.
Thank you Mike Rinder for taking the time to respond to my question. Your blog is so insightful and smart. I support your efforts to educate others and admire your tenacity and spirit!
Gus Cox, thanks for the in depth explanation of “eternity” from a Scn perspective. Fascinating info and I understand now why the psychological break from corporate is so difficult for it’s members. There are so many facets to this complex guiding-belief system.
Jose Chung says
Answer for Grace,
Good question but eternity is defined in most all dictionaries similarly.
If you read something negative about anything has the same impact on what you think next , if that makes you do counter survival things and you cannot see right from wrong there maybe a short or long learning curve. Truthfully we all live forever (eternity) and the mest universe is a gigantic learning machine
so eventually you will achieve survival in some manner or fashion as that’s all you can do for eternity
is survive good or bad. I would not go overboard on small things , making mountains out of mole hills
or hang out with merchants of chaos.
Thank you Jose for your reply to my question. I think I understand what you expressed. So Scn “eternity” is viewed as survival with positive or negative consequences based on decisions and environmental influences. That seems to put a lot of pressure on a being to be so performance driven versus an orthodox religion which believes you can’t “earn” eternity but it’s given by a Supreme Being as a gift of grace.
Gus Cox says
To expand on that a little – In Scientology, “Eternity” also has to do with the carrot they dangle in front of everybody: The ability to recall your past lives, the ability to remain a conscious being after your present body dies and to choose your next body (“go to the maternity ward and pick up a new one!”), and to live your next lifetime without forgetting this one. And on and on.
Wouldn’t that be freakin’ great?! I think so.
Scientology’s “Eternity” is immortality – fully aware of your past, and able to select your next lives. You wanna be born rich? In another country? Hell, even another planet, I suppose. You can do that if you want. That’s the carrot Scientology dangles with their OT levels, and that’s what members think they are going to lose if they leave or get declared suppressive.
I think that’s why Independent Scientology is a good stepping stone out of Corporate Scientology, even though I personally don’t participate in it. A person can leave the Cult without without feeling like he’s “sacrificing his eternity.” After all, there are more Class VIII and XII auditors outside the cult than inside, these days. So they can still practice Scientology, but without the IAS and all that other bullshit. And probably truer to standard Scn. than can be had in the Orgs now.
Of course I may be wrong about all that, but that’s how I see it anyways, as an Ex-Scientology kid.
Toot TO OT says
It’s awful they are BULLYING people into making decisions that they will end up regretting long after this place shuts down. I hope soon.
I spoke to someone that is “still in” – OT8 – last week. They are PISSED. The frustration is with MANAGEMENT. The management of the place is out of control. I think the word they used was lemmings.
I asked them WHY AREN’T YOU LEAVING!?! The answer is simple yet complicated.
They have a child that has a job working for other scientologists and this child is dependent on the income. The scientologists they work for are opinion leaders in their field so they are trapped and forced to remain in good graces for this child. Otherwise they and their spouse would be out.
Starting over out in the real world was SUPER INTIMIDATING for me. It has taken over 10 years to really understand that this scientology cult cannot scare me anymore. They cannot scare my family either. We are safe and sound and doing better than ever. PLUS we are actually calm and happy humans.
If you are still in – JUST DO IT. Leave! Weather the storm. Start the steps toward being yourself again. There are lots of people that can and will gladly help you. Don’t worry about a job, money, house, food…those things can be created overnight. You are a good person and work hard. Depend on yourself and your own abilities. Have courage!
Bob Marley has a great quote: “Life is one big road with lots of signs. So when you riding through the ruts, don’t complicate your mind. Flee from hate, mischief and jealousy. Don’t bury your thoughts, put your vision to reality. Wake Up and Live!”
Scott Pilutik says
Also enjoyed the pitch to transcending the “middle class” because it’s precisely half true–you will indeed leave the middle class.
Scott Pilutik says
“Just because you break the financial rules, middle class agreements and your accountant’s advice does not mean you will regret it. In fact, the regret comes from NOT stepping up and granting yourself the beingness to do what your honor and integrity demand.”
“Well I guess that makes sense. Thanks mister. NOW C’MON 34 RED!!!”
Alfo 4ever says
Thanks a lot Mike for pointing this out. It a huge overt to flow energy to an SP for it increases his ability to suppress. This something that any conscious scientologist should take a good look at.
They think the reluctance to give turns into happiness when one forks over the money–but the real truth is that after one reluctantly forks over the money a drop in havingness occurs which results in depression. Isn’t it odd that there is no LRH or DM reference on the drop in havingness.
As my hand slaps my forehead, I’m reminded of HCO PL 28 Jan 65, How to maintain credit standing and solvency:
The secret of solvency is:
1. Make a lot of money.
2. Spend less than you make.
3. Make it before you have to spend it.
4. Gather bit by bit a cushion of cash to fall back on and don’t ever fall back on it.
5. Keep your credit excellent as a second cushion.
6. Refuse to spend reserves.
7. Realize that collective thought regarding finance is just bank and that bank is dead against the creation of anything good and all for eating up everything that exists.
