Tasia I have a couple of logistical questions.
Oh, never mind.
Let me just point out a couple of things, putting aside that this is lunatic fringe activity — and certainly not something to put on Facebook!
I am going to be charitable and address this from the most benign Scientological perspective:
IF you find some mother willing to go along with this scheme, have you thought through the consequences?
Some poor child is going to be raised with an endless stream of evaluation and invalidation because both you and its mother “know” who this baby was in its last life? So every gurgle is going to become “wow, she sounds just like mom used to sound”?
And “Do you remember me? I am your daughter?”
And “You remember this house we used to live in?”
This is a concept for a psychological thriller script of how a child is steadily driven insane. It might just get green-lighted.
Cue the Twilight Zone music….
Tory Christman says
When I met my now ex-husband in 1974, I learned of his last lifetime from he and his parents. They spoke of “the old Harold” regularly. There is a library in Chicago named after the original Harold Bezazian. I’ve seen photos of what he looked like last lifetime. I tell you, it was odd—but I got used to it as each of them had such amazingly close stories about each other as well as their cousins who are Christian and had nothing to do with $cientology. However, when they would get w/ Harold—the 2 of them would literally “pop” back in time to “Those days”… Same w/ the parents—the “Dad” being his brother last lifetime. The story was rich AND you could see their joy in the stories. IF it was fake….it is a true testament of “A man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest”. (And in the late 90’s, ftr, he went from talking about this story quite often to “Don’t EVER mention that story again, to ANYONE, myself included”. Good ol “Dave” at work, no doubt, suppressing more communications).
So someone asking for a body for their loved one? Well, IF you believe in that, why not? I’ve heard of crazier things, and certainly known people to do much nastier things about their loved ones. Harold Bezazian: IF you read this: WTFU and get out of there! Go where ever you want, do what YOU want. STOP being “Run” by these morons. Your Dad knew they were con men by the end, and he got “in” in 1950. Your Mom did, too, they just did not want to “hurt you”. PEACE 🙂 Tory/Magoo
remoteviewed says
Tory,
I remember your former mother-in-law quite well.
We were both on the Briefing Course back then.
Nice lady working toward being in Ron’s Household Unit.
Tory Christman says
remoteviewed: mmmm I don’t think it was my mother-in-law: She never did the BC, that I knew of.
She was an “old timer” from 1950—started w/ Dianetics..on up to OT 8. Never on staff, either.
Must be s/one else. 🙂
remoteviewed says
Pardon me Tory.
I think her name was Barbara Benezaria.
Not your mother in law?
Well okay 🙂
Tory (was married to Harold Bezazian, her son) Christman says
Yup…..not my mother-in-law.
She was Florence (Bell)
Bezazian
Civmar says
When my daughter, Tiffany, was seven or eight years old she said to me
“I used to be an Egyptian!”
I replied “Oh? What was your name?”
She smiled and said “Tiffany!”
(Later I looked up the derivation of her name, and it turns out to be Greek. Checking the history of Egypt, I found that it was a Greek colony for centuries.)
c. Swazey says
I kind of both agree and disagree with Tony. While I’d not think this as nutty, I do think that if one did reincarnate, it wd be better to not have the new identity revealed and touted. I agree with Pepper on this, too.
I have personally felt that I did Scn before this life, too, but I’d have not been served well if anyone else was pushing me on it or telling everyone. And reincarnation or no reincarnation, a person is always better off as a non Scio than stuck in that crap. There are much better ologies out there if one’s inclined toward spiritual exploration.
WG says
http://youtu.be/GPPesVeTE1o
I think george carlin sums it up quite nicely
c. Swazey says
Not in my opinion. He laughed at all spirituality and I cannot respect him for that. IMO, he was at his best with quirky little observation s.
c. Swazey says
Oh, give me a break. She said her mom was looking. So of COURSE she thinks her mom would go along sith the “lunatic scheme”.
I’m an ex Scio, of course, but speaking as someone who did feel something from both parents after they died, this does not strike me as outside the realm of possibility, per se. Nothing strikes me as odd about this idea.
However, I think that most people who drop their bodies wd tend to get some objectivity and rethink the whole rebirth into the cult thang…just sayin’.
