What happened to Clive Rabies?
Clive was the worldwide cheerleader of the “10,000 onto and through Solo NOTs” campaign. A target that has been around for more than 20 years and has STILL not been attained. Last time they reported they had not even cracked 7,000 — notwithstanding that of that number I would estimate HALF are no longer scientologists or are dead.
We havent heard much from Clive for a while and now he has surfaced with a new gig:
Oh, how the mighty have fallen.
He is now pitching prosperity and dissemination?? THIS is now the route to planetary salvation? Remember, the 10,000 are supposed to steer the planet straight into glory like they brought down the Berlin wall.
This is a very strong indicator that things are bad at the top of the bridge. Rather than the Deputy Captain of the FSO for the Advanced Org being needed at Flag to ensure all the public are being serviced, he is out trying to round up fresh meat. And not even those who are ready for Solo NOTs, but down to the level of a Class V org to help them get new people in.
Clearly Flag is starving for new public.
Another advertisement for the implosion of scientology from the bottom all the way to the top.
Juan Carlo Ocampo says
Hi Mike can you please talk about elder abuse in the cherch and how they dropped and offload penny less and in some cases they ask them to drop the body please this is big , thanks to you and Leah for doing this.
Here is a post by one of the tech people directly involved with the 10k Solo Nots activity. …some actual statistics
There are about 5,300 Solo Nots Auditors worldwide and about(depending on their current status):
1,000 Green tags
1,100 Grey tags
900 Orange tags
800 Purple tags
1,500 Black tags
The 10,000 on Solo Nots is just a dream. There is only 1,000 of them auditing regularly.
I was Solo Nots D of P Europe and i personally met the following Solo Nots Auditors. They were all with advanced cancer:…”
Thanks for the info. Good to have actual stats.
Wow, sure sucks to be a So Low Nuts auditor.
Hi dchoiceisalwaysrs says. We worked together in the Solo Nots HGC in 2006. All True. I blew in March 2007. Would love to re-connect. You can ask Mike for my E-mail.
Old Surfer Dude says
You know, I’ve been thinking (sometimes that gives me a headache) maybe they meant 10 onto and through solo nots, and someone decided to up the number as 10,000 as a gag. Makes a lot more sense….doesn’t it?
Yes but what about the 47x thingy?
4 swings FN says
Probably should be hearing or reading about Super Power Powers soon?
Edward Evers says
I was a Scientologist from 1960 to 1980 and had many great cognition’s. I once keyed out the bank in a repair session, but my auditor opened her big mouth and asked me: What did you do, key out the bank? That instant I looked, and everything came crashing back in on me. I was never able to re capture the feeling.
Like most gullible members, I wrote several letters to Ron. In one letter I asked if an AOLA was ever going to be created. I received a letter back saying there were no plans on the table for a Los Angeles AOLA. I had heard so many success stories from previous clears and I spoke to clear #1 in person at the L.A. mission on temple street. So, I took a leave from my job at Rockwell and went to St. Hill and did level 5 and 6. I went to Edinborough and did the Clearing and OT I. By the time I got back home to Anaheim, CA, AOLA was established and running. I was later told by one of Ron’s comm officer that bags of mail would be brought to him and he would touch each bag and say, “Ok, I received them, now you go read and answer them”. Ron’s order read, “All mail addressed to me shall be received by me”. All I can say is “WOW”.
My Wife was declared because she was against all the money I was spending. In the meantime I was paying Mary Corydon to audit my eldest Daughter, (she was schizophrenic and by polar). Bent and Mary Corydon were the owners/operators of the Riverside, CA mission and were becoming upset with the cherch for demanding more and more money from them. When the cherch demanded that I disconnect from my Wife and two Daughters, Bent told me he was getting out and I should also. I left the cherch, was declared and continued my levels with Bent and Mary to OT V.