Gus Cox says
Ah, yes. “Using policy to stop,” I think they call that 🙂 LOL.
I remember good ol’ Raffi at LA Org trying to get me to borrow money for a course, right after the “Money Seminar.” I was like, “I just did a whole seminar learning NOT to do that!” I refused. Raffi wasn’t happy.
Of course, none of that counts when it comes to giving money to a reg.
And the frickn’ celebs just let it all happen with their heads in the sand! The more I think about it, and the poor souls who think they are saving humanity by defaulting on their credit cards and mortgages, the angrier I get.
Robert Almblad says
This only works for bubble dwellers… And, confirms for anyone outside the bubble that they are certifiably insane.
Madora P says
WTF? This is such a cringe. How could to this cause any effect except people quitting?
You know Mike, at this point it appears a certain amount of individuals in scientology have figured out that it is all a scam and they’re “all in” on the ruse – for whatever motivation. It’s getting hard to swallow that people are buying into the money making scam as anything but just what it is. When you get to a point where you are telling people to go against the advice of professionals (who’s purpose is to do what’s in your best interests), then you have lost any pretense of sophistication for anything just, right and noble. Another words, you’re just a dick trying to get over.
This is kind of what this religious comedy has turned into.
Roger Hornaday says
There’s desperation in this propaganda. It has all the usual high-sounding buzz words like “eternity”, “high purpose”, they’re COUNTING on us, “freedom”, slaying dragons, blah blah blah. But those aren’t the words that tell the real tale. The word that tells the tale is “NIGHTMARE”. They actually elected to use that word in reference to the scientology experience! It “…can be an adventure or a NIGHTMARE.” They have to say that, don’t they? because that’s everybody’s experience and if you want people to stay on board with you, you have to name the exact charge in order to rehabilitate the purpose. Item #6 on the menu: KEEP IT UP-TONE. Wear a funny costume to keep it up-tone??? That’s code for FAKE IT. This is the breathless moment amidst suns shining and planets swinging when the church ACKNOWLEDGES a membership down-tone problem. All that cheering at the Basel Org opening? That’s “keeping it up-tone!”. This promo confirms my suspicions that NOBODY buys the happy fairyland spin of David Miscavige and everybody is FAKING IT! I mean, “keeping it up-tone”, excuse me.
Idle Morgue says
Have any of OSA bots and lurker’s still in (and reading this blog daily)
gone to the Ideal Org’s that have been open now for 8 years and obnosed for yourself?
I was curious if you actually used the tech?
John Locke says
Idle Morgue, the are OSA Bots because they DO use the tek. Without using the CoS (Cult of Scientology) tek as developed by the cult’s founder, they wouldn’t be the Bots that they are…
John Locke says
Hmm, El Con built an insane cult that is still insane. Well, he got one thing right. Insanity = a dwindling spiral. All those people in the “church” who were/are trained (MANY by Hisself) in ALL his “teck” couldn’t even keep the stats flat. Shows how false it all is/was
Mike Nimble says
John, are you the “John Locke” who used to post on the alt.jfk newsgroups so many years ago? Used to enjoy your acid takedowns of the “nuts”.
John Locke says
Hi Mike. No, I was never really on newsgroups. Except for computer technical ones. I can only imagine what kind of tin foil hat types would/could land on a JFK focused group. LOL
“The focus of an eagle and the memory of a goldfish are perfect for this kind of work” – and the mindset of a lemming. ^^
Doug Parent says
Utterly embarrassing that I was ever a member of that group at one time. At least I can say that I never felt that I fit it, and it’s plain as day as to why. “Graduating Scientology” it’s not a slogan it’s a major life change.
Old Surfer Dude says
The one thing I got out of my time in, Doug, is, I can now spot a cult a mile away. Even if it’s a business.
The Oracle says
So true! The Board of Education is a cult!
This is so disgusting, I don’t have words. It makes me angry, it’s depressing. “A being always rises to match the size of the games he plays” – What?!.. “Just because you break financial rules and don’t take your accountant’s advice doesn’t mean you will regret it” – What??! …”When you give too much money and start to feel worried about it, just put on a clown costume and dance around….” – You’ve got to be kidding me. No. Just no. Please people, wake up. You are not responsible for buying big buildings that you have no ownership in. Don’t give away all your money to a con game. Don’t wreck your family’s financial future for this. It’s a scam. When you take your cow to market, you will meet a man who wants to give you six magic beans for it… don’t do it.
You hear that you theetie-weetie panty-waisted CICS dilletantes! The only thing you’ll regret down the track is not achieving enough bankruptingness to make the ideal org scheme succeed!