And now back to our scheduled pgm of laughing at the spiritual beliefs of others…. (smirk)
Pepper says
Mike – you’re right about the eval the child would get in this situation.
I have a friend who’s a nanny for a little boy. His mother insists that he’s her previous child who came back after committing suicide. Can you imagine what this child is growing up with?!
I understand this mother is trying to handle her horrific grief by transferring the girl who died to the little boy she adopted a few years later. I just feel so bad for her son, who has to live with this legacy which is not his own.
Tasia obviously loves her Mom and is trying to cope with her grief too. Facebook wasn’t the best judgement and indicates her emotional and mental state.
TheWidowDenk says
Hi Pepper,
I was rather intimately connected the mother you describe in your comment. In fact, her disasters occurred shortly after Dr Denk’s death. I had to cope with those disasters, and the mother, as well as everything else I had going on.
I don’t think you need to feel bad for the mother’s son. I’m sure he is being very well raised. As far as the legacy he seems to be given, we don’t know if it is true or not. It really is only speculation.
What’s helped me a lot is this:
“1. Be able to experience anything.
“2. Cause only those things which others are able to experience easily.”
I know there were key decisions made as a result of the disasters. I believe these helped smooth out the transition period. I personally find it difficult to question these decisions because at close to ten years out, things do seem to be going better than I expected they would back then.
This might also help: Nights in White Satin lyrics by the Moody Blues.
Cold hearted orb
That rules the night
Removes the colours
From our sight
Red is gray and
Yellow white
But we decide
Which is right
And
Which is an Illusion
I do believe we need to allow the person who has suffered a loss great leeway during the transition period and not question their originations and decisions (unless they’re really off the wall, of course). In this particular case, I believe it worked out well for the mother and her family. As I stated above, I’m sure the son is being very well raised. I don’t think you need to feel bad for him.
c. Swazey says
I agree with both of you.
Pepper says
Hi Widow,
Since you know the mom intimately and I don’t, I will take your word for it. I know the nanny and she loves the boy as her own and always says that he’s wonderful.
The nanny told me this only a couple of years ago, and the boy is no longer an infant. This leads me to conclude that the concept of the boy being the previous child is still perpetuated in PT, and if so, why is it being talked about to others when it could come back to him somehow? Surely this would not be considered okay, at least for the boy? Thetans can perceive many things.
I am an outsider in this situation and have no right to judge how Mom handles her grief, which must have been terrible. I just know that I would never speak of it to anyone and take my solace from it privately and keep it very close to the vest. There are some secrets that are right to keep and should be, at least for the sake of others.
Of course Widow, this is my viewpoint only and everyone has their own way of dealing with the challenges of life. I am glad you answered me because I have thought about this a lot and it had disturbed me on some level and never spoke of it before until now.
I agree with you on giving leeway to people in their moments of grief and not question their originations. I have a friend whose husband died a few years ago and she asked me a few times if I thought he could come back in the next few weeks or months and “switch bodies” with someone else who wanted to go, or something like that. I had to gently tell her, no I didn’t think that was possible. Grief can be experienced indefinitely in some cases and perhaps this is what is happening with the mom in question?
Thank you.
TheWidowDenk says
This is a reply to Pepper as there is no “reply” button to Pepper’s last comment.
Pepper – you state: “This leads me to conclude that the concept of the boy being the previous child is still perpetuated in PT, and if so, why is it being talked about to others when it could come back to him somehow?”
I believe the concept of the boy being the previous child is an actuality. When it is being talked about to others, it becomes a reality. And, thus, it is comforting. Rachel
Pepper says
To Widow- got it and thank you.
Lurr Kurr says
Wow I never had a comment deleted before yesterday. Interesting. Did I hit a nerve?
Mike Rinder says
I felt it was inappropriate. Why bring her into this discussion? She has done nothing other than be born and I didnt want the conversation getting off into that subject.
Bystander says
I can just see it. Twenty or thirty years (and $500,000.00) from now, some third generation $cn sitting there, holding the cans to an old MKVIII (held together with duct tape) saying, “Pow!!!!!!!That BT I just blew was old Tasia’s Mom!!”