Bent decided to write a book about Ron and interviewed many of his friends who had first hand experiences with Ron. Bent called his book, L. Ron Hubbard, Madman or Messiah. Being a research and development engineer from the apollo and minutman programs, I was able to build a computer and install a writing program for Bent. Bent went on tour to every radio and TV station that would have him, and promoted his book. He was met in parking lots by Scientology people in black suits and black cars. Most of the times, they beat the crap out of him. Two of them came to my door and asked if I knew Bent. I said, “Yes I know the SOB. He owes me $20,000.00 and if I catch up with him, I’ll beat the crap out of him”. That seemed to satisfy their curiosity and they left, never to return.
Mike, I think Leah should get in touch with Bent and ask if he is willing to come forward with his story. I hope I haven’t put him in danger by writing this.
Regards and keep up the good work,
I did the comm course at the Riverside Mission, 1978.
Edward, thank you for this excellent post. Your story is amazing. And if scientology sent thugs to beat up Bent Corydon (NOT JUST ONCE!), all I can say is, WOW!
Chris Shelton said it best in one of his videos: (in summary) when you think you’ve seen the bad in scientology, just hang on, it gets worse.
All those still involved in scientology, to you I say, you are one of three types: perpetrators, enablers, or naively/willfully ignorant. You are on the wrong side of history.
George M. White says
Thanks for your story, Edward.
“Most of the times, they beat the crap out of him.”…Holy Cow! I’ve never heard this before. Along with the obvious questions springing to my lips as re his police reports of such encounters. This is incredible!
Ronn S. says
I’m sure ol’ Clive is an expert on flourishing and prospering… I remember rumour floating around after the Berlin Wall fell, that all the OTVIIs & VIIIs surely had major influence on it (or something like that). 😀
john johnson says
Sad about Scientology…started out with a noble purpose but gradually morphed into a monetary scheme :Miscavige’s get rich quick.
LOL, no john johnson. It started out as a get rich scheme by L. Con. By his own admission, L. Con couldn’t get enough money and riches. It was an obsession.
I actually think it was started for the purpose of making money. Maybe it was fun and people did go into it with good intentions, but the founder intended to make money from it. He’s quoted as saying “If you want to get rich, the best way is to start a religion”.
James Morris says
“You can do this…Fumble around with it a bit, get some practice. Get expert.” —LRH, 2 May, 1960
Definitely MO for Tubby! Except for the last: he was never expert at anything aside from lying and bullshitting. Even then, the bloviator-in-chief has underwhelmed upon those last two elements.
This policy citation always evokes the image in my mind of Cap’n Laffy battering Mexican islands for fumbling and practicing along with his getting expert at hunting and sinking Pacific Coastal sea mounts by way of hours upon hours of nighttime naval depth charge explosions.
But that’s just me.
It’s amazing isn’t it? The absolute incredulity of their members just staggers the mind.
You see, I thought I personally took down the Berlin Wall and caused the fall of communism way back one day in 1989 by putting my socks on in a way that was differently from the normal routine. Therefore, the chain of events, unleashed by my simple act, brought down communism. Oh, but I forgot to predict this outcome in advance, so that is why nobody gives me credit.
This is the logic of a scientologist.
In my opinion, whether or not SOLO NOT’s auditors had anything to do with bringing down the Berlin Wall, everyone INCLUDING the Church of Scientology should at least be happy that it happened. Can you imagine someone professing to people that he or she misses communism and the police state eastern Europe used to be? Anyone like that most likely would be considered a little off the wall! 🙂
L Yash says
Now the NEXT huge “wall to bring down” with be that razor sharp barbed wire surrounding the Hemet CA location…….anyone think that will happen within the next 10 years?
L. Yash, as re that wall in Hemet here’s what I think should be sequentially done:
1) Free everyone including Miscavige from Gold Base
2) Set everyone free except Miscavige; temporarily detain Him somewhere.
3) Rebuild the existing wall around Gold Base; make it really big and beautiful except for one 4’13” opening.
4) Bring Miscavige back to Gold Base, push him thru the opening and have someone guard him while the opening is totally closed and the entire wall around the property is sealed and impenetrable.
5) Helicopter the Miscavige’s guard out of there, leaving Miscave at liberty behind the wall.
