Two Special Correspondents separately sent me information about the Jonestown tragedy in the last few days. And looking over what they sent, it seems there is a point to be made.
First, I have long felt that there is no mass suicide in the future of scientology and I haven’t changed that view.
But I believe there are other fates that are the scientology equivalent of suicide (bankruptcy, destroyed families, despair at ever ‘getting up the Bridge’) and that the end story of scientology will be when everyone has been reduced to one or all of those states.
The sign above Jim Jones’ “throne” at Jonestown is an ironic reminder. Jones was not the first cult leader to march his flock over a cliff, and he won’t be the last. But can we learn from what happened there and help prevent a similar sort of destruction to people’s lives in scientology? I believe we can. And we must.
Following is an affidavit written 6 months before the mass suicide at Jonestown. It demonstrates that one CAN observe reality, break away and seek to make it widely known before further damage is done. As we know, this woman ultimately didn’t change the course of events. But what if her voice had been joined by others? What if those in positions to do something had heeded her warnings? She would have inevitably been dismissed by Jones as a “bitter apostate” telling fabricated stories. But that is another lesson to be taken from this tragedy. “Bitter apostates,” “deserters,” “traitors” or “those who could not live up to our standards” are not automatically liars.
This affidavit can be found on a website sponsored by the Department of Religious Studies at San Diego State University, here.
I have highlighted some important passages and one of our Special Correspondents provided a summary of comparisons which I include after the affidavit below.
Affidavit of Deborah Layton Blakey (Text)
Re the Threat and Possibility of Mass Suicide by Members of the People’s Temple
I, Deborah Layton Blakey, declare the following under penalty of perjury:
1. The purpose of this affidavit is to call to the attention of the United States government the existence of a situation which threatens the lives of United States citizens living in Jonestown, Guyana.
2. From August, 1971 until May 13, 1978, I was a member of the People’s Temple. For a substantial period of time prior to my departure for Guyana in December, 1977, I held the position of Financial Secretary of the People’s Temple.
3. I was 18 years old when I joined the People’s Temple. I had grown up in affluent circumstances in the permissive atmosphere of Berkeley, California. By joining the People’s Temple, I hoped to help others and in the process to bring structure and self-discipline to my own life.
4. During the years I was a member of the People’s Temple, I watched the organization depart with increasing frequency from its professed dedication to social change and participatory democracy. The Rev. Jim Jones gradually assumed a tyrannical hold over the lives of Temple members.
5. Any disagreement with his dictates came to be regarded as “treason”. The Rev. Jones labelled any person who left the organization a “traitor” and “fair game”. He steadfastly and convincingly maintained that the punishment for defection was death. The fact that severe corporal punishment was frequently administered to Temple members gave the threats a frightening air of reality.
6. The Rev. Jones saw himself as the center of a conspiracy. The identity of the conspirators changed from day to day along with his erratic world vision. He induced the fear in others that, through their contact with him, they had become targets of the conspiracy. He convinced black Temple members that if they did not follow him to Guyana, they would be put into concentration camps and killed. White members were instilled with the belief that their names appeared on a secret list of enemies of the state that was kept by the C.I.A. and that they would be tracked down, tortured, imprisoned, and subsequently killed if they did not flee to Guyana.
7. Frequently, at Temple meetings, Rev. Jones would talk non-stop for hours. At various times, he claimed that he was either Lenin, Jesus Christ, or one of a variety of other religious or political figures. He claimed that he had divine powers and could heal the sick. He stated that he had extraordinary perception and could tell what everyone was thinking. He said that he had powerful connections the world over, including the Mafia, Idi Amin, and the Soviet government.
8. When I first joined the Temple, Rev. Jones seemed to make clear distinctions between fantasy and reality. I believed that most of the time when he said irrational things, he was aware that they were irrational, but that they served as a tool of his leadership. His theory was that the end justified the means. At other times, he appeared to be deluded by a paranoid vision of the world. He would not sleep for days at a time and talk compulsively about the conspiracies against him. However, as time went on, he appeared to become completely irrational.
9. Rev. Jones insisted that Temple members work long hours and completely give up all semblance of a personal life. Proof of loyalty to Jones was confirmed by actions showing that a member had given up everything, even basic necessities. The most loyal were in the worst physical condition. Dark circles under one’s eyes or extreme loss of weight were considered signs of loyalty.
10. The primary emotions I came to experience were exhaustion and fear. I know that Rev. Jones was in some sense “sick”, but that did not make me any less afraid of him.
11. Rev. Jones fled the United States in June, 1977 amidst growing public criticisms of the practices of the Temple. He informed members of the Temple that he would be imprisoned for life if he did not leave immediately.
12. Between June, 1977 and December, 1977, when I was ordered to depart for Guyana, I had access to coded radio broadcasts from Rev. Jones in Guyana to the People’s Temple headquarters in San Francisco.
13. In September, 1977, an event which Rev. Jones viewed as a major crisis occurred. Through listening to coded radio broadcasts and conversations with other members of the Temple staff, I learned that an attorney for former Temple member Grace Stoen had arrived in Guyana, seeking the return of her son, John Victor Stoen.
14. Rev. Jones has expressed particular bitterness toward Grace Stoen. She had been Chief Counselor, a position of great responsibility within the Temple. Her personal qualities of generosity and compassion made her very popular with the membership. Her departure posed a threat to Rev. Jones’ absolute control. Rev. Jones delivered a number of public tirades against her. He said that her kindness was faked and that she was a C.I.A. agent. He swore that he would never return her son to her.
15. I am informed that Rev. Jones believed that he would be able to stop Timothy Stoen, husband of Grace Stoen and father of John Victor Stoen, from speaking against the Temple as long as the child was being held in Guyana. Timothy Stoen, a former Assistant District Attorney in Mendocino and San Francisco counties, had been one of Rev. Jones’ most trusted advisors. It was rumored that Stoen was critical of the use of physical force and other forms of intimidation against Temple members. I am further informed that Rev. Jones believed that a public statement by Timothy Stoen would increase the tarnish on his public image.
16. When the Temple lost track of Timothy Stoen, I was assigned to track him down and offer him a large sum of money in return for his silence. Initially, I was to offer him $5,000. I was authorized to pay him up to $10,000. I was not able to locate him and did not see him again until on or about October 6, 1977. On that date, the Temple received information that he would be joining Grace in a San Francisco Superior Court action to determine the custody of John. I was one of a group of Temple members assigned to meet him outside the court and attempt to intimidate him to prevent him from going inside.
17. The September, 1977 crisis concerning John Stoen reached major proportions. The radio messages from Guyana were frenzied and hysterical. One morning, Terry J. Buford, public relations advisor to Rev. Jones, and myself were instructed to place a telephone call to a high-ranking Guyanese official who was visiting the United States and deliver the following threat: unless the government of Guyana took immediate steps to stall the Guyanese court action regarding John Stoen’s custody, the entire population of Jonestown would extinguish itself in a mass suicide by 3:30 p.m. that day. I was later informed that Temple members in Guyana placed similar calls to other Guyanese officials.
18. We later received radio communication to the effect that the court case had been stalled and that the suicide threat was called off.
19. I arrived in Guyana in December, 1977. I spent a week in Georgetown and then, pursuant to orders, traveled to Jonestown.
20. Conditions at Jonestown were even worse that I had feared they would be. The settlement was swarming with armed guards. No one was permitted to leave unless on a special assignment and these assignments were given only to the most trusted. We were allowed to associate with Guyanese people only while on a “mission”.
21. The vast majority of the Temple members were required to work in the fields from 7 a.m. to 6 p.m. six days per week and on Sunday from 7 a.m. to 2 p.m. We were allowed one hour for lunch. Most of this hour was spent walking back to lunch and standing in line for our food. Taking any other breaks during the workday was severely frowned upon.
22. The food was woefully inadequate. There was rice for breakfast, rice water soup for lunch, and rice and beans for dinner. On Sunday, we each received an egg and a cookie. Two or three times a week we had vegetables. Some very weak and elderly members received one egg per day. However, the food did improve markedly on the few occasions when there were outside visitors.
23. In contrast, Rev. Jones, claiming problems with his blood sugar, dined separately and ate meat regularly. He had his own refrigerator which was stocked with food. The two women with whom he resided, Maria Katsaris and Carolyn Layton, and the two small boys who lived with him, Kimo Prokes and John Stoen, dined with the membership. However, they were in much better physical shape than everyone else since they were allowed to eat the food in Rev. Jones’ refrigerator.
24. In February, 1978, conditions had become so bad that half of Jonestown was ill with severe diarrhea and high fevers. I was seriously ill for two weeks. Like most of the other sick people, I was not given any nourishing foods to help recover. I was given water and a tea drink until I was well enough to return to the basic rice and beans diet.
25. As the former financial secretary, I was aware that the Temple received over $65,000 in Social Security checks per month. It made me angry to see that only a fraction of the income of the senior citizens in the care of the Temple was being used for their benefit. Some of the money was being used to build a settlement that would earn Rev. Jones the place in history with which he was so obsessed. The balance was being held in “reserve”. Although I felt terrible about what was happening, I was afraid to say anything because I knew that anyone with a differing opinion gained the wrath of Jones and other members.