No I can’t. Thirty years from now DM might be getting close to parole and no one will remember $cn.
That woman has issues, and $camtology isn’t helping.
FG says
This attitude is actually an easy response to handle a loss.
It’s very upsetting to think that someone you used to live with has completely vanished. It’s looking like he doesn’t exist anymore.
It also restimulates the idea that when you are gone you are gone. Or worst, some being sit alone, unhappy, having lost everything and everyone.
I think it’s one of the main reason they pay huge amount for services, to escape from this fate. This is also a fanstastic tool to control the members. If they go out against the church, they end up alone in the dark, an eternity of pain, a scientology version of hell.
Of course they feel lucky compared to “wogs”, their religion give them the idea that they have a time track. I had this idea, and I still think I’m an immortal being.
It’s a very strong hope, even if it’s looking like this facebook post a bit stupid. But to think that a deceased family member is having a new life, that he will be able to “continue his bridge” in the next life time, they feel good with it.
Is anybody having his own experience or someone he knows of having proof or strong evidence of having come back?
Or recognition like : “Oh, you where my son in the last life” with details proving it’s true. Or some PCs you audited, with evidence of proven past life auditing, or anything like that?
Growing older, I have lost sevral friends and I don’t like the idea that they are no longer existing. But where are they?
DollarMorgue says
Welcome to the Dark Side.
Cat Daddy says
Miscavige back in the day
Tom Cruise Scientology video – 1 of 7 – ORIGINAL FULL VIDEOS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBtdOZQJdqE
Friend says
building up a new goal will give you a new life .. if not done, the new body will quickly die .. the goal is surely not to have a new body ..
Basketballjane says
I was trying to post a meme. I guess I can’t do that.
Mike Rinder says
No, it seems not
Hallie Jane says
Such an inappropriate use of a public forum, this is sad. Let’s leave mom to her own decisions, karma and destiny. Perhaps that’s why she left. The writer sounds like she’s in a stage of grieving, like denial, & may find comfort in considering her mum still around. Mourn my dear, and celebrate your mom’s life.
Let go, there’s beauty in the breakdown.
TheWidowDenk says
“Such an inappropriate use of a public forum, this is sad.”
I agree with you Hallie Jane. Tasia has made what seems to be a heart-felt post on her FB to her friends and it has been subsequently posted on this blog. The introduction as well as the comments are full of invalidation, evaluation and smiley faces.
What happened to caring and compassion when it’s obvious “The writer sounds like she’s in a stage of grieving, like denial, & may find comfort in considering her mum still around.?”
Surely there are more important things to be discussed in an open forum than Tasia and the loss of her mother.
Hallie Jane says
Thank you!
Pepper says
Hallie Jane – very true and beautifully put.
Graduated says
Hear, hear.
Ms.P says
Disaffected – and there you said it “I feel sorry for this woman that she apparently can’t just mourn for her loss and heal though that like normal people do.”
How many times in all these years (since the ’70’s) have I heard this cold rhetoric. Some close family member dies and you get this, “oh no big deal, they’ll pick up another body,” etc. yaddy yaddy yaddy. No time to mourn.
How callous to go on facebook with this request. Are you friggin kidding me? Twilight Zone at it’s best. Or am I just being old fashioned towards this new bitter cold, cyberspace, Scientology youth?
FOTF2012 says
But as Hubbard might have put it,
“No one died. [Ron chuckles lightly and knowingly.] The thetan just dropped its body. [Audience giggles in awe]. Grief is a misemotion, and when someone dies, you experience a little secondary that keys in an engram. Just a little bump on your time track really, but man can it spin you in if you don’t know what is happening in the mind. You see how it works? Now, all that sobbing at a funeral, that’s just wogs dramatizing their own banks, their own moments of pain and unconsciousness. They are really, really just crying about their own past deaths, don’t you see? [crowd exhales as they have a group cognition about how silly grieving over death is]”
Disaffected says
*Double face palm*
Disaffected says
“Or am I just being old fashioned towards this new bitter cold, cyberspace, Scientology youth?”
Nope. Normal common sense.
Cyberspace is just another medium ScioBots can use these days to display their “high-beingness”. (i.e. absence of low-toned emotions such as grief —- all HE&R ya know..)