This reminds me of the crud posited at fundraisers which went something like this “outflow = inflow, and if you’re outflowing to SCN (THE noblest thing one can do EVER), then it stands to reason you will inflow exponentially”. In others words, by breaking every financial policy in the book (SCN and otherwise) you couldn’t possibly “pull in anything bad” and would be rewarded tenfold for your donations. Yeah – tell that to the people who lost their homes, filed for bankruptcy and threw their lifesavings into the never-ending co$ money-pit – now reduced to abject poverty & little hope for the future. This infuriates me no end.
Classic Michael Bayback line when fundraising
As a newbie, it’s difficult reading the acronyms and understanding but I get the gist. Thanks for the comments to flush out its meaning. I can’t see how anyone can read that depressing directive and then it says “Find reasons to laugh often. Eliminate seriousness in your space”. Please, just give me a minute so I can go puke.
And this: “If you are reading this letter you are a leader in your group. That’s a fact”. Well if that’s the case, I’d tell all my underlings “GET THE HELL OUT OF SCIENTOLOGY. NOW!”.
John Doe says
John Nesbit is creating “tech” on how to handle one’s finances. That it goes against what pretty much everyone else says to do does not matter. You are “disagreeing”!! Hip hip hooray!!
peggy oconnor says
Dear Right side of brain, please meet the Left side of brain. After introductions, activate Frontal Lobe an check for misfires! After complete systems check redo program to the correct morales and values to a non Scientology program that functions in world of today. Please delete LRH programs, Scientology programs, and welcome new functioning brain.
Bruce Maslia says
yep…Atlanta is doing great…LOL Building in disrepair…still in legal fights. Can I add pics….What a joke.
Isn’t it the case with some life insurance policies that your family can still collect on it if you commit suicide after something like two years since taking out the policy, depending on the conditions? I’m not suggesting anyone do this, and of course, the benefactor should be the Church and not your family.
As an outsider looking in, I don’t understand what “salvation” means to Scientologists. I read that its
“earned”. But what are you earning? Salvation from what? Salvation from hell? Salvation from a World War 3? Is there a greater authority you are seeking salvation from? If you can earn it, then why not just take it?
And if there is no God than what has to be saved?
I have observed that Scientology is short on mercy, love and truth. Fairness, goodness, kindness, gentleness, caring for others, the ability to discern good from evil.
The intense navel gazing blinds one’s ability to gaze upon the majesty of God. Being “clear” to me would mean you are acutely aware of God’s presence that brings a peace that surpasses all human understanding.
I pray God will redeem this evil mess.
Salvation to a Scientologist can be stated like this:
Power over things (mest) and people.
Being able to fly around the universe without a body.
In a nutshell, Ron’s goal was power not love and service.
Have any Scientologist ever heard of the “service rundown” the “loving others rundown” the “sacrifice rundown”
Power, Super Power, Super Duper Power Rundown.
Souls (thetans) are even catagories as big and little. Actually, the designation of being and little beings is a doctrine forged in the mind of a dysfunctionional ego.
An ego that craves superiority.
Thank you Brian for explaining the lingo and terminology! I’m able to follow the stories with more clarity now. I do want to say I admire the courage and truth telling that is a common dominator in those who are replying. And many with a great sense of humor even in the midst of hardships experienced. Bravo.
Ann B Watson says
Hi Brian, A great post!! Thank you for your point about power, so true & so intoxicating until I realized that me my soul my abilities my love had been totally usurped @ Ron’s altar to himself & his obsession with ” power over…”& he really believed he was the superior being! I still have to stop myself & recall that in the beginning I bought the whole store, hook line & sinker & it took 4 yrs in SO to realize no one cared for one second about me as myself, just how good a slave I was.Thank you always & take care, Ann B.
I was a teenager. Maybe 18 or 19 around 1970, I was a student at the Geltman Mission in Manhattan. When I was on course I was really wanting to go back to college and study.
I communicated that to Hellen Geltman, wife of Frank Geltman and Class 8 CS at the mission. She spent a long time convincing me that college was a wog goal and that I should put going to college out of my mind and just be a Scientologist.
I listened to her.
The going line at the mission was, “beg borrow but don’t steal” to get money for auditing.
The condescension, the contempt, the arrogance of L Ron Hubbard towards society is one of his diabolical aspects. This caused a psychological split from society which alienate Scientologists from our culture. Ron demonized our culture.
How many young men and women were fooled my the claims, the image made by Ron?
How many young people missed out on quality living to become slave to a delusional dream of a confirmed liar?
PTS to the middle class???????
Such condescending arrogance!!!!
It takes years to uncover these sentiments and then neutralize their effects. I have been out since 82 and I am still uncovering imprinted thoughts that are false knowledge.
He made society Xenu’s bitch and then he made our pain and suffering based on our evil. Look for the evil intention, then resolve our problems.