26. Rev. Jones’ thoughts were made known to the population of Jonestown by means of broadcasts over the loudspeaker system. He broadcast an average of six hours per day. When the Reverend was particularly agitated, he would broadcast for hours on end. He would talk on and on while we worked in the fields or tried to sleep. In addition to the daily broadcasts, there were marathon meetings six nights per week.
27. The tenor of the broadcasts revealed that Rev. Jones’ paranoia had reached an all-time high. He was irate at the light in which he had been portrayed by the media. He felt that as a consequence of having been ridiculed and maligned, he would be denied a place in history. His obsession with his place in history was maniacal. When pondering the loss of what he considered his rightful place in history, he would grow despondent and say that all was lost.
28. Visitors were infrequently permitted access to Jonestown. The entire community was required to put on a performance when a visitor arrived. Before the visitor arrived, Rev. Jones would instruct us on the image we were to project. The workday would be shortened. The food would be better. Sometimes there would be music and dancing. Aside from these performances, there was little joy or hope in any of our lives. An air of despondency prevailed.
29. There was constant talk of death. In the early days of the People’s Temple, general rhetoric about dying for principles was sometimes heard. In Jonestown, the concept of mass suicide for socialism arose. Because our lives were so wretched anyway and because we were so afraid to contradict Rev. Jones, the concept was not challenged.
30. An event which transpired shortly after I reached Jonestown convinced me that Rev. Jones had sufficient control over the minds of the residents that it would be possible for him to effect a mass suicide.
31. At least once a week, Rev. Jones would declare a “white night”, or state of emergency. The entire population of Jonestown would be awakened by blaring sirens. Designated persons, approximately fifty in number, would arm themselves with rifles, move from cabin to cabin, and make certain that all members were responding. A mass meeting would ensue. Frequently during these crises, we would be told that the jungle was swarming with mercenaries and that death could be expected at any minute.
32. During one “white night”, we were informed that our situation had become hopeless and that the only course of action open to us was a mass suicide for the glory of socialism. We were told that we would be tortured by mercenaries if we were taken alive. Everyone, including the children, was told to line up. As we passed through the line, we were given a small glass of red liquid to drink. We were told that the liquid contained poison and that we would die within 45 minutes. We all did as we were told. When the time came when we should have dropped dead, Rev. Jones explained that the poison was not real and that we had just been through a loyalty test. He warned us that the time was not far off when it would become necessary for us to die by our own hands.
33. Life at Jonestown was so miserable and the physical pain of exhaustion was so great that this event was not traumatic for me. I had become indifferent as to whether I lived or died.
34. During another “white night”, I watched Carolyn Layton, my former sister-in-law, give sleeping pills to two young children in her care, John Victor Stoen and Kimo Prokes, her own son. Carolyn said to me that Rev. Jones had told her that everyone was going to have to die that night. She said that she would probably have to shoot John and Kimo and that it would be easier for them if she did it while they were asleep.
35. In April, 1978, I was reassigned to Georgetown. I became determined to escape or die trying. I surreptitiously contacted my sister, who wired me a plane ticket. After I received the ticket, I sought the assistance of the United States Embassy in arranging to leave Guyana. Rev. Jones had instructed us that he had a spy working in the United States Embassy and that he would know if anyone went to the embassy for help. For this reason, I was very fearful.
36. I am most grateful to the United States government and Richard McCoy and Daniel Weber, in particular, for the assistance they gave me. However, the efforts made to investigate conditions at Jonestown are inadequate for the following reasons. The infrequent visits are always announced and arranged. Acting in fear for their lives, Temple members respond as they are told. The members appear to speak freely to American representatives, but in fact they are drilled thoroughly prior to each visit on what questions to expect and how to respond. Members are afraid of retaliation if they speak their true feelings in public.
37. On behalf of the population of Jonestown, I urge that the United States Government take adequate steps to safeguard their rights. I believe that their rights are in danger.
I declare under penalty of perjury that the foregoing is true and correct, except as to those matters stated on information and belief and as to those I believe them to be true.
Executed this ___ day of June, 1978 at San Francisco, California.
Deborah Layton Blakey
The observations of our Special Correspondent:
a) Loyal followers on base subjected to hard physical labor seven days a week.
b) Followers fed very little.
c) Leader makes an exception for himself and his immediate family, has his own food supply.
d) leader makes hysterical attempts to bribe or threaten critics.
e) leader uses code and specialized communications to converse with outside bases.
f) Leader lectures followers for hours each day. They are expected to agree with everything leader says.
g) Leader is loses track of what is fiction and reality.
h) leader uses terms, fair game, and traitor to describe those who disagree with him.
i) (Not in this affidavit but Leader finds fanatical lawyer. Jones hired Mark Lane) Lane would continue to make excuses for Jones after his death blaming U.S. Government for pushing his mentally fragile client over the edge.
j) Leader has special security details at main base.
k) Leader always arranging new, bizarre, and dangerous tests of loyalty for followers.
l) Leader holds family members of his followers as hostages. Becomes unglued when they escape.
m) Leader isolates followers at base and has shows arranged to fool visitors.
n) Leader obsessed with outside government agencies who conspire against him. Jones feared the CIA, DM, the IRS.
o) Leader has payments to followers confiscated, in this case the elderly’s social security checks. In Scientology they target real property, inheritances and credit lines.
p) Leader harms the well being of elderly followers by depriving them of proper food,rest, and other care.
s) Leader trys to keep hold of children for cult purposes.
t) Leader thinks that they were previously one or more important historical figures.
As I said at the outset, this is not scare-mongering to try to convince anyone that there is a mass suicide on the horizon at the Gold Base.
But one thing I do agree with Jim Jones about is the quote he had hanging over his seat of honor.
It is enlightening and somewhat sobering to look back at the events of Jonestown and note the striking parallels — many of which are found in every cult — and gain some further insight into how people end up “drinking the KoolAid.” And thus better understand how it is that apparently rational people will descend into bankruptcy or tear their families apart or keep running on the treadmill of the Bridge to Nowhere. It’s NOT unique to fundamentalist scientology.
If there had been enough exposure of the true story of the People’s Temple and Jim Jones could it have prevented the tragedy? Possibly. But surely, nobody would disagree that if there WAS a chance of averting the disaster by publicizing what was going on, then it should have been done. It is why I am determined to continue to make the truth about what goes on in fundamentalist scientology as widely known as I can. If it saves a single family from destruction or one person from bankruptcy or someone from going into complete apathy about ever being happy again, it is worth the effort.
Chris Smith says
Even more evidence of how similar the two cults are;
“The Planning Commission meetings would sometimes run all night in San Francisco. They often involved long “catharsis” sessions in which members would be called “on the floor” for emotional dissections, including why they were wearing nice clothes when others in the world were starving. Other members were expected to accuse those “on the floor” of various disallowed activities, while the Temple considered it improper for the accused to mount a defense.”
Sound familiar? Or how about this;
“The Temple also asked adults to sign papers admitting various crimes and wrongdoings, including conspiring against the U.S. government, involvement in terrorist acts and molesting their own children. If such members attempted to leave the Temple, Jones threatened to release the statements.”
This is eerie!
This is interesting to see and so very sad. My spouse encouraged me to look up the Jonestown Incident and I was never interested in it. Until one day the documentary was on TV. I was immediately sucked in and had chills when I realized the similarities. I wondered if it could ever come to a mass suicide in the Sea Org and while it’s not very likely I know that there are a few who would be lured in by the promise of ‘Target Two’ and being needed there. I feel like my Mom would be one who would feel honored to make that sacrifice and “drop her body” to go to ‘Target Two’ if she was needed. Especially if the request/order came from David himself. It’s actually heartbreaking.
However, I think the Scientology version of it will just be many people left broke, broken and in despair.
I don’t normally comment, and am days late but had to share my thoughts on this one.
I’m late on the post but so glad I kept reading. This is a gem Roy – Thx
I appreciate the validation Bob. After reading your comment I did some further research…I agree with you that the theory is not a stretch.
Rob Roy says
The eerie similarities between the paranoia of Jim Jones is very close to Hubbard’s own brand of paranoia. Who’s to say that if Hubbard didn’t lose his mind to dementia that he would have eventually convinced his followers that the end was close and that ‘dropping’ their bodies was the greatest good for the greatest number of dynamics.
Thanks for this post Mike. I’ve always found Scientology a fascinating subject when one looks at it through the lens of, ‘What the hell was Hubbard (and now Miscavige) thinking?’ Although I don’t see a mass suicide in Scientology, like you I see many parallels in the CoS and other personality cults. I am fascinated by the minutes you post of how a dwindling number of Kool Aid drinkers fawn over Miscavige and paintings and quotes of Hubbard; the dead-eyed enthusiasm in the leaked testimonial videos; how they heap praise on Scientology for the simplest of things like reading a book, running in circles, to even having a thought! I’m glad that the more the CoS asks for money from its members, the fewer of them they get it from. I hope one day the non-CoS members in Clearwater get their city back.
thank God for Psychiarty without that would we never had had Engrams, secondaries and locks would we rotten old Hubbard eh!