5) Make Him pay for it.
Typos, typos…that’s what I get for trying too hard to be clever 🙂
All is forgiven here, Aqua-M. You are among friends, not scientologists.
There’s actually a movie about an older woman who is in a years-long coma when the Berlin wall falls, and when she awakes, her children and family conspire to keep her from finding out that communist East Germany no longer exists, afraid that the shock of it may kill her. It’s quite funny — they produce fake news broadcasts for her to watch on TV, reproduce package labels for food and household products that no longer exist, etc. It’s called “Good Bye, Lenin!”
The very statement “whether or not SOLO NOT’s auditors had anything to do with bringing down the Berlin Wall,” is absurd on its face, and is a total non-starter for whatever comes after. How about “whether or not I can fly to the moon on a pogo stick” for a supposition. My money, in both examples, is on not.
You don’t have to try to guilt anyone into giving credence to the absurdity just because we can all applaud the result. The Church of Scientology doesn’t give two shits about the Berlin Wall, unless one of Hubbard’s buried treasure troves was lost in time beneath it. The causes of the fall of the Wall are well known to everyone. There’s no need to suppose hidden magical forces for the self-serving benefit of the supposers. SOLO NOT’s is a soul and money sucking abomination perpetrated on hoodwinked customers of the criminal enterprise.
Chee Chalker says
I’m sorry but this kind of thinking does work….. the Chicago Cubs won the World Series because I did not sit down during the last inning.
If you need more proof than that, well, I just feel sorry for you.
funny! 🙂 How many of us do things like that, convinced they work – I know I do! lol.
And that is how I helped the Patriots win too!! ?
WAYC, stop all this fake news. The truth is that Donald Trump brought down the Berlin Wall back in 1989. He woke up one morning in his 24 carat gold bed and decided it had to be done and that he alone could do it so he used what’s called a Penthouse Postulate, of which only he is capable. To this day the lying media won’t tell the truth about it. Criminals!
I Yawnalot says
What?! Solo NOTs not working to solve mankind’s problems… oh my… does that mean the Bridge is a fake salvation and Scientology is a scam?
What’s that I hear? No… it can’t be… or did I just hear someone say – I tried to tell you?
“Look don’t listen.” Perception is Scientology’s worst nightmare, along with the internet.
Spoiler alert: This is a depressing comment.
For the last two years of his wife’s life, my little brother had a certain look on his face. It was his “brave face”. You would ask him how he was. He would say. “Ok”. For the last six months of his wife’s life, his “brave face” became set in stone. His reply to “how are you” became “one foot in front of the other.”
Why do I tell you this? Because if you look at Clive’s face in the photo, you see my brother’s determined “brave face”. Behind it and hanging over his head, you see the impending sense of doom that my brother knew was was there and that he fought tirelessly to keep at bay.
The day he knew his wife had lost her battle, the day we said goodbye to her, his brave face went away. He allowed his real, vulnerable face to show and looked younger because he accepted his fate.
Clive’s brave face is sad to me. The set of his jaw hurts my teeth. He knows what he is doing is not succeeding. It’s interesting to have compassion for this guy because of this.
After reading your comment a story by Harlan Ellison springs to mind; “I Have No Mouth, and I Must Scream.”
It makes me think of James McMurtry’s Carlos and Ruby
And holding back the flood
Just don’t do no good
You can’t unclench your teeth
To howl the way you should
So you curl your lips around
The taste of tears and the hollow sound
That no one owns but you
No one owns but you
watching captives who refuse to admit they are in chains is painful.
Great comment, Valerie. I believe it was Kate Millet who said, “The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off”. I would add that it can also first cause enormous pain. But its still healthier than living in a deluded state.
Valerie, thanks for sharing. This is a comment that makes one think, and turns into a helpful story for the rest of us, always navigating through life. I hope your brother is doing well.
@TJ It’s been almost 7 months now since she died. He’s doing a bit better each day, some are better than others, thanks for caring.