Always looking within to find evil so that conditions resolve is one of the many hypnotic processes that demoralize and keep slaves obedient.
If you are just getting out of Scientology, you have a long way to go.
It is amazing to me how many X Sea Org members communicate in their blogs or books how they are surprised how nice the wog world is.
L Ron Hubbard third partied our society to us. Making his society the “only one true way to be.”
It takes years and years to vomit out this hypnotic drivel.
Unfortunately you are right, but at least when you walk off L Ron’s bridge you really are on your way. He was one of the sickest minds in the history of mankind. Big Brother is an amateur in comparison.
Nicely said Brian. It is a long road and I’m really glad to be on it rather than the other ‘short one’!
Old Surfer Dude says
Brian, if you haven’t read it already, I highly recommend Jefferson Hawkins book, “Leaving Scientology.” I got in, in ’75 and got out in ’82, like you did.
I did read it Old Surfer. After I found ClamBake I next found his website “Leaving Scientology.” From there I found Marty’s site.
“The fate of millions rest on a few slim shoulders in each area.”
this statement made in the heady days of 87.65XXXXXXXXXX expansion ?!? shouldnt there be many large bodies getting this crap DONE yesterday? especially after over 60 years of recruiting and gat I and gat II and the release of super power as well as the majesty of dynamics that is the basics ….., gosh these pesky parishioners must be as confused as myself as just an observer.
Snake Thompson's Ghost says
“If things get solid, put on a funny costume and some dance music.”
To give him his due, as an always-on performer LRH loved his outfits–sea captain, movie director, etc.–but even he preserved enough dignity not to do this.
Alice Graves says
How about a costume of prison stripes & leg irons, a 40-lb. weight loss for authenticity, and rocking out to “Staying Alive.”
roger gonnet says
As always, and alas, it’s far from the first time; scientology management recommends crimes, thefts, dishonesties, for the sake of… scientology.
tradition! tradition! some “religion” – go into deep debt for them to buy buildings to “save” the world!! HOW?????? after all of these years, still no saving, real “clears” or Postulates truly creating.
Joe Pendleton says
The strategy is almost diabolically simple; to continually “black PR” the concepts of sensible personal financial conduct and planning as very BAD things; as things that essentially are anti theta as they are so in agreement with MEST. And do this so much that it becomes a group virtue or ethic. Along side this is the parallel strategy of forming the group ethic that if you go AGAINST the sensible financial conduct, you are a big being as you are in disagreement with MEST. And actually, you are HEROIC by doing so when you also contribute all this money to the CoS. And I have to stress this is done CONTINUALLY over many years, decades in fact. This is a very good example of how a group ethic is implanted really to the point where one cannot stay in the group and not be in agreement with this ethic. And OF COURSE one is never allowed to actually disagree directly, even in regards to one’s own decisions in this finance area. When you don’t want to contribute on any reg cycle, you are in fact required to justify it (you almost have to plead bankruptcy to be left alone). And a person WILL be asked for the amount they have in the bank, their current debt, income and credit limits. The end result is NO SELF DETERMINISM ALLOWED IN THE AREA.
LRH himself was guilty of this. Two examples. The hco pl which listed duty motivation as the highest morivation, higher than self interest, was a direct way to pre-empt any objections to what one was asked to do for the good of the group, as well as black PRing the concept of any other dynamic if it was in any way in conflict with the third. And the “god send” to regges, PTS to the middle class hco b. (I won’t say more on that here. I assume most of you know how that concept was used to control people’s thoughts and opinions on how to handle their own finances).
I must add though, that the above is of an evil nature. Why? It is the exact opposite of the first goals of Scientology in the basic books, that of the being as the source of his own opinions, viewpoints and postulates and the entire idea of a being’s self determinism. Ron himself was guilty of this and then his successor took it to mega steriod levels.
Doug Sprinkle says
I do not know how that concept was used to control people’s thoughts about finances. Would be curious to hear more about that.
Joe Pendleton says
Doug, this “pts to the middle class” idea was used in the following way:
* first, everyone has to read it, check out on it and AGREE WITH IT (you cannot pass a checkout unless you can demonstrate that the ideas that you are getting checked out on are true).
*then this idea is continually re-inforced by repitition and snide remarks about people who do not quickly give up their money for “wog” reasons – “see, he’s pts to the middle class.”
*during reg cycles, one is confronted with this idea if one does not cough up the dough because of any considerations about their finances. They are first asked to re-read “pts to the middle class” hcob. Then asked if they agree with it. (you don’t disagree with Ron). Then confronted again with the question – “so,are you going to be pts to the middle class” or “so I’m asking you to be a THETAN, go into DISAGREEMENT with the MEST universe and give me that credit card even though your reactive mind is telling you not to” or “Are you going to listen to your reactive mind? Are you going to go into agreement with this degraded society and thier ideas on money and MEST?” And so on and so forth.