It so sad when people haven’t even run an engram and actually touched the bank that is destroying them feel they are qualified to rubbish a subject they cannot ever hope to comprhend let alone use to help themselves and their fellow beings.
I appreciate that are there are many people that cannot make case gain or TA.
There are many reasons for this, out Tech, out Ethics, PTS’ness, etc etc.
But there are others as in C/S series 22 that only want the world to burn.
Why do such types just go and find some death cult blog to go an moan at?
Rob Roy says
Edge, Clearwater will get their city back. At the rate COS is shrinking, all that real estate will be empty soon enough and then up for sale.
Very amusing Mike.
An interesting comparison, but inaccurate, the dwarf doesn’t kill the geese laying his golden eggs.
Also there seems no end to the amount of people who keep stumping up $$$$$$$’s despite all the reasons they should not.
Besides I, like you simply walked away when enough became enough
Right on Mike! You are a good man, rare in fact. I support you.
Ms. G. says
I don’t see a mass suicide happening within Co$ anytime soon. It takes advance planning and it doesn’t seem to be there. Jim Jones prepared his people to die with “white nights” for months in advance. The People’s Temple began importing cyanide to Guyana in half-pound quantities in 1976, two years before the event.
Hello Mike… My congratulations to you for a very sobering and enlightening post.
Your final commentary that it is all worth it if your blogging efforts keep one person or family from joining up with CoS —– Well I am one who, thanks to you and a few other choice internet sites, have learned (and continue to learn) enough to NEVER get near CoS…..so I am one of those who thanks you for your work. I have been spared so much misery and ruin by NOT letting CoS or DM get their clutches on me….
Thank you….from one truly free person!
L Ron Hubbard himself stated that in order to evaluate anything you need a datum of comparable magnitude. How disgusting that Jim Jones and his cult ended up being the datum of comparable magnitude to scientology.
An how telling that the comparison works so well to evaluate it.
You should leave this post up for a month or two.
special correspondent says
If you go to the San Deigo State University Site and read Lane’s statement after the mass suicide at Jonestown http://jonestown.sdsu.edu/?page_id=13681 You will find that lane does two things. 1) He blames the government, and the CIA, and various other government intelligence agencies for the mass deaths, 2) He claims his client was “very ill” He communicated this to Ryan, and Ryan still went, and Lane imply Ryan provoked this episode. Absent in any of Lane’s comments is any acknowledgement of Jones overwhelming responsibility for the mass suicide. Note Lane also continues to blame what we would now call “whistle blowers”
Lane’s account of his contacts with Ryan are highly inconsistent with the existing record for example see his letter to Ryan http://jonestown.sdsu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/LaneToRyan.pdf in which he raises a number of issues including his demand that he be present as Jones’s attorney, and that the visit be put off because he (Lane) was not available. In his letter Lane did not mention Jones’s supposed psychological state as a reason not to make the visit. When Ryan refused to change his schedule, Lane changed his and was present at Jonestown during the mass suicide, though Lane, himself survived.
So remember kids, according to Lane, it’s not Jim Jones’s fault that he had his follower’s kill themselves, its the evil U.S. government, and the CIA, who facilitated an unarmed fact finding mission by a Congressman concerned for the safety and well being of some of his constiuents. That’s why I call Lane a fanatic, because even after the death of his client he would still spread his misrepresentations and mischaracterizations.
LANE’S STATEMENT IS BELOW
Mark Lane on KGO AM Program Wed., Jan. 31st There is a continuing operation by American intelligence to focus attention away from what really happened in Jonestown, away from their role in the murders of over 900 Americans in Jonestown, onto peripheral questions. And they are using their friends, what they refer to in the C.I.A. documents as our assets at CBS, our assets at the C.I.A., our assets at the New York Times, to prevent the facts from being known.
I begged Congressman Ryan not to go; I called his office in San Mateo and asked him not to go; I wrote a letter to him telling him that Jim Jones would see his visit as a provocation; I called Jim Scholar [Schollaert] of the House International Relations [Foreign Affairs] Committee and said that if Ryan went down there Jones would see it as a great provocation – could they at least put it off for several weeks. I told them that Jim Jones was very ill and under the circumstances he would see it as a provocation. Why did they go? In the face of those warnings, in the face of the fact that Debbie Blakey, a high-ranking official who defected from Peoples Temple in May of last year, went to Richard McCoy, then of the American Embassy, previously with Air Force intelligence for six years in the Office of Special Investigations of the U.S. Air Force, she went to him and said there are two or three hundred semi-automatic weapons in there, 25 pistols, a homemade bazooka, the lives of the people are in danger – they practice suicide. Now she told that to the State Dept.
Why did he go? Because he went to the State Dept. and Mr. McCoy of Air Force Intelligence, of the American Embassy, and then of the Guyana Desk in the State Dept., said it’s perfectly safe down there. He knew when he sent Ryan in there, he knew that Ryan might be killed. He knew of the mass suicide drill – that was discussed on radio broadcasts from Jonestown and the FCC during that entire year of 1977-78, those two years, had monitored the broadcasts from their Douglas Arizona Proving Station, about this there is no question, the FCC admits that, many people had told him that. What did he tell Congressman Ryan who raised the question. After all, I had begged him not to go. I said that it would be seen as a provocation. What did McCoy say to him? McCoy said, “Congressman Ryan, the only problems you may have down there, you will find the food and housing accommodations may not be up to your standards.[“] Why did the State Dept. send Mr. Ryan down there after I begged him not to go?
Oh yeah, I could write a book about misunderstandings .. but my conclusion would be that you have to find the right one .. not that what the meter says – because the meter will never know what you have misunderstood ..
There are scientologists who have already committed suicide. My husband and I knew three personally. One of them was even written up in Advance or some other mag that he had “dropped his body” Can we say for sure that mass suicide could never happen? Im sure there are many suicides that have occurred and swept under the rug.
Thank you Mike for not eleminating my comment .. it seems that I get no comment .. whatever it is only what I wanted to say since many times .. and as you say there are thousands who read but do not give a comment .. thank you again .. I gave a warning to everyone who should do the Introspection RD, you will go nuts on it .. no chance to hold your position .. you will be total loaded with all you possible failures which you can have in mind .. the breakthrough from LRH was to handle insanity .. but you go insane if you are not insane in the first place .. it may be helpful for an insane person .. but i would do that very very smooth
But for honor to LRH, he said that this rundown should not be delivered in doubt .. better not deliver it than failing on it .. his words .. LRH was not so bad on as the guys who deliver his misunderstoods ..
Wow. Mike, this is too close for comfort..
The similarities sent chills all over my spine.
Wake, wake Scientologists!
I was completely broken after my last auditing in my heart, soul and understanding of life .. I felt me as the worsest guy who has ever existed in any universe .. I was broken to death .. very ill ..
But I asked me than what it is all about .. it is idiotic to have such a breakdown .. but I was surely complete mix max with my thetan, my mind and my body .. as r-factor: I got the Introspection RD (there is no reason for it anyway – only I did not accept any services from the church as help for me) .. so a C/S did consider me for a candidate for this rundown .. and with it I got my breakdown .. but bad ..
In my very very bad condition I thought before dying, it will be good to know what LRH has really said, and what his intention really was. I started to get over his works from beginning to end .. no word clearing or else .. I looked only for that what made sense to me in general and what was applied to me or from that works .. and why I could not grasp that ..
I found LRH spoke in one way and then in another way and back and forth .. and a lot of things made no sense at the end. The tech is confusing for itself .. I mean, if you believe in everything what LRH has said you must be in confusion .. better to say below confusion (which is part of Super Power as I know yet) ..
Speaking about ARC. You can have a lot A and R and C and it results surely in Understanding, but it does not say what the understanding is .. if I want understanding, I have to put ARC together .. my ARC and not the ARC from another .. unfortunately in the church you have to take the ARC from LRH, today the ARC from DM and his friends ..
Some is good from LRH .. most of it is balderdash .. spinning around of DED and DEDEX (about which he himself forgot on the SHSBC) .. spinning himself down in handling of SPs .. which brought him up to his OT levels .. OT III is to some degree okay .. but it doesn’t work because it is wrong Time and wrong Space ..
For everyone who did not read my comments here and elsewhere: 70 Million years ago, there was no space as Hawaii or Las Palma (both were underwater and not existent as place on the planet) .
Everyone can read it out of an Encyclopedia .. accepting a space which is not there is a MU ..
Do not know if my comment comes through .. but why not? My english is not so good .. my american is much worser ..
Jose Chung says
Your message comes though fine. D.M.has a hidden agenda that does not
help you survival at all, the opposite. The big splendid buildings and PR make it look
good but the Whole Track is full of this nonsense and despotic criminals.
Don’t give up on true ARC that increases your survival and those around you.
gato rojo says
Friend, that was not “auditing” that you experienced. It was an attempt to introvert you, do you in. It was not auditing. Real true auditing pulls you out, extroverts you, helps you get through the troubles in life, improves your abilities.
Real TRs, used to listen to and help the preclear (for real) are long gone, and with them the apparent necessity to have GAG 1 and GAG 2 came to be. There are not many auditors on the planet who have really good TRs and who care only about the gains of their preclears. Those who are still like that AND didn’t sell out are no longer with the “church.” They could see that the GAGs are handlings based on wrong whys, and therefore will only make the situation worse, and that is happening. So they pretty much all got the heck out.