Just this weekend, he sold the car that he bought when she got ill that he used solely for the 70 mile daily commute from his work to the hospital. Huge step, as it just sat there for 7 months reminding him….
He also went on his first sort of date. He went to a play with the youngest daughter of my mother’s best friend, who also happens to be a dear friend of mine and the first person I texted when his wife died. She was a good friend of his wife and knows her value to the family.
If it works out between them (I’m not going to get ahead of myself – baby steps right now), it would be spectacular. I know and adore her and she already knows I’m crazy. If not, at least my brother is working through his grief.
It’s good to hear and here’s hoping things continue to look up. He’s lucky to have you in his life as well. 🙂
Valerie, I’m going give the opposite response as I have had several run ins with Clive. He was and probably still is a cocky, heartless asshole. I remember him coldly telling me while smiling that he was writing off someone I knew. That person was elderly and ill and so he was no longer a prospect for Solo Nots. And Clive said, “oh, we will pick him up next lifetime”. I have no sympathy for Clive Raby. I think he is a henchman for the Mecca of scams. F–k him. I can’t wait to see Flag crumble.
George M. White says
In 1987, I worked in the unit phone calling OT VII’s to keep them on Solo Auditing. I called about one hundred people. About half were doing a few hours a week. About one quarter of the 100 were totally stalled. The rest were a mixed bag with stats going up and down.
The Unit I/C, a very dedicated SO lady, was declared suppressive about six months later.
I was lucky to finish OT VII. I demanded service and I just wore them down.
The mortality rate among my OT VIII friends is very high.
Interesting comment, George W. When you say the mortality rate among your OT VIII friends is very high, are they dying earlier than most people normally do? It is just the natural attrition rate due to old age? Or do you see a correlation between doing OT VIII and dying earlier than usual? I’m just curious.
George M. White says
I do not have scientific proof. However, my FSM died about 3 years after OT VIII. She maintained that the e-meter caused her cancer. She sought remedy at Flag but was turned away. Second FSM died ten years later due to financial ruin. Best friend died after about 15 years later at about 71. OT VIII and its aftermath was very stressful. I’m lucky to be alive. I think that the original OT VIII was deadly. I heard rumor that the wife of a local radio celebrity died from it a few months after the Freewinds. I have no proof. But it is dangerous.
Later versions of OT VIII were mild.
George W, thank you. I haven’t done OT VIII but I heard it is a lot of Listing and Nulling as you find out whether identities you have been before (which came up in sessions and was culled from pc folders), are then listed and nulled to find out if it was a true identity or you never were that person. LRH stated that the most upset a case can get into is usually L & N errors. So that makes sense that these errors, uncorrected (Flag refused to help your friend after VIII), can cause case upset that results in many bad things, specifically death. Was the version you did the one where LRH talks about being Lucifer and says Jesus was a pedofile and Satan etc?
Old Surfer Dude says
I also heard this about OT 8s. Not sure what to make of it.
John Doe says
Maybe 12 or so years ago, I went to a “must attend, mandatory briefing by Mr. Clive Rabey”.
There were a lot of people there. I’d guess 80-100, many “stalled OT 3” or OT5.
Of course, it was a big sales pitch to get these losers into OT 6 & 7.
It was the most joyless, “now-you’re-supposed-to” presentation of its type that I’d ever attended. There was no talk about wins, happiness, OT Powerz; no honey to attract the flies.
Instead, it was a make wrong for being in scn 20-30 years and not being at the top yet. Oh, and stories about the woman who finally got to flag and being told she couldn’t get on “the level” because she was now just too old.
OT 7 was presented as an arduous task that had to be done, was going to take years and hopefully you’d get it done before you died. Oh, and whether you actually were interested in doing it really was irrelevant because it was your duty to the planet and the universe to do it.
Gee, where do I sign?
Rabey’s briefing was well-practiced though. He’d done it probably countless times because he spoiled it off so effortlessly.
So what does that tell you? That it probably worked, to some degree, to get people to Flag to start OT6.
But I could read the subtext. And to me, that was, “Being on the level sucks, isn’t any fun, but you do it so you don’t feel guilty for not doing it.”