Mike Leopold says
Pathetic and delusional. This is true contagion of aberration.
FOTF2012 says
It’s religious belief, which is pretty much rational (and I don’t mean that in a negative way, but in a Jungian sense).
After all, the Tibetan Book of the Dead gives a detailed process for trying to steer the recently deceased to the most favorable rebirth.
And Christians believe that the dearly parted are (hopefully) waiting for them in heaven.
And Muslims feel certain that there are doe-eyed virgins waiting for them in one of the heavens, nestling on fine carpets where sweet streams flow beneath trees laden with sweet dates.
And Hindus I have known might not find much odd about the Facebook post.
For me what it drives home is that Scientology is not in any stretch of the imagination. It really has become a religion, and I do not mean that as a compliment — because in the case of Scientology, it has not integrated its pseudo-scientific self into its religious belief identity.
FOTF2012 says
Oops — I meant pretty much “non-rational” !
FOTF2012 says
Am typing too fast — sorry! Where I wrote “For me what it drives home is that Scientology is not in any stretch of the imagination.” I meant to complete the thought to read “For me what it drives home is that Scientology is not in any stretch of the imagination a rational, scientific system.”
Sarah James says
This is Scientology, I was told from a very young age that I in fact am my paternal grandmother. I am tempted to insert a joke here but I won’t because I never thought it to be funny…just creepy. I guess this belief makes it easier to not recognise the child in front of you. Children are just small adults in the cult.
Heidi says
That’s a brilliant insight. “He’s not a hungry baby, he’s my dead father-in-law, and he gets NO attention for this foolish crying!”
John Doe says
Scientologists have somehow learned, or adopted the idea, that the best response to having a loved one die is to urgently get a comm line into the disembodied spirit of the deceased and convince them to go and get another body. And far preferred, one whose parents are trained scientologists. There is usually a lot of concern that this reincarnation happen as soon as possible so that these poor thetans aren’t subject to being vacuumed up and implanted.
Really? Is that the end-all of scientology? Get another body?
Where did this idea come from?
If indeed, it is true that we are reincarnated over and over again, then as I see it, the way it is set up, the way WE set it up is that when you are born again, you don’t remember much or any of your last life or lives; you get to start off fresh.
Well, if that is the case, when it comes time for me to go, I’m not coming back here.
I’m done. I’ve graduated.
It has been nice knowing all of you and many I will miss, so I hope you don’t take offense.
Oh, don’t be too concerned. I’m not yet done with the game here. You’ll have to put up with me for a good 30 or 40 years still!
deElizabethan says
Thank you John Doe, from me and others who have graduated.
Sam Domingo says
I think my dog is having a litter of puppies soon. Will that work?
Draco says
😀 Now that’s funny, Sam! Made me laugh out loud!
Bash says
It seems to work for cats.
http://imgur.com/Vg7ngmA
Tony DePhillips says
Seriously, that is some nutty shit.
If some person were to pick up another body they should damn well keep it to themselves. If I was having a child the last thing I would want to know was that my kid used to be some nuts Mom. I think this person needs some more objectives.
Mike Rinder says
You captured the whole story in 50 words or less. Brilliant Tony.
Chuck Beatty says
Very important trend to watch.
Also, I heard some years back of trends of the FSO Regs asking people for large donations, for use in future lives.
How the Regs figure out how to get donations for people coming back in future lives, for future lives’ services I don’t think ever advanced to being taken seriously.
But donations for use future lives, I wonder if any Scientologists have been regged for end of live donations?
Lise says
I have a Scientology “passport” that you would supposedly use when you came back. I found it when cleaning out an auditing room back in 2002 bet the reges used that as a money raising tool, in fact I am surprised they aren’t still using them
Tory Christman says
I have one, too, Lise! Basically, for anyone who doesn’t have one (Or has never heard of it) ….each person “in” Scientology was to get one….and get stamped EACH BOOK, COURSE, OR Auditing you have done, with the date,too. Then next lifetime—you’ll have a record of all that you did get done. (As if next lifetime, if we have one….your friends or family will come running up: “Oh! I have Mary’s Scientology Passport!” Rotflol! It didn’t last long, did it?