As an auditor who is actually very proud of thier auditing and accomplshments of getting people up the levels well prior to GAG1, I am truly sorry that you were duped in this way, paid money and got treated this way. The spiritual bruises can be fixed but you need to be able to tell the diferences between an auditor properly trained and someone who has GAG certs on their wall or who has been threatened into auditing in the squirrely ways now.
The very early information on communication and the beingness of an auditor is what you should take a look at and judge your future auditors (if you even want to try it) against the original LRH information on how to treat preclears and do their sessions only with the intention of improving their abilities. Get away from the C of $ as far as you can and look for a different auditor who was trained in that “old, bad, we-don’t-do-this-anymore” standard technology.
Thank you gato.
Some truly scary similarities on so many levels.
Jens TINGLEFF says
Mike, echoing your last sentence. As people here may have noticed, I’m not one for trying to convince anyone to change their beliefs in LRH, but I would very dearly like all aspiring emmbers (and the parents of all teenagers being recruited into the Damnation Navy) to have all the facts before they join…
Also, one of the sections you did not highlight, Mike, was the frequenct trial suicides held at Jonestown. That’s one of the differences which make me a little less worried about this as an end for the criminal organisation known as the “church” of $cientology.
The indicators of extremism are, otherwise, worryingly similar. And the unwillingness of the authorities to do something about it is equally perplexing and annoying. (Oh, actually, in France they know who infiltrated the office of the president of behalf of OSA in order to change the course of a particularly worrying court case and in the US we had the Snow White affair – just saying, maybe government inaction is not that hard to explain…)
The way in is much easier than the way out ..
Reading the article on Jonestown and all the posts made me think:
What is the Church of Scientology creating?
What products are they making in present time?
If you take the VFPs of each division of the Scientology org board, I would say their ONLY VFP is the one for either Dept 5 or 6 in Div II: “Income greater than outgo, plus reserves”.
That they have, in spades, but its not from selling and delivering their own services!
Their vast wealth, their “income” comes from IAS donations and Ideal Org donations neither of which are on the Scientology org board as stats (at least I never saw them when I did the Vol O course back in the day.)
So, here’s an organization that is awash in seemingly endless money, relatively littLe of which sources from the sale and delivery of any of the services which are its ostensible purpose to deliver.
What a wacky admin scale this organization would have if you tried to do a real one. Nothing would align. You wouldn’t be able to do one, actually. It would just fall apart.
So, back to the original question: What is the Church of Scientology ACTUALLY, viably creating?
And now I can see that there is something being created.
Reserves, not from products produced, not as a result of income greater than outgo, but from infusions of private money.
That’s what’s being created now, and that is what is creating the future of Scientology – vast reserves.
So what future does an organization which produces hardly anything and is vastly rich actually have?
Well, it can be sued. Its a sitting duck for being sued.
I’m down with that.
This post was so interesting I read every word.
I agree that a mass suicide at Int Base appears unlikely, however I can’t imagine anything less than a horrific scene if DM’s back was completely against the wall one day, such as facing an imminent prison sentence. I think even more important to DM than money and MEST, is having complete control over beings (a sick fixation on compliance). I don’t think DM would do anything other than try to take EVERYONE down with him if he was going down, and in that situation I think it would be hard to predict exactly what would happen.
I’ve read “conspiracy theories” like those relayed by RemoteViewed on other Ex-Church-Scientologist blogs. If there was any merit to them, then the scene at the Post-LRH Int Base could seem like a direct continuation of research into Mind Control (with Jonestown being the predecessor). Not saying I believe that but gosh the similarities are striking.
Bob Dobbs says
You are right, you TreasonousF*ck! I only just last night saw that Jonestown-CIA-mind-control-experiment theory. I have to say that, when one considers the DOCUMENTED horrors the CIA and such have engaged in, the theory is not a stretch. At all.
Bob Dobbs says
The special correspondent’s characterization of Mark Lane as “fanatical” is unfair. Just because Mark Lane has taken on controversial cases does not make him a “fanatic”. A more balanced view of the issues surrounding Jim Jones and Mark Lane can be easily obtained by googling “jim jones mark lane”. Please do.
Great post Mike, thanks!
Amongst the many horrible parallels, many far worse than what I’ll state here it was number 34 that flashed up with someone kneeling on my body on the RPFs RPF to forcefully remove a little make-up that I had put on in an act of defiance, despite arbitrary orders not to.
Yet when journalists or VIPs came to visit the PAC base we HAD TO put on lipstick for the ‘show’. Both orders completely irrelevant and B.S.!
Oops! I meant to refer to #28.
#33 also applied heavily on the RPF after being up for 3 days/nights with no sleep. The care whether to live or die was gone.
Thomas Weeks says
I’m pretty sure genius Miscavige has read all the books on cults, mind control and histories of cult leaders such as Jonestown. Then he uses that information for evil.
“I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.” ~ Thomas Jefferson
Gee Mike, thanks for hijacking my evening. This post has kept me mesmerized for hours. I have debated what to say, deleting dozens of comments, re-reading others. What an amazing amount of truth is packed into this one post.
Miscavige is obviously deteriorating physically and mentally, it’s getting harder and harder for cameras and makeup to hide the truth from the public, so he’s a loose cannon. No one would have predicted he would c/s Lisa McPherson’s Folder, no one predicted he would c/s everyone still in, but practically everyone predicted GAG2 would be a retread of GAG1.
Miscavige didn’t start Scientology, he usurped the power from another when he saw the opening. He never cared about anything but the power and what that could do for him so he is, in a way, different from Jim Jones or other religious leaders.
He refers to himself as the “Pope” of Scientology, somehow making himself either appointed or anointed, but not a founder.
He seems to have a limited capacity for creativity, only being able to take old ideas and repackage them as new. Part of that, of course is KSW, but he’s altered Scientology enough that if he really had any creativity, he would have “discovered” more tech by now.
Even “Golden Age Of” predates Miscavige. LRH came into the spotlight during the Golden Age of Science Fiction.
All that being said, the defections of his father, his niece, Diana’s daughter, as well as the lawsuits from several directions at once, daily blog reporting of the lies and abuses, and the press no longer fearing Scientology have got to have him feeling fairly trapped.
He did “beat up a phone booth” http://www.scientology-cult.com/secret-history-of-david-miscavige.html but he seems to do things only when he knows the victim will not be able to retaliate, a cowardly bully.
In my heart of hearts, I hope enough light is seeping through the cracks, and I think this because people continue to escape, that Miscavige is not secure enough in the knowledge that everyone would obey his edict that he would dare order them to commit suicide, and he is cowardly enough to not do it himself.
I do not want to see him hurt. I would rather see him stripped of his power and watch him attempt to find a job in the world perhaps working as an underling for someone he once abused. The shame would destroy him.
Excellent article, Mike and Correspondent. Mike, thank you for shining the light on it every day out of duty and not for money as you have been accused of. Keep shining the light on the evil deeds so that another Jonestown can be avoided.
Thank you Mike. This post was another eye opener for me.
For some time I’ve been concerned that Miscavige will take the rest of the flock into his desert compound and do something irrevocable and devastating. I’ve known the source of this fear. And now for the first time I see a post about Jonestown. Very scary. Very frightening.
Isn’t this the line that Rathbun was pursuing with the FBI?
Well, if they did (all commit suicide) it would certainly solve a problem in not having to handle their Ethics or FDS them or try to convince them that all they have been supporting for the past few decades was treasonous criminality! Not for this lifetime anyway. But that of course is very harsh – ha! On the other hand would you really, really care if these IAS regges, Idle Org Regges, “FSMs” leeching 10% off their fellow Scientologists, OSA, CMO Fuhrers, and those who did not say boo to a very fat goose for the last 30 years or so did top themselves? As I say, it is rather harsh but I find myself writing it and not really, er, caring. Well, alright not really, but what we are talking about here is the planned destruction of Dianetics and Scientology, so it is not a light matter and because of this I can somewhat excuse myself for thinking that way. Now DM in our (reversed) position would line them all up against a wall.
I’ve just thought that maybe this “solution” (of mass suicide by INT Base and the Whales etc. at least) might be “the greatest good for the greatest number of Dynamics”, but I am being very tongue in cheek here (or am I?) LOL! We could re-start with a slate wiped clean! Well, for a while anyway until “they come back”. Dept. 3 and Qual would have nothing to do for decades. To slightly alter LRH’s remarks to the Captain FSO (decades ago) “There is nothing superior to a bit of humor!”
Amazing post, Mike. One of your best.
I also find interesting the parallels between the woman who wrote this affidavit and you and other whistleblowers like Marty. Some people criticize you for things you did or said while in the church, but I don’t think that’s important. I’m sure you, like most others, joined to help people. Once it became clear to you that people were being actually being harmed more than helped, you got out.
Keep it up. You’re fighting the good fight.
Roy Macgregor says
Mike, you state that mass suicide is not in Scientology’s future. I disagree. Yes, certainly Bob Duggan and Kirstie Alley are not going to off themselves on DM’s request.