That told me something about how OT 7 was being delivered was really off the rails and was the point I decided I would stay away unless something changed drastically for the better.
It only got worse.
Well-done Clive Rabey.
John Doe, thanks for sharing your experience and perspective.
What struck me, was the positioning of the perfunctory nature of doing OT 7 and 8 – not the real lure of possibility or the promise of ability, though there is some of that still promoted as well. But of course as time goes on OTs are not living up to Hubbard’s promises and showing themselves to be anything special, much less taking the world by storm, so the lack of real results casts a pall over the hype. And there are even the sad cases, like the bankrupt Richie Acunto who had his status trophies sold on ebay and now is trying to sell off the prepaid package he purchased for OT 9 and 10 – not to mention the infamous deaths of so many OTs.
This all sounds like commitment bias taken to the next level – the idea that you’ve already come this far, so you might as well finish. It’s quite telling of the state of things, that Scientology is resorting to a dreary sales pitch for its highest levels. Hubbard would have probably kept creating latest-and-greatest offerings, and promoting them in his typically charismatic way, but Miscavige is left stuck trying to flog a dead horse.
Old Surfer Dude says
You paint a dystopian future for the cult, John Doe. And I like it!
Every single OT I knew is “officially” or “unofficially and in hiding” out or deceased.
Sorry, correction: except for the Steiners…
How many livers has Tom received now anyway?
James Morris says
I heard of four transplants. I imagine Tom had his work cut out for him dealing with all the new boby thetans he’d picked up that hitched a ride on each transplantation. Maybe the added load upon his reactive bank explains stealing all the mission money? Perhaps a viscous circle of pulling in his liver failures/being out ethics?
Do you suppose his liver failure had anything to do with the massive niacin dosages for Purif?
Cat daddy says
Bingo, and you see many non OT’s thriving in non scientology set ups, Am I right ?
Cat daddy says
Oh my it was a more sinister comment that I could Imagine, I am a former Anon. Mike Rinder knows. I miss Marty on his blog.
But on OT’s. (my belief)
Harpoona Frittata says
J&D all you like, you Impediments to Planetary Clearing (IMPs), our Dear Leader and his loyal officers are going to have the last laugh here!
Once the new state-of-the-art multi-media production/broadcast studio gets rolling in June, whatever difficulties in reaching our targets that we might be currently experiencing will be a thing of the past! When waffling cherch members and raw meat public get a load of the spiritual wonders that await them on their journey up the bridge, they’re going to be busting down the doors and throwing fistfuls of cash at every Ideal Org’s registrars…Believe It!
But planet-wide dissemination doesn’t come cheap, so we’re asking that every church member in good standing commit to tithing 10% of their gross income to fund this sure-fire initiative. But of course, tithing at a higher rate than this mandatory minimum figure is both welcome and encouraged! CoB and his top management staff are well aware that some church members who are struggling financially may be unduly burdened by this mandatory minimum tithing “request,” so in lieu of the monthly auto-payments being deducted from your paycheck or bank account, your total commitment to the cause can also be achieved by volunteering one or more of your minor age children to work for the church until the mandatory minimum voluntary donation of $1,000 per month is reached, at which time your children will be returned to you.
Planetary Clearing is a dream that hundreds of millions will soon share when the SMP starts theta-casting 24/7 to bring you and yours all of the $cn Good News from around the world! Remember, the sun never sets on $cn, because our world-wide network of Ideal Orgs has spread like wild fire to every continent on the planet and now stand ready to welcome the spiritually thirsty throngs clamoring to drink the ever-flowing waters of Spiritual Truth from the perpetual font of wisdom that LRH built for us all!
Your tip for the day on perfecting anyone’s dissemination tech ………….
GET OUT OF THE STINKING CULT NOW!
And Clive, you will be amazed at how many you say that to will likely take your advice. I suggest you do the same.