Mike Rinder says
The Scientology passport was a sales and marketing gimmick. It was an LRH “bright idea”.
scientology411 says
What happens when a declared SP dies and seeks to be reborn into a Scientology family for the purpose of causing enturbulation? Is the “church” prepared for that terrible possibility?
I propose that the “church” of Scientology maintain and distribute a “book of life” that records the date of death of all declared SPs so that any babies born to Scientologists close to those dates can be properly disposed of. After all, Scientologists must be ever vigilant of having their families infiltrated by free-thinking SPs that might cause them to question his most ecclesiastical holiness COB and infanticide is a small price to pay for securing your eternal freedom. This seems to be the only reasonable way to ensure that a recently deceased suppressive person is deprived of the opportunity to torment a new Scientology family and lead them astray.
Mike Rinder says
🙂
Karen#1 says
Approx 2000 women claimed their baby in the late 70s and 80s was Quentin Hubbard. Some wanted benefits alleging they had born the son of the Founder. The Quentin scam.
These were the days before Facebook. It was alleged that these families connected with Quentin *psychically*. Imagine Quentin happy to get back into what he had fled from.
Mike Rinder says
Thanks Karen. The conceit is astonishing. These people think they can somehow assert what the beingness of someone else is. Unfortunately, they would never understand as they know they are absolutely right. It’s the hallmark of the fundamentalist.
Tory Christman says
Another older one was “Wing Angel” Mike. When Wing died, my Mother-in-law told me “7 women claimed their child was “Wing”. Now another funny story. She knew Wing pretty well, and they were both from the same mission. One day we were at Flag. Suddenly this beam came at her in the “Lemon Tree” from a staff member.
She went over to meet him. He claimed he WAS the *real* Wing Angel and he wanted her to get his folders to Flag so they could confirm he’d done previous auditing. She told me from various things he told her she felt this was Wing Angel–in a new body. Argggggggggh. Really? LOL. (I never found out if they DID get Wing’s older folders to Flag). So happy to be out of there!
rickiraccoon says
OMG…the poor babies born to these folks…so sad.
Disaffected says
Apart from the fact that this is utterly lunatic (that’s my MOST benign qualification) and presuming (by overstretching my imagination on this) she does know for a fact that her mother is looking for a new home, why trap her again in a new meat body? Then spend half a million of REAL dollar’s “clearing” that piece of meat again — utter DEV-T, isn’t it?
After all, the highest body of the most ethical people on the planet, the SO, has banned these “little bundle of joys” for being DEV-T particles. They even have them aborted without much thought. Why not send her off to do the OT running program alongside the Commodore, I bet he feels very lonely by now circling that star for 28 years. And maybe they can return together after completing.
What a mumbo jumbo bogus Scientology can ultimately lead to. Its just batshit crazy,
I feel sorry for this woman that she apparently can’t just mourn for her loss and heal though that like normal people do.
Idle Morgue says
Scientologist’s are trained to bury trauma. Only problem is – when they get out – THERE IT IS – ready to be experienced with full perceptics!
Doug Parent says
Maybe Hubbard isn’t tardy maybe he’s sitting it out till the storm is over. Or laying low. If I were him I sure as hell wouldn’t want to walk back into the shit storm that is currently under way.
Idle Morgue says
I would slap him so hard he land back on Target II!
Draco says
Ah, Doug…but such a big OT thetan should just put those big boots in the sky back on and wade in to sort it all out. 😉 Actually, I would love to see the demented one’s face if someone did walk into his office and say: “OK Boyo – I’m back! You have some splainin’ to do!!”
But other than that – I am quite happy for him to continue to be fish food.
doloras says
What if a young kid wandered up to Slappy and said: “David, this is Ron. VWD! You’re doing just what I would have done! Here, I came back to give you this, this is OT IX and X…” Would Slappy believe it?
Jose Chung says
Twilight Zone fodder,everything should work out for the best.
Plenty of stories here but rather than stir the pot
I say let nature take its course .
cre8tivewmn says
Geez, this mother doesn’t even get a vacation after dropping her body? She’s expected to move right in to a body of her daughter’s choosing and attend her own memorial!