But the Int Base is a whole different story. There are 300-400 people there right now, and every single one of them fits the Jonestown template perfectly.
You are basing your evaluation on what DM was like the last time you saw him. How do you know what he is like right now? Psychotic personalities deteriorate over time. I agree that in 2005 DM would not force the entire Int Base to commit suicide (or poison their kool aide). I completely disagree that DM will not do that in 2015 or 2020.
I saw someone say that there is nothing in KSW that would support mass suicide but that is bullshit.
Scientology core philosopy says that the body is nothing, you are an immortal spirit and you rise above the flesh. This life is no big deal because you are going to get a new body immediately anyway. The basis for suicide is firmly embedded in Scientology philosophy.
And let us not forget how L Ron Hubbard himself causitively shed his mortal bonds because he was researching OT levels SO HIGH that they could not be accessed while a person was still attached to a body.
The entire LRH memorial event stated in flowery terms that LRH had committed suicide so that he could reach higher levels of OT. You think “DM would never do that”. Hell yes he would. Maybe not to himself, but absolutely for others. He would make the “ultimate sacrifce” and stay behind while he sends everyone else off to OT XV and the ultimate heights of spiritual experience.
I hate to have to say this, but it has to be said. I know this seems a little bit like trolling, but the precedent is there, the scripture is there. DM has many times taken weird and obscure LRH quotes that are hurtful and drummed them into the crew like he was Moses.
I am sorry, but it absolutely could happen.
Mike Rinder says
Thanks Roy. Interesting comment. And I agree with you about the positioning of LRH “causatively” shedding his body being a possible precedent.
Of course, none of us can know the future.
I don’t disagree that Miscavige is likely more insane as each year passes.
All we can do in the meantime is try to make the insanity and abuses widely known and hope that nothing drastic happens.
Mike – the story about LRH shedding his body to research higher OT Levels was a “shore story” made up by Miscavige, was it not? Every Scientologist I know (quite a few) never believed that nonsense. The obvious outpoint in DM’s statement was that an OT doesn’t or shouldn’t need to shed a body to “carry on research” – he/she would handle the backflash from the body which NOTs when fully completed more or less does anyway. When I heard that speech (from Broeker? but I think written by Miscavige) my immediate thought was “what a load of nonsense” and I think most other experienced and trained Scientologists also thought that. And on the other hand I have also read that LRH was actually in quite good condition when he went, contrary to the detrimental reports otherwise and he went quite suddenly (well, alright over a couple of days). This report was indirectly from someone who was there.
Mike Rinder says
Yes it was balderdash. Read Lawrence Wrights book and Marty’s blog for the direct facts from Sarge who WAS there. He was not in good shape. Not sure what source u r using.
I see it, Roy.
..absolutely could happen.
Roy, you have a point about Miscavige demanding people to make the extreme sacrifice at some point in the future. This is plausible because we don’t know how far DM will continue to plunge into the depths of insanity. It is a possibility and people should not take it lightly. He has already demonstrated extreme punishments and violence toward his subordinates. This will only escalate as time passes.
Thank You! Mike – for all that you do. I don’t know how you find the time to keep this blog up to date each day but I appreciate what you do and count on being able to come here and read what you and others post. For me, it is the best site on the internet for keeping up to date on fundamental Scientology by someone who totally understands how it works. Please keep up the excellent job of keeping us up to date.
I too have observed the parallels and in part, that is why I post. Maybe posting is not much, but the more of us who speak out the better the chances are that one day we will see the end of this evil. Reform is not to be. What Hubbard dictated is – what it is – and the only way out for those still “in” – is to expose the whole damn thing as a fraud and make it so inconsequential that no one is tempted to enter or support the cult.
Paul Burkhart says
This affidavit from the former People’s Temple Finance Secretary eerily describes some conditions similar to what I observed at the Int Base when I was there from 1999-2009 in the Landlord Office. The parallels at Int which struck me the most are:
Extreme loyalty being demanded and tested. Staff ‘proving’ loyalty by working long hours, by giving up everything having to do with personal welfare, by never countering anything said by DM, and by participating in strange ‘meetings’ or ‘drills’ which seemed to have as the main purpose to instill fear of disloyalty and cement group agreement in DM’s absolute power and correctness.
The line that us loyal staff were fighting conspiracies against the church.
The general atmosphere of exhaustion and fear.
Tirades and ramblings that went on for hours. (at least the Jonestown residents could work in the field or try to sleep instead of being stuck in a meeting with DM all night).
Hiding what really happens at Int by coaching staff what to say and allowing only tightly controlled visits by non-base staff.
Attacking former members who are now considered threats.
Beans and rice, sleeping in the office, and other unnecessary personal hardships that applied to everyone except for DM and his immediate staff.
Thanks for posting this striking reminder of the past, and I hope it helps to avoid similar mistakes in the future.
Mike Rinder says
Thanks for posting here Paul. So glad you are where you are now….
Paul, Have you described your exit from the Landlord Office and the SO?
Paul Burkhart says
My exit was planned and orderly….not a real interesting story.
Thanks for everything you do, Mike.
Check out this video featuring testimonials from ex-People’s Temple members and ex-scientologists. Really hits home when you hear it straight from the survivors’ mouth – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGzYM0LRHwY .
Black Panther says
Thanks Mike. This article is eerie in the similarities of what is going on in RCS.
Perhaps not suicide, but I recently experienced a very real incident of the sudden and untimely death of my mother which I emphatically believe was brought about by direct RCS meddling in my mother’s life. She had dedicated 60 years of her life to LRH, SCN and her family.
I will be putting up an article detailing more on this on the Back-in-Comm blog. The story will include the on-going insanity of certain “family” (still very much in the bubble and glugging the kool-aid like no tomorrow) who are trying to stop me at every turn in wrapping up my mom’s estate with the dignity and care it deserves. All of these attempts at thwarting my every move are being backed up (if not originated by) the Church.
I am angry. Very, very angry.
(Note to Mike – publish at your discretion, if you feel my remarks are too inflammatory. then rather not for now).
The parallels you draw are compelling, but they only apply to staff and Sea Arggghhh. Most $cientologists are ‘public’ and they only have to worry about sec checks and SP declares. Not in the same basket as the concentration camp experience.
When really faced with such threats, most clams blow (escape). Using really harsh discipline on public types results in Leah Remini type escapes, though she did put up with nasty crap for several years. It can be very difficult to know what is in your own interest and not bow down to the wit and wisdom of Lron (as told by the ‘pope’ of $cientology). That so many do blow, and publicly denounce Miscavage is just one measure of the lack of control the clams have on their ‘public’.
The same can’t be said for Staff and SO. If and when the scam collapses, some of them will be at great risk of suicide. But I expect that Miscavage will use them as cannon fodder while he bolts out the secret tunnel to the waiting Learjet. Someone has keep the federal agents busy until takeoff, guess who it’s going to be?
How many loyal $cientologists are really left? I like the 15k number. Ten thousand public, paying the bills, while 5k are leeches on staff and SO. How long can 10k pay for 5k? Even at $cientology wages, something has got to give, the cost to earning ratio must be horrific. My numbers are purely imaginary, I have no idea how many are public or staff. Does anyone have an accurate count?
Zemoo, I understand your concern about Class V org staff and SO being at high risk for suicide once the Church of Scientology officially collapses, and I commend you for it. But – and I can only speak from my experience – the Class V org staffers of long duration I knew didn’t support themselves with wog jobs but were themselves supported, by spouses or parents or private incomes from trust funds and such.The staff I knew who needed to work wog jobs never lasted long. If, or I should say, when, the cult collapses, these staff won’t be destitute, at least financially. Of course, the SO people are a different matter, but then, if there were no more Scientology their families would kind of have to take them in, I would think.
Woah …. powerful stuff. I had to share.
As much as I HATE “Davie”, something human in me makes me realize that given the chance I couldn’t pull the trigger. Maybe first a HUGE public humiliation, with all known facts being broadcast (Largely – As it does involve mankind as a whole) and then he can go work as the janitor for the Russian Mob, or something or their septic tank in charge.
Death is maybe too good for him.
He needs to learn to confront something.
Maybe starring at a rock on an empty beach, after the humiliation of course!
I feel death is too good for him too. But so is staring at rocks on beaches, a luxury that SO members could never afford.
He should at least suffer a bit of what he imposed on others for a while before he croaks.
Perhaps being shipped to a sweatshop in Bengladesh to work under the most abusive boss that can be found in the most decrepit building possible would be a start. Or perhaps keep the RPF, with only him as a member, to do maintenance work forever alone in one empty ideal org.
Or how about making him a PC. Make him
go into session and receive the kind of auditing
he is dishing out to others. Total disregard for
the auditors code in his case…esp. forcing a PC.
Strong arm him into session and force the hell out him.
Inval and eval him to a point the needle stops
rising and just gets stuck.
Then do it some more.
Don’t worry about the 3 swing fn…..cuz the
objective in his session would not include
fn’s…..except for ARCX fn’s that would not
be handled of course.