Old Surfer Dude says
“…notwithstanding that of that number, I would estimate HALF are no longer Scientologists or are dead.” Ladies & gentleman, I give the shrinking world of Scientology. And with little or no new people coming in, why, they’re just shit outta luck.
Otherwise the attrition rate is going to bite you in the ass.
This blog has long been the go-to one-stop-shop for the inside scoop on your cult. And Tony’s has the cover of ISN posted online before it arrives to your bloated mailing list; where did you get the idea that you can make or steal a market share with a SuMP?
Clive, either you throw people under the bus or you are thrown under the bus. That’s the entire operating procedure in scientology. Expect to see your pink feet sticking out any day now, if they haven’t already done so. There are lots of soft places to fall out here. There really are. It’s not the mean awful place the people in there would have you believe it is.
TOOT to OT says
On any given day, how many non-SO people could be on a service at Flag? Or actually standing inside the SuperPower building itself?
So many square feet, so few actual feet.
So little effect making the planet a better place.
My pets are making our EARTH better on their own…and I’m NOT kidding.
Old Surfer Dude says
Pets always make the Earth better…
Mary Smith says
My guess is 10 based on the cars parked around the SP building and in the parking lot. Usually, there are spots open to park close to the door.
Clide Rabies! Lol. I like that better than Rabey.
Old Surfer Dude says
Just look at his face and you can tell he actually does have rabies! At some point, they’re going to have to change the name to, Church of the Extremely Old & Dying.
If Mr. Rabey has actually drilled “thousands” of Scientologists on this technology and if it’s truly the “perfect dissemination tech,” then it would stand to reason they would have thousands and thousands of new people being brought in on a regular basis.
What are the outpoints in all this, Clive? What’s the actual situation? What’s the real why?
OMG, Clive, is your head exploding?
Start with these as data points, Clive. SENIOR POLICY: “Always deliver what was promised”
FIRST POLICY: “Maintain friendly relations with the environment and the public.”
Old Surfer Dude says
LDW, you better stop being reasonable…NOW!
LDW, my thoughts also. After 50 years of opportunity to practice the perfection of ‘tech’ and ‘admin’ one might expect … something ……. anything ….. positive. sigh.
If this Rabie dude is meant to be having a seminar to educate the sheep on how to disseminate Scientology, his first step would be to enlighten them that they have to have enough balls to actually admit that they are part of this toxic cult.
I would say drinking a minimum of 10 beers as the first step in Scientology dissemination techniques. With enough cans of courage you can admit to all of your faults. Hell, I’ve told a bar stool that I loved them.
Seriously though, how are they meant to disseminate SCN when 90% of them are embarrassed that they are even associated with it. For 35 years I never told any of my friends that I once was a part of this BS – I hid it as it is far too embarrassing.
We knew, deep down, we all knew this was a shitty organisation to bring anyone into and we shied away from disseminating. I did.
I used the excuse that I was having a hard time and hardly an example of what to expect from scn. I was broke, had no home, barely a job, was lost and lonely, etc. The people, for the most part, were shitty.
Before scn, I had property, bought new cars every three years as a matter of course, had a good career, was financially successful, brought up my family as a single Mom including putting children through university. I had a stack of close friends with whom I socailised three times a week. I didn’t have time to be lonely and they were nice people.
After scn, I could barely sustain myself and at one point, delivered pizzas in a borrowed, clapped out car, with the breaks metal on metal. How could I ask anyone to come in, pray?
Actually, I WAS an example of what life would be after scn. Lol!
Well good buddy, we know you don’t PROMISE SQUAT and that there are NO RELATIONS with the public, friendly or other fucking wise.
So your Senior Policy and your First Policy had better be ditched while you go for Plan X. And by the way Dave, one of your still in and in good standing blokes mentioned that he recalls there were about 280 field auditiors sending in weekly reports back in the day ……… 1992 or so. Today rumor has it there are about 20.
So back to Plan X Dave …………… when plans, programs and policies are not getting results …….whaddayado Dave????????????????? Keep on keepin on or, or, or or what Dave?