Secondly, didn’t LRH say in Dianetics that you could have all these memiries of things that happened while in utero? That would imply that the thetan joins the body long before birth.
tony-b says
More naive thetanological questions from a never-in……How can mom even think of a vacation when there is a universe or two to clear and she is only on contract for a billion years? Does mom have a bit of choice as to where she goes to be born again – quite a few other people were Roman centurions or Napoleons (he must have had many many clones) in past lives? Can she have a sex change? Where do the body thetans go when a person drops their body or do they lurk around on Rinder’s page?
doloras says
She can certainly have a sex change. Kate Bornstein says that the idea that thetans have no gender was one thing that attracted her to Scn.
Jens TINGLEFF says
You’re not supposed to look at the contradictions, you’re just supposed to enjoy the certainty.
Idle Morgue says
Ask her where is Ron? 27 years and as 60 Minutes Australia reported – “he’s late”! Priceless look on Marty’s face! LOL
I recall an OT VIII talking about his good friend that as he lay dying – he wanted to live in California and the moment he died – a really kewl Scientology family had a baby. He was sure it was his friend. cringe that I did not walk out the door at that moment!
Mike Rinder says
Actually, I believe the statement was, in a masterful piece of deadpan understatement: “he’s tardy”…
Meg R says
😉
Idle Morgue says
Yes – and it was priceless! 🙂
DollarMorgue says
It was the best part. Has since had me wondering, if DM were Herod, would he have started gathering up all red heads and locking them up in a compound? Either way, were LRH ever to present himself at an org, he’d be declared Type 3.
Draco says
Hee hee 😀
Old School says
Ya got that right Idle. Not to mention all those other Oatee 8’s who have kicked the bucket. Not a single one has “come back” with “Amnesia handled”. It is amazing how deluded people can be.
Sam Clemens was right when he said, “It’s easier to fool people than to convince them that they’ve been fooled.” Miss Cabbage relies on that axiom of human behavior to keep recycling the whales across the Bridge on the river kwai…
Just Me says
Scientologists are taught they must be CAUSE OVER EVERYTHING.
I knew a troubled young woman who was brown into a Scientology situation. She recently committed suicide. Her parents tell each other and their friends that she “dropped the bod to find a fresh new beginning.” They’re VGIs about it.
I read today of a mother with a four year old child. The mother is on full-day study at her Scientology org. She invited advice from her Facebook friends about how to get her infant to sleep faster at night, so she can also be on course at night. She is VGIs about her plans.
Some of us knew a Scientologist who was in great pain from an accident. The man refused to take pain medication. He committed suicide very efficiently, leaving a four-page suicide note that began, “Hallelujah, I’m finally out of this body!” Very VGIs.
When Scientologists cannot admit they are not cause over everything, their inability to confront this reality leads them to make some terrible choices because the reality is too hard to confront. Many people around them are also forced into this fake reality and must suffer for choices they did not make.
Life is full of a number of things. Some of them are being effect.
Idle Morgue says
Scientologist’s have the opposite emotions of normal human beings. They justify death and that is theta. They have no life and that is theta. If it makes sense – it is not Scientology. If it isn’t cruel, inhumane and abusive – it is not Scientology!
If someone dies – there is no HE&R. Robots are like that! Bat Shit Crazy!
Hallie Jane says
+1 Any real ability would include the ability to not do it.
Draco says
Just Me – you are so right – being a scientologist creates a lot of confusion on the subject of death. I had a real problem on how to deal with the deaths of people I knew when in. Their relatives seemed so OK with it, and I could not really understand that. I did not know if I should hug them and say “Sorry for your loss” or just ignore the subject entirely out of sheer awkwardness.
My daughter taught me a great lesson: When her father’s mother died, she was offered a session to deal with her grief. She said “No! I am sad she’s dead and I don’t want to feel ‘not sad’! That’s not normal.” She was 12 at the time.
Hallie Jane says
Such wisdom, out of the mouths of babes…….brilliant!