Alex De Valera says
Very good post Mike! The parallels are uncanny and Miscaviges Multinational Extortion Racket is becoming more and more radical. Unfortunately there will be no mass suicide either on the Freewinds nor at int. they will continue pulling the rope till it’s all shreads and they will be overwhelmed by the consequences of the lack of exchange, the lies, the slave labor and all the rest. Miscavige would like to think he is the Captain of a mighty vessel, but he is out in the high seas clinging to a raft and the storm is coming.
Mike Rinder says
Not sure why that would be “unfortunate”?
Alex De Valera says
I shouldn’t have said that. What I had in the back of my mind was the idea of a criminal organisation coming to an end at once.
“…if there WAS a chance of averting the disaster by publicizing what was going on, then it should have been done. It is why I am determined to continue to make the truth about what goes on in fundamentalist scientology as widely known as I can. If it saves a single family from destruction or one person from bankruptcy or someone from going into complete apathy about ever being happy again, it is worth the effort.”
Thank you Mike for continuing to spread the truth in your blog. It is so very important and I’m sure you have saved many so far but there are many more than need to hear your message. David Miscavige is a mad man and OSA and those that enforce his destructive policies and orders are just as insane and mad. It does frighten me. I’m frightened for those still in the cult who blindly follow and refuse to look. I pray that more and more wake up and leave. Those of you who have left and are “under the radar” or quietly living your life, if you are in the know about the crimes and atrocities committed by DM and OSA please speak up and help prevent more people and families from being hurt.
“His obsession with his place in history was maniacal. When pondering the loss of what he considered his rightful place in history, he would grow despondent and say that all was lost.”
One might even say that Jim Jones had high hopes of smashing his name into history so violently that it would take legendary form even if all books were destroyed.
Jim Jones: talked 900 people into killing themselves.
LRH: talked something like 90,000 people into becoming his brain-numbed worker-drones.
LRH did it better.
It just goes to show an example of quality over quantity. I think it’s a sure bet that Jim Jones is already and will always be way more legendary than LRH. .
Tony DePhillips says
Amazing story Mike and Special correspondent.
Thanks for keeping the fire to his feet.
This story really gives me a different take on dm. I used to think he was just evil. Now I think he is evil AND DELUSIONAL. I really think he thinks that he is some “great man”. He is under the delusion that he is doing something good for the planet. He is a two bit punk, thug, conman who generates whatever seeming power he has by sucking the life blood from his sycophant followers.
Yea, Tony, that’s exactly right. It’s called “megalomania.” DM is definitely a megalomaniac to put it in one word.
Here’s a good video that just came my way based on Robert Hare’s psychopath checklist.
It’s a good idea to review these traits from time to time to have them present when needed and applies well to DM.
I think we should double our efforts to make things known-on my end I will forward this posting to several friends in various locations in the planet and ask them in turn to read it and work out how they can go about it.
Also, any one of the dear commentators, could device other means to double our efforts in divulging the abuses and crimes of DM, his minions, OSA and some other CofS members/Orgs.
This blog and its posting has already power in divulging the abuses and crimes of Scn. Inc, however, this time I think we could think of ONE action each one could do and together end the nightmare of the cult in which some of our past friends are still involved.
I am with you Mike, all the way and thank you.
For anyone who wants to learn more about thought reform, the referenced book is a fascinating account by a man who treated many individuals who had undergone ‘brainwashing’ at the hands of the Chinese.
Excellent data, thank you!
Most welcome Zephyr.
Mike, you said:
“First, I have long felt that there is no mass suicide in the future of scientology and I haven’t changed that view.
But can we learn from what happened there and help prevent a similar sort of destruction to people’s lives in scientology? I believe we can.”
I agree with you that a mass suicide would be unlikely. Since no PL or Bulletin specifically states that mass suicide is standard tech, even the most cringe-worthy KSW bots would likely reject it.
I wonder about two things. Just how many suicides have been directly linked to abhorrent behavior by scientologists? Starting with Quentin and moving up to recently with Michael Lewis’ kid, there have been a lot of them.
I also wonder if miscavige isn’t evil enough to lace the Gold Base crew’s rice and beans with poison. I’m sorry, I just truly do believe that he would go that far if he glimpses the abject failure he’s become and his own personal game gets shut down by the powers that be.
This post, and every exposition of the lies emanating from members of the church helps to save lives.
Thank you for being there and communicating.
Jens TINGLEFF says
Not forgetting one of the more “convenient” suicides for OSA, the French public Remi PETIT who volunteered for OSA and CCHR and all he ever did was steal a little mail (from a psychiatrist expert wittness). Remy got caught and gave up the French OSA leaders as his bosses and as such the French OSA leaders got heavy sentences. On the eve of the inevitable appeal Remy PETIT was found dead and his death was ruled a suicide. The OSA leaders prevailed in the appeal.
Bob Dobbs says
Jens, definitely sounds suspicious to me.
Cat Daddy says
Micheal Rinder is a very good person
He was duped and bedazzled by l Ron Hubbard
Maybe he still wants to say something about that or not.
I hope I can say that I understand Mike Rinder
Maybe not, he is a gift to you all Ex Church Scientologists
This is my way to say I love him.
Mike Rinder says
Thanks Niels. You always bring a bit of humor to this blog. And a sometimes necessary reality check from the world far outside the bubble.
Bruce Ploetz says
Absolutely tasteless and irreverent to bring up at this solemn moment, but by some weird coincidence it is the first day of Kool-Aid Days today in Hastings NE http://kool-aiddays.com/. Though Hubbard was born in Nebraska almost no-one has heard of him there. And obviously from the site no-one is aware of the darker side of Kool-Aid. So maybe a true Scientology Kool-Aid moment is not too likely.
After all, the Founder is gone and the current leader is far too enamored of his perks and lifestyle to throw it all away in a mere fit of pique over some lost law-suit. If they took away his tax-exempt status, and were coming to arrest him, he would not bother killing anyone. He would just run away with a few million in gold and leave the poor sods at the Gold base to fend for themselves. That’s my take on it, of course it is hard to predict what a psycho is going to do.
My impression is Dave is not a true believer and there is no real religious impetus behind what he is doing. So there is not much incentive to go out with a bang. Those under him are far too cowed and hopeless to do it themselves. I hope I am right.
We will need to be ready for a huge number of lost souls in our midst when the balloon finally pops, people with no retirement savings, no job prospects and long-term chronic medical conditions to handle. It will be time for a little Christian charity or some such.
Sir Upticious says
Kool-Aid got a bad rap and the truth was Jones was too cheap to get the real thing but opted for the more genaric “Flav-r-ade.”
And.. as a tasteless aside (it’s what I do), Do you want to know why Lil Davie does what he does?
He is simply “keeping up with the Joneses.”
dungeon master says
I completely agree with Bruce that this Dabey Miscabbage IS MOCKING EVERYONE. OF COURSE HE DOES NOT BELIEVE IN ANYTHING AND ALL THAT IS SCIENTOLOGY! He BELIEVES IN THIEVERY DONATIONS, wink, wink, wink!!
If you count abortions Scientology killed more of its children.
Another little similarity to Scientology – anyone recognize this one?
The Temple also asked adults to sign papers admitting various crimes and wrongdoings, including conspiring against the U.S. government, involvement in terrorist acts and molesting their own children. If such members attempted to leave the Temple, Jones threatened to release the statements. – Wikipedia
I tried to post this earlier… Hope it works this time…
Spot on work by your SC…
Given that David Miscavige is still in control, every card that foretells a disastrous finish to his reign has got to be left on the table. Murder? Suicide? -Yes, as long as a psychotic is in the near vicinity and particularly holds power those cards have to be in play.
That’s the problem with psychotics like this; anything that would seem inconceivable to most people becomes entirely possible when they are present. There are no rules. Who would have thought he could have imprisoned the Sea Org’s senior executives in a trailer, yet he did. He’s punched people out, slapped his PC and brought her to tears, cracked heads together, pitted staff one against the other and has historically used violence as his go to item since he was a kid. There is every reason to believe then that violence will have something to do with how he finishes up.
However this all comes to an end, I’m sure a lot of us are going to be left with our jaws hanging wide open in disbelief.
Cooper Kessel says
“There is every reason to believe then that violence will have something to do with how he finishes up.”
” However this all comes to an end, I’m sure a lot of us are going to be left with our jaws hanging wide open in disbelief.”
I tend to agree with your assessment KFrancis. I try to prepare myself for how I might be able to help my daughter Haley who is now 32 and has been in the Cult since she was 16. After reading the J. Jones stuff I realize that the worst of all possibilities may exist … that there will be little that can be done. Anyway, that is one possible end of the scale and many other exist which are more likely. And so we work….
Thank you Mike Rinder for all you do.
I actually completely disagree with Mike Rinder. I respect all of your history and innate knowledge about this VILE CULT. But the only predictable thing we can say about miscabbage is WE CANNOT PREDICT WHAT LENGTHS HE WILL GO TO FOR HIS MONEY AND SURVIVAL! He has already doomed thousands, and murdered several loyal followers.
Not being particularly religious here but what came to mind is how the Bible states it: “Who lives by the sword will die by the sword”.
Roy Macgregor says
Cults are the ideal safe havens for sociopaths.