So lets see how your new SuMP will do in turning this shitty mess around. Hell Dave, by June you will likely be down to 10 field auditors or less! Declare the downstat bastards Dave, you know they deserve it!
Mat Pesch says
Predictable. Criminal exchange will eventually catch up with any business, I mean religion.
Old Surfer Dude says
I mean cult…
I mean MEAN!
Old Surfer Dude says
Whoa! A double mean! I’ve only read about them and now I’m actually looking at one! This proves double ‘means’ actually exists!
Jere Lull (35 yrs recovering) says
OSD: they’re only MEANs to the END
Old Surfer Dude says
And the story closes…
Thanks. I love good news like this. Like the absence of Jeff Miniz good news – been so long I’ve forgotten how to spell his name.
So where is Jeff Mintz? Did he get put in the RPF? Or did he leave the church?
… and away goes scamology, down the drain.
Even in indie-land it is dead. The last “major” scamology site, Millstone Two; has gone inactive since last year.
Old Surfer Dude says
“…and away goes scamology down the drain.” Roto cult-drain!
Old Surfer Dude says
Well,damnit! Someone’s got to do it!
“Millstone Two”…good one 🙂
Thanks Aqua I stole it from Espi. I wish I had his wit. 🙂
Ha Ha! Back at you with that. We all steal Espi’s immortal puns.
And unlike Scientology, I don’t expect anything in exchange for them.
Idle Morgue says
Well, when OT’s are dropping like flies (cancer and other strange deaths) …
And SP’s are coming out of Scientology in droves….
WE are reversing that entheta (Scientology evil cult) to Theta (the truth) ratio and making Scientology clearing a reality.
Good job Mike Rinder!
John P. Capitalist says
Mike says “Last time they reported they had not even cracked 7,000 — notwithstanding that of that number I would estimate HALF are no longer scientologists or are dead.”
I think Mike is being too conservative here. Conservative, when you’re crunching numbers, has nothing to do with politics. A conservative assumption is the one that’s least favorable to your argument. When all the assumptions are conservative and the argument still holds up, that means your conclusions are more likely to be correct.
My take is that substantially fewer than 50% of those fewer than 7,000 OT 7’s and 8’s are still involved. Here’s my thinking: the best estimate I can come up with is that worldwide membership in Scientology is around 20,000, with about 5,000 on staff and in the Sea Org. Relatively few of those are even “clear” much less OT. Of the 15,000 public, I believe the OT 7-8’s are a very small percentage of the total.
One key data point is the fact that the Valley Org OT committee is only about 25 people out of a total public in the area of about 1,000 people. In other words, far fewer than 5% of people in the biggest concentration of Scientologists in the world are still involved and are OT’s of any level (maybe not even up to OT 7-8). And I would bet that a much higher percentage of public in LA or Clearwater are OT’s than public in places like Albuquerque, Battle Creek, Columbus or Kansas City. So if even 2,000 OT 7-8s are still involved in the cult I would be surprised.
As Mike says, an increasing number of OT 7-8s will be soon leaving the cult in a box as a rapidly aging demographic dies off.
(this may be a duplicate posting rewritten as I posted on this before an got an odd error message when I clicked “post”; please delete one of these if so.)
George M. White says
“As Mike says, an increasing number of OT 7-8s will be soon leaving the cult in a box as a rapidly aging demographic dies off.”
There are a lot of OT VIII’s from the last ten years that I know who are doing very well. They got out when Miscavige started his heavy push for donations. These people
are still strong but totally out.
My generation of OT VIII’s from the 1980-1990 time period are not so fortunate.
From my own sample, about half have died.
Not all OT VII’s and OT VIII’s fit the cult pattern. Many such as myself were damaged but not killed off.
I estimate that Scientology owes us about $250,000,000.
Harpoona Frittata says
We’re about as likely to get accurate statistics reported by the cult as Oatee 8s are to see Oatee 9&10 finally being released before they “drop the body”. So it’s difficult to get an accurate read-out on the cherch’s current level of success, much less track its year-to-year trend line, beginning with the inception of lil davey’s Ideal Org initiative in 2003.