Gail Pike says
My husband and I were friends with a couple in their 60ies. They both passed away and their daughter also passed away. This was fifteen plus years ago. Not much chance of “enturbulation”. I would not post if I thought it would hurt anyone. This couple was on the ship back in the early Royal Scotsman days. They had four children so at first it was OK, then not. The Dad actually had engineering credentials. So Ron hung on to him, even when Irene Dunleavy tried to escort him off the ship. Anyway later on they were living in L.A. as non Sea Org briefing course students. This guy was also an airspace engineer, in additions to his years of experience on the Great Lakes working on ships. When they lived in L.A. they lived near the complex. One of their children was hit by a drunk driver and killed. The Dad found a Sea Org family that had more kids then they wanted, so they gave him the newest baby. So then it began the assertion on the part of the Dad that he had found their lost son and the assertion on the part of the Mom that this kid was not the reincarnation of her boy that had died. It was gut wrenching to watch. And I know of other such stories. Myself I admit I got confused about my own kids. It is stupid really stupid. I know of other cases. Also weird and painful to watch. The most important identity that you have is the one you have now. A new life is supposed to be a new start, free from all the errors of the past. A complete new start.
remoteviewed says
I whole heartedly agree with you Mike.
You look in the Scientology Funeral service and there’s nothing there about finding the thetan a “loving home” or whatever.
There is a reason why “known before” is the key question used on the PTSRD.
Pity the poor kid about to “brought up” by any of these looney tunes posting on FB.
I wonder if they’ll be driven out of valance or crazy first?
Joe Pendleton says
Three words – “Long Island Medium” – yes, I am talking about the one and only Theresa Caputo – get her on the line!
Miss Tia says
They think it’s normal, that’s what gets me! Where in LRH’s writing is it written that people are suppose to find ‘bodies’ for their family members and loved ones? Is this not perhaps considered ‘squirreling’? Truly Twilight Zone-ish. Whereas I am sorry for the lady’s loss of her mother, I hope she comes to terms with her loss and doesn’t expect to meet her again in this life (I don’t think any of us can say for certain if there is a next life or not).
deElizabethan says
This just shows a level of ego and in controlling another, one can assume, from this connection and mind set.
Mike Rinder says
You are right Dee. This is “fundamentalist mindset” and it goes something like this. Because I am a Scientologist, I know everything there is to know about life. I am the expert. (virtually word for word what Tom Cruise said in his infamous video…)
Because of this, I always know what is best, not just for me, but for you too.
If you don’t understand that I know, it’s only because you are uninformed. But I will not hold that against you, I will go ahead and determine what you should and should not do with your life based on my superior knowledge of everything.
And if you think I sound like an arrogant fool, it’s only because you have not been enlightened like I have and I pity you.
Roy Macgregor says
And that would be the top comment of the year.
DollarMorgue says
I second Roy. RCS think in a nutshell. It should be framed.
GTBO says
It seems to be one of the most common things when dealing with RCo$. You are made wrong no matter what; because they know best (with CERTAINTY…thanks COB)
Pathetic really
James Crouch says
You’re not kidding Mike. There is no enlightenment for those that cannot experience “Not Knowing”. When you are through learning, you are through.
Disaffected says
Correct observation. I see something else in her FB posting too. The absolute lack of any fitting emotion, Seems like she wants to display she has risen above the reach of that “low toned” emotion called grief. It’s a typical arrogant attitude: it’s just a meat body you know. And I shall find the thetan a new home!
I bet she doesn’t have the faintest idea how she will pull that one off. This woman is DELUDED. It’s so sad.
Anon says
Yes, yet another part of the tech the church chooses to ignore and misinterpret.
“Misemotion” is now anything that isn’t compliant or cheerful and above.
We can talk all day about the foibles and eccentricities of LRH, but in fact what he wrote on “misemotion” was the opposite of what the church promotes to it’s staff and parishioners. And many other professionals in the field of the mind have said the same.
One cries when a loved one dies. One becomes upset at the loss of a job. One gets angry when ordered to do something immoral. This is the gamut of emotions we have the freedom to feel in life. Psychology says it’s wrong to feel depressed, even when given a logical reason to feel so…and apparently the church is following suit.
To “not feel” when a loved one dies is in fact “misemotion.”
Just some wog says
“Psychology says it’s wrong to feel depressed, even when given a logical reason to feel so.”