Scientific endevours require leaders to actually be able to do things. Rules are set by a wide community of highly educated peers.
Business endevours require leaders to be able to make and sell things. Rules are set by the government and law enforcement is fairly good.
Religious endevours require only that leaders are able to persuade/manipulate people and their emotions. This is something sociopaths excel at. Sociopaths have trouble in business world – they do illegal things, they get caught, it gets ugly.
But inside a religious cult there are no rules that cannot be interpreted and law enforcement can rarely, if ever, step in.
In all the wide world, there is no safer, better place for a sociopath than inside a religious cult. I wondered for the longest time at the high percentage of sociopaths inside the Sea Org. It was not till after I had read “The Sociopath Next Door” that I realized how uniquely suited sociopaths are to religious cults.
Cults by definition operate out of the public eye, behind closed doors.
Cults operate on religious laws, which are open to interpetation and in most instances even specifically demand harsh treatment of “unbelievers” or “traitors”. Thus anti-social behaviour can be acted out with impunity and in many instances anti-social behaviour is lauded and rewarded.
Cults are free from legal interferance by the state. Thus sociopaths do not have to worry about pesky problems with police and such like.
Cults natually tend towards idolation of leaders and thus give to leaders lavish lifestyles and license that would not be afforded an ordinary member. Thus sociopaths can enjoy a great life without the need to actually produce valuable products.
And I could go on. But bottom line – if you are a sociopath and having trouble getting away with things in the world, the Church of Scientology offers the Sea Org. It’s perfect. The most ruthless rise rapidly to leadership and privledge. Inflicting cruel and unusual punishments on others is actually required.
I agree that scientology and especially the Sea Org is not special in the horrible way it treats people. Bad behaviour is common inside closed religious organizations. And they all mask their behaviour with a smug superior “holier-than-thou” attitude.
But I think that the roots of the problem are in the way that these groups set themselves up as perfect operating enviroments for sociopaths.
You could heal the Sea Org (or any cult) just by isolating any attribute that makes it attractive to sociopaths and remedying it.
Of course if you took away the secrecy and “closed door” aspect it would not be a cult anymore.
Scientologists hate being called cultists. But they are.
They could reform. But they won’t.
So it’s Hast La Vista Baby.
Thank You, Roy
I’ve often wondered why our public seemed to be in better shape as a whole, than we were.
We were the ones needing some fixing, as a whole.
I couldn´t agree more and I thank you for what you are doing. Exposure is the best remedy. I certainly see the similarities and I will repeat, I cannot find the words to describe how happy I am that I finally woke up and realized what i was a member of and got the hell out of Dodge! What helped me were the numerous blogs providing me with actual information. Information I was prevented from having as long as I was a good little scientologist.
For the second time this summer I am now going to the beautiful small Greek island of Santorini. Just to relax and enjoy myself together with wonderful people. This is something I never did as a scientologist. I couldn´t afford it. All my money went to Scientology. – Well, they didn´t get ALL my Money. Ha ha! But they tried.
Wow. The parallels are beyond uncanny. Mike, I couldn’t agree with you more and I’m with you 100%. Amy
Hey Dave, Those outside your bubble know that you are incapable of seeing the similarities and connecting the dots. Fortunately, those outside of your bubble can connect the dots and will assure that your bubble continues to shrink.
Cat Daddy says
I love Scientologists. The ones I encountrer are honest and real. I wish I could have a format to talk to them. The world loves you. At least we in the Netherlands do.
If you ever have doubt in your life read Spinoza
Cooper Kessel says
“The whole agonized future of this planet, every Man, Woman and Child on it, and your own destiny for the next endless trillions of years depend on what you do here and now with and in Scientology.”
Acquires a whole new meaning.
Jose Chung says
Perfect match up. If Rex Fowler would write his story this
will confirm the worst about David Miscavige’s grandiose
sociopath plans for Scientology.
Excellent article, Mike. I agree it highly unlikely there will be mass suicides. But, the amount of general carnage is quite significant. There are so many destroyed families, so many bankruptcies, so many huge credit card debts, not to mention the large number of people that never stably received the abilities promised.
Fortunately, you and others have gone to that very small corner of the internet where Scientology has become a toxic word. The church says it’s a small corner. In actuality, the vast majority of google, bing, yahoo and youtube results would steer anyone looking into the subject as far away as possible.
The only way I can imagine someone in the U.S. or other english speaking countries taking a step into a church would be through personal contact. Fortunately, all of the kool-aid drinkers are too busy regging each other to actually disseminate to someone new to the subject.
Your post yesterday about Portland was quite revealing. The “first clear city” is such unmitigated bullshit. Their own photos showed a half empty small room.
Thanks again for what you do. The more the lies and crimes of the church are exposed, the less likely anyone new will get sucked in. Eventually the church will die of old age as most of the kool-aid are either in their 60s or are their progeny.
Someday, I really hope to see my grand-daughter again. We had such a wonderful relationship. Her parents disconnected from us. That was their choice. But, Gaby didn’t have a choice – which was uncommonly evil. I can only imagine what she thinks happened to us. I’m certain she wasn’t told the truth, if she was told anything.
Chris Shelton aka Galactic Patrol says
The parallels are truly frightening and the implications here are clear. Miscavige’s version of Scientology and what he has wrought simply must be stopped, period. There is not even a question about this. I salute Mike for keeping this blog going every single day – it’s a lot of work to do that – and all of us ex’s who speak out in protest of the Hell that Scientology is for its remaining members and the world at large. I truly hope that we don’t have to continue this fight for much longer, that families will be re-connected and Miscavige and his crew will face real justice for the very real crimes they perpetrate on church members every day.
Mike, you and David St. Lawrence have helped me to stop being in complete apathy about ever being happy again! I was one of the ones who thought, “I’ll never get my bridge. I have no future as a being.” I cannot thank you guys enough!
One thing not mentioned here is the Temple’s hold over the City of San Francisco. There are definite parallels to the way Scientology has “taken over” Clearwater, and its courting of politicians, such as Florida AG Pam Bondi.
You’re doing great work Mike. To any still-ins,fence-sitters and OSA agents reading this – Mike does this because he is concerned for you and wants to help you. He is not a beast or your enemy. You belong to a dangerous cult and need to withdraw your support and leave NOW.
Nice piece Mike, especially your closing paragraph. Thanks for what you do.What a strange trip it has been… …
Thank you, Mike, for another thought provoking if disturbing analogy to the state of scientology. I am encouraged that the new emerging generation is savvy and educated way beyond anything I or many of us ever were when we joined up. I have hopes that 3rd gen scientologists will not be willing to give up their internet. Maybe they will the the ones who can wake up their family.
Your post today reminds me that while I may get frustrated when authorities don’t just burst in and at least get the minors out of the Cadet org, for instance, I understand that bankruptcy, foreclosures, coerced “donations”, threats of eternity loss just isn’t viewed in the same light as body death.
But maybe it should be. Many of us here have a wide variety of opinions and interpretations, but we share either personal experiences and/or experiences of hundreds if not thousands who have suffered the excruciating burden of recreating our lives out of nothing and all that goes with it. For too many it in fact turned out to be a kind of slow, torturous death of sorts. You rightfully mention death of a career, means of income, homes, marriages, family life, of security. These are real deaths as anyone who has suffered the loss knows. Out of all, Miscavige’s current leveraging of the well being and connection to loved ones as his last weapon is the worst and most evil. That alone should be enough reason for our laws to change. Human trafficking should not be overlooked because it hides in a cloak of any stripe.
Rod Keller says
All cults have some similarities. The one I find the most similar to Scientology is Aum Shinrikyo, the former Japanese sarin gas cult. They even had an electronic device like an e-meter. Except it was a hat and the purpose was to clone the mind of Shoko Asahara into the minds of his followers.
I’ve been to cult conferences with a lot of former Scientologists, and the cog that Scientology is not very different from other cults is very fun to experience.
Myself, I wonder if The Bridge is a bridge into Hubbard.
From everything I’ve experienced, the main difference between Scientology and other cults is that there’s just enough “real” psychology/ parapsychology/ hypnotherapy/ magick in Scientology that it’s very hard to unbrainwash yourself even after you lead the cult.
Old Surfer Dude says
I’ve always said that scientology’s reputation was just a shade under Jonestown…Now, I have hard proof. Both cults are two peas from the exact same pod. Frightening!
Cooper Kessel says
Jim Jones and David (The Dildo) Miscaviage ………two peas from the same pod! Nice one OSD! Jim had Guyana, Davie has the Prisonwinds. Both function similarly, both are sick individuals, both share lives of desperation and both can mesmerize their followers. Scary…..
Chee chalker says
Cooper, I think to be fair, you have to include LRH in this group (Jones, Dildo Dave, LRH). I know there are people who read this blog who turn a blind eye to LRH’s behavior, but the truth is a lot of Jones’ tactics were used by LRH. ( fair game, loyalty tests, interrogations (sec checks) etc). This is what confuses me most about the Co$…….I do think it was a different organization under LRH, but I think where the Co$ is today is a natural progression. If LRH had lived to 100, the Co$ would look close to how it does today.