There are numerous other questions that are used to beat an individual down in this area. All designed to implant/form this person’s considerations and ideas about this subject FOR him and then get him to robotically respond the way “the group” wants him to.
Doug Sprinkle says
There are two “Scientologys”.
There are the high-ideals of populism and democracy and freedom found in the basic books, mostly written from 1948-1956. This is the 1st Scientology.
The 2nd Scientology began in 1959, when LRH started coming out with HCOPLs and HCOBs. These consistently violated the 1st Scientology. These were filled with authoritarian rule and draconian penalties if you stepped one foot outside the Skinner Box of 100% standard ethics, tech, and admin.
Most Scientologists walk into an org thinking they are in the 1st Scientology – the idealistic Scientology found in the basic books.
All orgs and all staff members run on the 2nd Scientology, never the 1st.
You could only be punished for violating the 2nd Scientology. You could never be accused of a crime for violating anything in a basic book.
No one can be expelled for not following the Creed of the Church of Scientology (1st Scientology). They can only be expelled for not following, or violating the 2nd.
The 1st Scientology was used to recruit you.
The 2nd Scientology is used to bankrupt you and to turn you into a slave.
L Ron Hubbard set this all up completely on purpose and with malice aforethought. The Church of Scientology could not have turned out any other way if this was not so.
John Doe says
I would add to this that there is now a third scientology. This is the scientology of David Miscavige, where the once-sacred writings of L Ron Hubbard have been slowly supplanted by the authority of Command Intention (Miscavige).
It has become a twisted culture, where the likes of people like Tom Cruise and Grant Cardone are lionized and hard-working staff and auditors are belittled as degraded beings.
Len Zinberg says
Scientology = Delusion + Certainty
OK, that was good!
Only 32 hours left to fund Growing Up #Scientology From Cradle to Slave. #GoingClear couldn’t tell all the stories, we will tell the hard ones. The ones of the children who didn’t have a choice. Please chip in what you can and spread the word. Thank you! http://kck.st/1FHl8Cc
Thanks for the good work BBJane! I may have to tell my side of the story about what is is like letting your 16 year old kid go off to slaughter without a whimper. It’s frickin sick!
But what is worse is watching what a kult can do to a wonderful kid in a few short years. That is truly frightening! The look on John Nesbits face pretty much says it all. Haughty, arrogant, know best with an attitude on top of it that says “fuck you, we’re doing it anyway”.
Well kulties, you had better take your best shot because you guys are going down!
There’s quite a difference in tone between these communications from the Eastern U.S. and those we more commonly see from the West. Or maybe it’s just Atlanta. But there’s always a certain R-factor — or maybe I should say $-factor — in the Eastern messages, like, Yeah we know this is a miserable process, you’re gonna hate it, the people around you are gonna hate it, you’re gonna be spending money you don’t have, you’ll be pulling your hair out … but trust me, it’ll be over some day and you’ll feel better.
I guess it remains to be seen whether this actually works. Apparently it did in Atlanta. These are not happy campers, though.
The Oracle says
“Willingness trumps MEST.”
I guess we just aren’t willing to service you or get you up the bridge unless you buy us a new building.
“As a leader, don’t focus on who controls the most MEST.”
Although David Miscavige turned Scientology’s finest into beggars so he could BUY STUFF.
2. Willingness trumps MEST. Said the 4 year old with the homemade superman cape as he jumped off the roof……..
Good Lord, this is like “How to Destroy Your Life in Six Easy Steps”.
Abandon all common sense, abandon all intuition. It IS a challenge to get oneself to destroy your life, don’t be afraid. Christ All Mighty.
And this BS about “can’t pull-in a motivator if you don’t commit an overt” HA! All you have to do is go “All-In”, then wait for bad effects to start rolling in – being dunned by creditors, stress, bankruptcy, not to mention the effects on your family and loved ones. This either is a lie or it completely discredits Hubbard’s Overt-Motivator theory…or possibly both.
This is modern, “religious” self-sacrifice.
The other thing about LRH buying Saint Hill – it was his home. He and his family lived there for six years. And as Mike pointed out he SOLD it to the church. I imagine that was a pretty sweet deal. As well, a good portion of the estate was in use as a business, giving LRH tax advantages afforded to only to registered companies.
I love the reply about the funny costume and dance music.
