You never waste your words, Mike. So succinct and informative. Your accent doesn’t hurt either. So pleasant to hear. Thank you for your courage. As a cult survivor, I count on your example.
I remember when Scientology spokes person Tommy Davis stated on national TV that there was no such thing as disconnection in Scientology. For those ex Scientologists that lost their jobs, parents, siblings, children etc due to the disconnection policy of Scientology, it was very upsetting. It motivated many of them to write books, speak to the media, the FBI, etc. The backlash can not be understated. Scientologists also saw for themselves that their “church” was lying. To see Scientology publicly state that there is no policy to prevent their members from reporting to authorities the criminal actions of fellow members only shows that Scientology did not learn its lesson. Every Scientologists knows that the statement is a lie and opens the question as to what else is their “church” lying about. The lie is easily proven and it will come back to bite Scientology.
I’ve read all the replies to my post and it truly saddens me that most everyone ignored my motive – which was to help Mike be more effective in TV appearances. Seems to me that many people who post here may have left one cult only to substitute another cult in its place. People here now seem to refuse to accept even the slightest negative remark about Mike – regardless of the truth or my motive.
Well, so be it. If Mike insists on appearing on national TV looking like a clown, it really doesn’t cause me any harm. The person who gets harmed is the lady who recently escaped the cult and now needs winter clothing. I tried to offer Mike some advice to make his TV appearances more effective. Although it did contain a minor negative point, what does it say about the mindset of former cult members? IMHO, they’ve just substituted one leader for another. It appears that no one must ever make any negative remark about Mike. So many posts made on this blog contain nothing but praise for Mike. There’s nothing wrong with praising Mike. He has done a tremendous amount of good in the fight against this cult. But it’s hard to swallow when so many people refuse to accept anything containing the slightest negative remark – regardless of the truth or underlying motive.
Thomas, you expressed your opinion in a public forum criticizing the clothes I wear on TV and that I am not “well-prepared.” So you know, I don’t want to look like the perfectly suited, scripted and rehearsed David Miscavige that is what represents scientology to the world.
Others don’t agree with your opinions and express theirs, some even critical of you.
And in reply, you quickly descend into the straw man argument that they are “substituting one cult for another” and I am their new cult leader…
Oh dear.
If you were really worried about the well being of the woman we are helping through the Aftermath Foundation with winter clothes (and many other things), you would spend your time doing something to help her and others like her. Submit your information to volunteer at the Aftermath Foundation website.
Seriously, if you don’t like a few comments on a blog criticizing you for the opinions you expressed here, I don’t think you would enjoy the lies and criticisms you would have to endure if you actually said anything negative about scientology. Let me know when you schedule your first TV appearance talking about the cult so you can put your expertise into practice. I will be sure to watch and then thank you for your courage, no matter what jacket you wear.
Consider the following excerpt from a post here by Linda Olsen:
“Thanks, TJW, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about.”
Do you recognize this language? It is almost identical to people who are committed to the cult – like John Travolta and Kirstie Allen.
When asked if they have ever read any of the articles on the Internet exposing the horrors and abuses of this cult, they answer in words to the effect, “Of course not! Why would I ever want to read anything written by someone who is critical of my religion?”
I always marvel that people are willing to act like Ostriches and stick their heads in the sand so they do not have to consider the truth.
But here we have one poster who is saying the same thing. She says, “Thanks, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about.”
Don’t you see this is the same cult party line? People try to make fun of me because I said that many former members of this cult are still stuck in the same “cult think”. But can you not see that in action – right here in this blog?
I think this is terribly sad. People who leave the cult believe they are healed. But they still carry the same old cult think with them. More is needed to heal people then just leaving the cult. It’s a good first step. But if that’s all people do, they will still think and act the same way. It’s not enough to just substitute one cult leader for another.
In any case, I have nothing more to say about this subject. I’m sure that many of you will be happy to know I am “over and out” on this topic. I just wish you would take a closer look at yourself and see if there is any truth to the fact that even though you may have left this cult, you are still acting and thinking in the same way.
I sincerely wish you all the best of luck in cutting the strings that keep you tied down in the bubble.
Finally, one poster chastized me saying that if I was really wanting to help I would have made some contributions to the Aftermath Foundation and to support the cult.
Many of you may not belive me. But I have sent more than $400 to the Aftermath Society and I sent $500 to support Shelly Ashbridge when her son was in that terrible car accident.