LRH would probably have been a little more clever about adapting to modern society than the tiny tyrant. Just my opinion. Dave’s the rotten apple that did not fall far from the poisonous tree.
Jon H says
The point at which LRH was closest to going Full Jonestown probably would have been during the Apollo days.
It could be pure luck that the Apollo wasn’t found adrift and full of corpses.
I think you guys go way to far comparing LRH to Jim Jones in any matter at all. LRH may not have been entirely perfect but he clearly had many people who loved him. I’m sure there are good many of them that read this blog but don’t want to waste their time coming in here to defend him against loose cannons.
Chee Chalker, I don’t share your vision, if LRH were around I believe the Orgs would be full and thriving. We would have the Primary RD, Key to Life, the original Communication Course, and Sec Checking would be given only when appropriate. I could go on and on with a much more positive view of how things be. LRH filled lecture halls and the Orgs when he was still around so there is no evidence that he could not have continued to do so.
Jones and Miscavige, yes, but any comparison should stop there.
KFrancis – while I do believe that LRH DID have the basic intention to help and that the discoveries he made are still helpful to us and to new people who discover it, in it’s original form, what did happen back then and what would have been if he still lived are truly, IMHO, a chicken and egg discussion.
LRH had his overts and I believe those overts drove him a little (or a lot) nutty. Could he have run the ship in the condition he was in, later in life? I’m not so sure.
But also, you have the factors of DM and Pat Broeker fighting for their own power and control over the organization. LRH had become a frail and befuddled old guy. How much would it have taken for a controlling little freak like DM to purposely push the Old Man over the edge?
Look what DM and the boys did to Mary Sue and the family after Ron died. Despicable.
So, who is to say what would have happened today if LRH was running the ship. I can pretty much guarantee that, even if LRH wasn’t here, it would have been WAY better without the SP Miscavige.
Mike: thank you for being steadfast in your mission to expose the cofs and David Miscavige for the danger that they are. I pray everyday for the good people who are still prisoners of belief.
Me too Yvonne, well said.
Dani Lemberger says
Slaves are not necessarily dumb. Highly intelligent people can use their high intelligence to convince themselves of why they are most right in making themselves slaves. Their justifications become ingenious.
Miscavige’s fraud must be exposed. Mike, you are thanked for tenaciously doing so.
Those who can, should continue the application of the Tech to the benefit of others, proving the Tech is valuable and can produce miracles.
Others should continue the efforts to bring down Miscavige’s tyranny. It may yet take some years but the direction is clear. Free Scientology is steadily expanding and Miscavige’s operation is shrinking.
Cooper Kessel says
+1 We are on it Dani. Best to you both.
Mike – it sounds like you are aware of your many contributions toward the empowering the cult. Bravo for your many efforts at redemption. May they continue in good health.
Mike has plenty of company, as many of us have in our various ways and for our own varying reasons, made numerous contributions toward empowering the cult.
That being said, I doubt that Mike nor any of us would consider ourselves “redeemed” by any of our current efforts to bring down the same cult to which we formerly gave our fervent support.
Because the truth is, there is actually no such thing as “redemption”. That’s a fallacy and a major control mechanism.
The past is the past and its over and can’t ever be changed and no matter how many good deeds we do now they can’t be traded in like coupons to expunge the past. Good, bad, or indifferent, with awareness and purpose, with blind unawareness, or in any operating state in between, we created what we created, that’s all.
Fortunately, there is always now, so long as the breath of life is in a person. The future can be causitively created. It is being created anyway, so it might as well be done causitively. The bad things of the past cannot be changed but their effects can be out-created by what we do in the present – the same way that a blazing fire takes the damp and chill out of a room, or as some long gentle rains out-create the effects of too much dryness, causing the flowers and grass and trees to bloom once again.
Does this make sense to you? Perhaps I’m putting too fine a point on what is just semantics and this has been your concept all along, but in any event I look forward to whatever you may care to share here.
Very well said, Aquamarine. Eloquent and true.
Aquamarine, there is “karma”. If you continue looking, I think that you will find that the world is indeed round.
Aquamarine – I have always loved your viewpoints and how eloquently you express them. Thank you.
So many parallels.
It’s a very sad state of affairs within the church.
I agree wholeheartedly with your last paragraph and thank you for what you are doing.
Wow. This could have been written by me in 2001 about the RPF and all the shit DM and other Execs were saying daily. The comparisons are too spot on to not cause a shiver down my spine. I don’t know if they would line up for the great Kool Aid nap in the sky, but when 9-11 happened PAC was armed to the teeth. There were extra security on every roof with all manor of guns including AK47s. They were ready for a fight to the finish. The RPF were even being drilled on defense tactics. Let’s face it we would have been on the front lines for cannon fodder if some shit had gone down.
I have often thought they might Jonestown it up, but it will be in some massive protest on the capital steps that will be forgotten as soon as the cameras turn off. That is the sad news. They will all be broke, scared, sick and sad. That is their future. It will be noisy for a moment and then deafening silence as they are forgotten to history.
I remember a bunch of stuff being done to the Anthony Building shortly after 9/11. They were trying to prepare the basement as a makeshift fallout shelter. Apparently DM was paranoid that 9/11 would lead to nuclear war.
Which also reminds me of “Wake Up Call” which DM wrote after 9/11. It was stated as fact that bin Laden’s second in command was a psych. (Just like Hitler, obviously.) But when I looked into it, I couldn’t find any evidence that he was a psychiatrist/ologist/anything. This was when I first started really seeing the lies.
Just off the top of my head, I believe Zawahri was a Pediatrician. But heck, to the true believer that’s as good as a psych because he was a Doctor, right?
Jon H says
Bin Laden’s 2nd in command, Zawahiri, is a surgeon by training.
Yeah we spent a week prepping the basement of Main Building getting ready too. We had drills for fallout and all that for weeks. Every night we would drill. The. When DM came down he looked at all our preps, told us we were paranoid nut jobs and we then had to dismantle everything. It took us forever to do that. We were ready to love down in those tunnels for months. We even set up radiation showers and everything.
The psych right hand man to Bin Laden thing was from COB himself in IG Network Bulleting #22 Wake Up Call. I used to have a copy kicking around. Some seriously crazy shit in that one. Mass paranoia.
“We were ready to love down in those tunnels for months” – repopulating the world? Sounds like a party! I’ll bring the chronic n viagra 🙂
Hahahaha. Best typo I ever did. No the loving would have been a no for us. The RPF weren’t allowed any sexual anything even with their spouse. Not even congicol visits. Now that would have been one epic love fest though. Hundreds if us in the tunnels for months.
“… Let’s face it we would have been on the front lines for cannon fodder if some shit had gone down. …”
Does anyone remember the evacuation of the PAC due to “bombthreats”?
Or the protection of the HGB-building during the L.A. riots by putting Outer-Org-Trainees in front of it on Hollywood/Ivar?
Has anyone connected the dots between these pieces of information…
Uwe Stuckenbrock (R.I.P; former Int security I/C)
Lou Stuckenbrock (Uwe’s former 2D)
Dieter Stuckenbrock (former second in command of the ‘soon’ to become Ideal Org Stuttgart; who isn’t allowed to get any closer to DM than a certain distance; who told people PERSONALLY, that his son Uwe – whom he had seen last in the HGB staircase by pure accident – had the best possible treatment; who revealed openly what the OT levels 3, 4 and 5 are about; who IS A MAN OF GOOD WILL but has been severly betrayed AND HAS BETRAYED; who committed and took part in enough financial irregularities that the german authorities would be interessted in etc.)
KATHRIN STUCKENBROCK (who openly admitted to have physically hit a staffmember to ‘get the point’ accross and the GI quota met; and told acceptable truths about the opening of the Ideal Org in Stuttgart in 2 weeks… That was before 2007…)
HERBERT & SUSANNE MARKS (who donated quite some money under false pretense and helped getting others to do the same by telling ‘acceptable truths’…)
STOCKHAUSEN-FISCHER (who should open the first ‘Ideal Mission’ and the financial situation they are involved in regarding the OLD Org, TEMPORARY Org and now the ‘very very soon to be opened Ideal Org; their families and their TRUE opinion of DM and the Cult…)
TONI EGERT (who did the spying on a big critic and had to repaint his beige Golf blue; his connection to the german police; his connection to OSA…)
KORELL (ED; the Out-PR-situation with the kids; all the broken promises though having had a walk privately with DM himself…)
LET’S GET EVERYTHING IN A RIGHT PERSPECTIVE – THEY A-R-E PEOPLE OF GOOD INTENT (per TWTH) BUT THEY HAVE BEEN BETRAYED AND HAVE CROSSED A CERTAIN THRESHHOLD, THAT IS N-O-T ACCEPTABLE AND TOLERABLE ANYMORE.
This is ONE ethicsgradient.
True facts ARE NOT lies and are NOT nattering!
THANK YOU FOR ALL THE POSITIVE YOU HAVE DONE! YOU HAVE HELPED PEOPLE IN THE PAST – ACTUALLY VERY MUCH INDEED. BUT THE END DOES NOT JUSTIFY THE MEANS; AND EVERYONE I-S THE 8 DYNAMICS – NOT ONLY THE 3rd!!!