On a different note I want to share an experience from the 80s when I was at Flag. An IAS reg got me into his office and told me what a big being I am and he showed me the definition of the 8th dynamic in the admin dictionary (look that one up if you haven’t) and told me I qualify as one of those. The punch line was that I should buy my lifetime membership which was $2000. I told him I didn’t have $2000 which was totally true. He said, “Anita, you are a thetan! You can do anything! Write the check!” I feebly argued, telling him that the check would bounce. He said that I have the ability to make it go right, so I should write the check. So I wrote the check, thinking that if it did bounce that he would be there for me when that happens (duh). After all I did warn him. Little did I know that all I did was give him his stat so that he won’t get hammered so much that week. Probably there were times when he did this kind of stat push that he would win and the check would not bounce, so he didn’t have anything to lose. So what happened was, the check bounced, of course. Les was upset with me for having written it (duh), and I had to go to ethics and do lowers for giving the IAS a bouncing check! Lesson learned…. Big DUH…..
We have all had our BIG DUH moments in our favorite cult Anita. Sad to say it took many more than one or two to finally get through my thick skull.
How many times does the reg have to kick sand in your face before you stand up? Way too many!!!
We are emptying your sandbox good buddy! The only thing left in it will be your sorry ass and we are more than happy to kick it for you. You should note that your stats in that area are UP. Today is a new day and another ass kickin is in store for You.
I suspect Hubbard did not “sell” St. Hill to the church. A sale would require two separate entities. Hubbard WAS the church and simply stated the price and ordered the cheque written or the funds transferred to his offshore account. There was no actual “sale”.
Mike Rinder says
Well, the property IS owned by COSRECI (CofS Religious Education College or perhaps now by the Church of the New Faith — the South Australian entity). It’s not titled in his name. Or the “Hubbard Exploration Corp” or any of the other alter-egos he set up. So it was sold.
It seems to me that followers of Scientology fall into two categories: those that are naïve and gullible, and those that believe the success they have achieved is because of Scientology, and therefore, they don’t want to “jinx it” (the Hollywood celebs, rich businessmen and women). I feel very sorry for the first group and I hope they stop drinking the Kool-Aid before they are utterly broken. I do not feel sorry for the second group. They are out in the world enough to be able to see the truth, yet they choose to ignore it.
There’s a third category too, Lori. It’s the sociopath who jumps on the commission-earning bandwagon. Seeing an easy, gullible mark, he simply takes them for everything he can get while pocketing his commission. This seems to be the type of person who runs the joint these days.
Just when you thought they couldn’t get any more depraved. It will be interesting to watch them roil themselves into their next psychotic frenzy. All adorned with rabbit costumes they dance a Whirling Dervish while chanting a postulate to lay a golden easter egg to further fund their ideal fantasy org. The new “standard fundraising tech.” Fully approved by David, “let him die” Miscavige.
The more conservative of the group just rack up huge credit card debt and simply neglect to pay it. Not an overt. Greater good. Higher purpose and all that rot.
Lisa Tighe says
“However, a being always rises to match the size of the games he plays….”
Or they throw themselves off a bridge or high building.
Gus Cox says
Yep, Rex Fowler sure matched the size of the donation he made with company funds.
What does “mock up the winning valance” mean?
A valance is an identity in Scientology. Like if you’re in your mother’s valence you’ve taken her identity. So “mock up the winning valance” is essentially mentally seeing yourself as a winner and manifesting that identity.
Or to a never-in like me, “mock up” is pretend/imagine/fake it, and “valence” is an act/role/personna.
So – Fake being excited to be giving away all your money, so that others will (pretend to) be happy to give up all of theirs.
This is called “winning” inside the bubble, and “contagious insanity” outside it.
Scott Mercer says
Lie until you get what you want?
I get it now. “False face must hide what false heart doth know…” Pathological.
They will continue to extract more and more from fewer and fewer until they can get absolutely everything from no one. Poor Duggan, he’ll be the last one writing checks because he has the deepest pocket.
OT – can you postulate your way out of jail?
I have a question. What exactly will Scientology do with all these buildings? Do they rent them out or something?
Scott Mercer says
Scientology stores its assets in buildings and real estate. They don’t have to be used, just maintained, but, they’re having problems doing even that with a lot of the buildings.
John Doe says
The major reason that this ideal org purchasing program will not die despite its clear failure to assist scientology to expand, is that the main, hidden purpose has been moderately successful.
The main (hidden) purpose of acquiring all this real estate is to provide a smokescreen for Miscavige having amassed a huge amount of cash in bank accounts, billions evidently. The buildings give the pretense that these church funds are being reinvested for the good of parishioners, and all this real estate goes toward the appearance of a balance between cash on hand and facilities that benefit the “millions” of parishioners.
The brilliance of the scheme is that Miscavige has convinced the parishioners to cough up the money with no ownership stake or oversight whatsoever.
Think about it. If Miscavige had a billion dollars in the bank, and spent 500 million in real estate purchases, then he’d achieve 50% ready cash, and 50% “delivery facilities” still worth 1 billion. This looks better to regulators than having one billion hoarded in banks.
But even better, if he got parishioners to buy him a billion dollars worth of real estate, he’d still achieve the 50/50 ratio, but it would now be worth 2 billion! And all under Miscavige’s control!