However, since the cherch has never been shy about reporting its success stats in an “aspirationally truthful” manner, it’s certain that the total number of Oatee super beings reported by the cherch isn’t ever going to err on the low side. So, if we take the official cherch count of the total number of $cilons who’ve become Oatees and subtract from it the number of dead Oatees, as well as those who are no longer active members, then we arrive at a much more meaningful statistic that actually reflects the true rate of cult success in getting folks all the way up the bridge, where all those who’ve already made it are waiting patiently on the Front Porch of their Eternities with paid-in-full receipts for Oatee 9&10 clutched in their hot little hands.
Whether the actual number of Oatee active members is closer to 2,000 or 5,000 matters very little, though, because even that high estimate represents such a paltry rate of success that even the most Kool-aid drunk $cilon couldn’t help but notice that for all the “happy talk” of expansion and progress, $cn’s ultimate measure of success is beyond horrible, especially given the cherch’s estimate of total cherch membership being in the millions!
Indeed, instead of calling it a “success stat,” one might more accurately describe it as the “barely surviving rate,” or even as a “failure rate,” if there’s been downward trend in the year-to-year totals over the years since 2003, when lil davey first launched the Ideal Orgs intiative. I’m willing to bet my last BT that, instead of being “straight and vertical,” the real number of living Oatees who are still active cherch members in good standing is closer to flat-lined…which sounds like success to me!
When is lil davey the false-reporting Super SP on $cn’s lines finally going to have his squirrelly ass held to account for wasting hundreds of millions in members’ donations on big, fancy, empty buildings that have done nothing to accomplish the cult’s prime objective of getting these earth folks cleared and up the bridge? Whenever that day finally arrives, it sure won’t be until the rank-and-file $cilons who’re footing the bill for all this off-policy nonsense wake the fuck up and take a long hard look at what the cult’s “success” stats actually are!
Hey everyone, not related to today’s post but important nonetheless:
Scientology is testing Facebook marketing. They’re using a fanpage that’s something to the tune of “Atlanta Marriage Counseling”. They don’t even have the guts o use their own name.
Take it from me, they’re going to try and branch this out of Atlanta and into places like Saint Hill.
IF YOU DO SEE ADS ON FACEBOOK FOR THIS, PLEASE DISLIKE AND HIDE THE ADS.
Trust me, Facebook is very picky about what they let get advertised. If too many people have negative reactions, they’ll either take the ads down or jack up the price exponentially.
I hope they will do the latter. Should reminisce Davey of the price increases in the past. 🙂
Great tip, YoDawg.
Disliking them on Facebook is a mission for all opposed to this cult.
Not entirely related, but I like to go to the scientology website and just work the Search function for awhile. I search for things like “Does David Miscavige beats his staff”, “Where is Shelley”, “Tell me about the Hole”, etc, etc. I am pretty sure this record-keeping cult is keeping track of all its search inquiries, Some scientologist, somewhere has viewed my SP inquiries, and hopefully a seed of doubt has been planted.
I highly recommend everyone else do the same.
P. W. Dilettante says
Very well done.
Got it :). I’ve also been posting org photos guys post on tonysblog on the google maps at the address for the Scientology missions and orgs. Bad girl but its perfectly legal. What the heck – they got my grandkids I’d otherwise be spending my days with. By
Ann B Watson says
Mike this is exactly what I have hoped and fought in my way for. You have said it so strongly, ” the implosion of the Cult of Scientology from the bottom all the way to the top.” No new bodies flooding in, no huge amounts of books sold and SMP stinks anyway I look at it. There will never be enough new subscribers to fill that hole. I have such admiration for all the balls you juggle. Waves of Love to you, Christie and those two shining stars. ????
He has extremely big balls, as does Leah, Ortega, et al , and I say this with admiration.
Interested Party says
On the same level of credulity as “we brought down the Berlin wall” is the “date coincidence” and “therefore” THE cause of the Summer of Love being the release of OT3 50 years ago this year. I still come across such utterly cringe worthy statements on Facebook.