Psychology says nothing of the sort. Psychology simply looks to address the issue before the depressed person performs actions that can cause permanent harm, actions they might not have wished to commit were they in a non-depressed state.
Robert Almblad says
Things clear up when you drop your body… (and when you graduate from RCS)… Anyway, I am sure her mother is a lot better shape than she is…
Draco says
I was thinking the same thing, Robert. Who knows what happens after death. Maybe Mum got a much clearer look at the whole subject of Scn and has decided “No thanks!” People should be left to make their own decisions – it is part of their journey.
knatherthomas says
I went through this weirdness when my former husband died. Not too long after he passed my girls were told by a close friend of their dad that he knew who he was now. At the time my youngest daughter thought that she, her older sister and I should try to see this young boy. I said “No. The last thing he needs is to see the 3 of us.” Even though my girls were suffering from not having said good-bye to their dad (he died suddenly due to a massive heart attack) they quickly saw what a mistake this would be. Unfortunately, a couple of OT VIIs I knew continued to randomly assure me from time to time that my former husband was doing okay.
It is so annoying to have people assert they know these things, as though their relationship to him was somehow superior to ours. Since no one in the family saw his body it has become familial folklore that he may have faked his death. (Something none of us would put past him.) One way or another he took a powder nearly 19 years ago. No one would be happier than me to see him at the front door…Fantasy Island moment for sure.
Old School says
Disgusting. The worst part is that those “OT’s” are knowingly lying to your daughters in their time a grief. If someone had done that when my wife died I would have put them in the hospital. For a very, VERY long time.
SILVIA says
Good point Mike and, on the same line of thought, why don’t they let her choose whatever she wants? She may be by now wherever she decided to go; leave her alone and in peace. After all it is her life.
But I guess they are dramatizing the freaking control the Church has been inculcating (implanting) on them.
Mike Rinder says
Exactly Silvia.
Missy Wog says
What if the mother and daughter discussed this and the daughter is only asking as together they thought it would be helpful to ask and the mother wanted another Scientology family baby for her assumption?
Hubbard says ” The being is usually there for the funeral, certainly.” and the daughter specified March 26th for the service and the daughter may very well be taking Hubbard’s statement “The person doesn’t just back out ordinarily and forget all about it. He backs out of it with full identity and hangs around for quite a while. The being is usually there for the funeral, certainly. He will very often hang around his possessions to see that they are not abused, and he can be given upsets if his wishes aren’t carried out with regard to certain things.”
So what if the daughter is asking to carry out the wish of her mother?
For the full Hubbard lecture I have quoted from see http://www.ronthephilosopher.org/phlspher/page56.htm
Espiritu says
Reincarnation is real to me. It is not real to everyone. It is also a sensitive matter, because it addresses the subject of “death” which can generate much disagreement and, understandably, upset.
Evaluation, especially for children should never be done. Especially with regard to who they are. Their beingess is for them to discover and create for themselves. Not evaluating for others is part of the Auditor’s Code of Scientology. In the last sentence in the auditor’s code L. Ron Hubbard says, “It could be called the moral code of Scientology.” And it should be.
Not everyone has the viewpoint that reincarnation is real and that is OK with me. Many intelligent and beautiful people look at the universe from different points of view. Here is a little humor which hopefully people of all persuasions can enjoy:
http://iwastesomuchtime.com/on/?i=39506
Just some wog says
“why don’t they let her choose whatever she wants?” Er, this is no less crazy.
Mike Rinder says
It’s only crazy if you don’t think people live more than one lifetime. How is it “crazy” to say someone should be able to choose to live their life as they wish, not as someone else tries to dictate to them?
Just some wog says
If you believe in multiple lifetimes *and* the ability to control one’s destiny after death, than what Sylvia is saying makes just as much sense as advertising on Facebook for a volunteer body. After all, doesn’t Mom have the option? As it happens, I do not believe in life after death, so all of this sounds equally crazy to me. The idea that the soul can do as it pleases after death is, IMHO, just more Hubbard sci-fi culty kool-aid.
1subgenius says
Sad.
Mooser42001 says
Sad? You bet! I’ve been trying to get a new body for myself for over forty years and have had no luck at all. It doesn’t even have to be a sound body, since I can’t match that contribution to the deal.