Therefore, once the building is bought, the purpose has been achieved and Miscavige really doesn’t care how soon it opens, other than the fanfare and self aggrandizement when he shows up to open up a new ideal org to keep the rubes and the scam going.
This is also why all the ideal org fundraising promo pieces tend to look the same. Miscavige wants to be able to show the IRS, justices dept, judges, etc., photos of enthusiastic scientologists in goofy costumes and how much grateful grass-roots support all these church members have for this scheme and how much they are on board. It’s all about appearances, like most of scientology.
Miscavige’s contempt for the parishioners who donate must be unimaginable.
So Storm, no, the buildings are not rented. They don’t need to be. They are primarily to shield Miscavige’s hoard of cash from accusations of impropriety AND to wring money out of the remaining suckers left in the church.
You hit the nail on the head, John Doe. It is about looking good for the IRS and to keep the cudgel falling on the minions. Keep them with their noses to the grindstone and too busy to ask any questions. Questions that Lron’s ghost doesn’t want to answer. That is what DM is these days, Lron’s ghost. I do have to wonder why no other clam questions DM’s ouija board.
Thanks for explaining. It is a clever and evil scheme. Wish people would stop giving money to miscavige.
John Doe you just laid it out perfectly and it is what I’ve thought for years. David “let him die” Miscavige uses other people’s money to buy up real estate so that he can use up his billions and make the books look good for any investigating authorities. It is a way to not have billions being horded and stashed and makes it look like he is improving things for his parishoners. And keep in mind the very people who paid for these buildings have no stake in it, no names on title. It’s is all DM’s and he can liquidate and abscond with the money when it gets to hot for him. That is the hidden game DM is playing. Only now it isn’t hidden anymore as John Doe and Mike and others have pointed out the truth.
It all comes down to making as much money for CofS (DM), no matter the cost in human lives, by using scare tactics.
Also his phrase of: “even if you have to mock up the winning valence sometimes.” referring being a leader to get others to donate, does convey the struggle, pain and hardship some of the members go through in order to ‘donate for a building.’ Why?
Because they are being made guilty when being told “LRH had great hardship to get ST Hill so he could deliver SHSBC’ (or another paraphrasing of this lie).
DM – RTC used to go on this ‘make you guilt’ vein with: “COB works 24/7 to ensure KSW blah, blah…
Part of the manipulation and indoctrination, that is all.
“You will need every LRH datum you ever learned…”
How about “You will all the LRH data you ever learned”? (not that you will)
Not to be a grammar pedant but I thought that was grammar and definitions were such an important part of the cult.
Oops! Forgot “You will NEED…” So much for my own grammar!
The singular of data is datum, though hardly anyone uses it in English nowadays, so you can’t tar it with the same brush as ‘enturbulate’ or ‘knowingness’. Using archaisms is the last of Scientology’s problems…
Elron Hubard says
Technicaly, it’s grammatically correct, if awkward. A datum is a singular piece of data. It’s rarely used in this manner. But 99% of Scientology jargon is awkward. Isn’t that the point?
Is “datum” scientology jargon or an archaism or both? Every time I see “datum” it makes me think the writer is stuck in the 50s, but I don’t know if that is a deliberate continuance of scientology-speak similar to “technology” or merely not knowing that “datum” has fallen out of use.
Also wondering if “social norms” in the second paragraph translate to “the law”.
Chee Chalker says
“………..the memory of a goldfish.”
Yep, in order to be a Scientologist, you have to have exactly that.
BIG laugh on that one, Chee. I’d had the same response. For those poor bastards in the SO, especially in the RPF, that goldfish memory becomes a great survival mechanism.
Gus Cox says
“The focus of an eagle and the memory of a goldfish are perfect for this kind of work.”
Yeah, that caught my eye, too. That sums up exactly how the cult treats its members. Somebody could go broke buying gaudy IAS bowling trophies and find himself homeless and broke and 70 years old. He could go knock on the door of the Fort Harrison or CC Int and say, “I gave millions, but I have no place to stay. Think I could have a room for a while?”
“Who are you? Get out of here you DB. You’re responsible for the condition you’re in.”
Cult memory goes back no more than a week, to last Thursday at 2.
“…when this is all over you will know you are a 10 ft tall OT Scientologist, and you will breathe fiery purpose and eat impossible barriers for breakfast. I could not have imagined the wins would be so amazing.”
This is astounding. This is being said about fundraising for BUILDINGS. I guess David Miscavige learned that you can’t “sell it with services.” You can raise your spiritual awareness and have OT powers by applying a “stubbornness against social norms, bank agreement and physical universe barriers.”
This is called delusion.
Wayne Borean aka The Mad Hatter says
And that is,why it is so hard for people to leave. I was never involved with Scientology, so I don’t know things from that viewpoint, but I was raised Catholic. It was years after I stopped attending church that I realized I was no longer a Catholic.
The Catholic Churcn is no where near as controlling as the Church of Scientology. For those who believe in Scientology’s message, and who think they are making a difference, the shock of realizing that they are no longer Scientologists must be huge.
Those who manage to leave, have to be commended for their strength of will.
This doesn’t make all the remainder weak. I suspect many are hanging on out of loyalty to L. Ron Hubbard, which takes strength of a different sort, considering how Miscavige treats everyone close to him.
Each person has his/her personal limit on how much brutality and injustice and insanity he/she will submit to. Then it is over.
Martin Padfield says
I was raised a Catholic too but the fundamentalism embedded into Scientology is WAY beyond anything I encountered in Catholism. As a Catholic you may (or may not) believe the whole heaven and hell thing, but that’s more to do with you personally. In Scientology you eventually end up believing that if you don’t contribute to a “Cleared planet” you will have the souls of every living being on your conscience. Literally. That’s one hell of a guilt trip. The “confidential briefings” you get lured into with the IAS and Idle Org registrars are all along the lines of “YOU are responsible for Scientology expansion” – and by extrapolation the future of the planet. May seem laughable now, but when you are a true believer, as many here were, it’s all too real. You are one selfish shitbag if you don’t empty your bank account for the cause. I remember one woman saying that it would be “an overt” to have any money left in her account after a donations cycle.
Rod Keller says
When will Saint Hill go Ideal?
When it’s closed and turned into a public park 😉
It would be a better used as a sewage treatment facility.
I vote sewage treatment! It would be too toxic for a public park.
“You cannot pull in a motivator on something that is not an overt.
Just because you break the financial rules, middle class agreements and your accountant’s advice does not mean you will regret it. In fact, the regret comes from NOT stepping up and granting yourself the beingness to do what your honor and integrity demand.”
Hm….. I am so glad to hear this John Nesbit. I think you should go and happily tell the people that lost their families, their homes, their jobs and such that those are not motivators! That the hollow pit in their stomach is not regret!
I think it will help them to know that the agreements they made with their spouses, family, employers and such were worthless and contemptible. That honoring their agreements is an overt. Because all that matters is their Ideal Org! I am sure that will make them happy.
In fact, you should go tell the widow with two children of the man who committed suicide after becoming a Patron and ruining their lives how it was all for the best in this best of all possible Ideal Org World! Have fun John! You are really an OT Ambassador!
You rock Raindog!
$cientology has a good shot at becoming the largest scrapheap of broken pieces (spelled sheeple and beached whales) this nation has yet seen. Looks like Dave Miscavige will have his stats up on that one.
David “let him die” Miscavige will get his wish: “to smash his name into history” but it will be for ruining more lives, breaking up more families, bankrupting more people, beaching more whales” than anyone else. He will be infamous, NOT famous. DM, clear the word “infamous.”
Whoops subisture Humanitarian for Patron in last paragraph.
You got it Raindog. The church is totally willing, and in fact, encourages members to commit overts on THEMESELVES and their FAMILY. Because the 1st and 2nd Dynamics cannot possibly stack up against the all might, all important 3rd Dynamic.
A workable definition of a “cult” is a group that uses socially coercive techniques to get you to work against your own self interests.
Clay demo that definition and use it.
You’ll be glad you did. 🙂
This is pathetic……
Truly pathetic, and goes beyond gullible. “Bigger than the prize of a shiny new org building is the real prize of true salvation for the people in your area. Maybe its not fair, but realize that they are COUNTING on you to wear your hat and bring off this win. The fate of millions rest on a few slim shoulders in each area.” No “maybe” about it, it’s not fair. I certainly hope the members wake up and stop giving this cult anything.
I just cannot stomach the bullshit anymore. I feel nauseated when I read it or hear it, as I did on the tape on Tony’s blog – the CS WUS yelling, patronising and insulting the audience left, right and centre as though they were all idiots (which I suppose they really are) who lapped it up as though they were listening to God.
I can tolerate it. Ugh! The mind control is boggling.
And these supposed opinion leaders lending their wisdom and maturity to this insanity is worse.
I wonder how they’ll feel one day when they look back, IF they ever do?
“The momentary sacrifice…” In her epic book, “Atlas Shrugged,” Ayn Rand said to beware anyone one preaching sacrifice as immediately following that will be someone coming along to collect that sacrifice. She defined sacrifice as “giving up something of value for something of LESS value”. As I recall, she provided an example: “If I give you a nickel and you give me a dollar, I have made no sacrifice. But if I give you a dollar and you give me a nickel, I have made a sacrifice.” And the latter is precisely what scio now offers.
The blind and incompetent are leading the blind incompetents.
I personally prefer dumb and dumber
Great analysis Mike
Real-estate investment = people introduced to Scientology and taken courses and audited
YOU MUST BE KIDDING ME