Some of you will accuse me of false bravado and bragging. But if I wanted to do that, I would have done it right after Shelly’s son had that accident some six months ago.
That was actually the event that really soured me against Mike. After sending $500 to help Shelly’s family, I asked Mike to do me a very tiny favor that would have taken him less than one minute. But he refused saying that he was too busy to help me with such a thing. It was then I realized that when he says he is eternally grateful to everyone who sends him money to support his work, that he is not being truthful.
“That was actually the event that really soured me against Mike.”
All your various verbose explanations, complaints, accusations and all the fuss and that is the crux of the matter (which you couldn’t handle with Mike directly to your satisfaction and are annoyed about)?!? Sad.
Thanks for helping! Btw., I did that too, and not only on one occasion when it was needed (monetary), albeit without any expectations and demands.
What people should understand is, L. Ron was bff (and stole his girlfriend) with Jack Parsons in the early 1940s and were OTO occultists silly enough to perform an actual Babalon Moonchild ritual. And in regular postal contact with Aleister Crowley, who (when it suited him) fancied himself a priest of Lucifer.
Tom Cruise needs to do the Volunteer Minister’s Course, and start putting ethics in on the Scientology celebrities, starting with Danny Masterson.
Tom, years ago, ought to have done the VM Course, and then done Danny’s ethics handling. Tom ought to have gotten Danny to turn himself in, just admit his guilt, and save the world from this charade that is unnecessary (necessary only due to Danny never getting his “ethics” in, and Tom ought to have stepped in years ago).
The Scientology celebs need an Ethics Officer with clout and understanding, someone to get the fellow celebs to cop for their felonies, and own up and admit their guilt, spare the world the legal charade, just fess up and do their time, pay the victims what is due them.
That’d be something to take note of, if Tom Cruise would step up and do that, or had he stepped up and done that.
Well he is atleast a good MC ( Master of Ceremony)
Have you ever seen any Head of an organization being MC ?
For example Academy Awards , who is MC ?
Chairman of American Academy of Motion pictures? Or
Senior Celebrities like Steven Spielberg or Harrison Ford or Danziel Washington?
No No & No
It’s always a Comedian , MC of Academy awards show.
Its a job of lower stature , performed by some in late 20′ to mid 40’s.
That’s why I always equate them with Comedy Circus 🎪
For probably the first time in my life post Scientology I feel a real sense of honesty, justice and human enlightenment concerning the abusive nature of Scientology is now being accepted and viewed broadly and objectively by the legal system within the United States. In that I mean the general public is being addressed in this Masterson case to accept that there are two sides or multiple ways to view how a religion goes about its business and in particular how it goes about protecting itself. Faith is a good thing, blind faith is potentially a very dangerous course to engage.
L. Ron Hubbard for all his work, promises of freedom for all and broad impingement on the lives of others very carefully engaged in far reaching sedition against the authorities of all nations and creeds.
Scientology really needs to be viewed for what it does, has as its policies and how it manipulates the protective barriers afforded to the spiritual rights and freedoms available within many cultures.
It is destructive at its core.
I truly hope this criminal case looks at all factors involved for what they truly are, not what they are perceived to be without careful examination. A fair trial in other words.
It’s interesting to me how the law loses it’s mind whenever the word religion is invoked.
Imagine the headlines if Danny Masterson worked for a large corporation, say Microsoft, and was a high ranking executive, and three woman who worked under him came forward and claimed he had sexually assaulted them. Then, Microsoft had their HR dept. and lawyers swiftly threaten them with termination, lawsuits, and taking steps to prohibit them from finding employment with other companies.
Nobody in their right mind would suggest that the case should not involve a deep investigation of Microsoft, their policies, or their corporate culture in dealing with serious accusations such as these.
And if there was ever a “religion” that acted more like a corporation…
I was told by a HealthEast human services person that being right was unhealthy. Being right is a fundamental function of a health care system. I decided at that moment to quit while I was ahead.
I lived in the scientology bubble for 37 years. Since 1999, I haven’t owned a TV. I have never seen an episode of Reality TV or “That 70s Show.” The only reason I know that Danny Masterson is an actor is through anti-scientology websites such as this because I also don’t read the newspaper (and never have). It’s very interesting watching the downward trajectory of Masterson and scientology.
I have a few minor negative remarks about your appearances on TV – especially this recent Court TV show. But, since it has been my experience that anyone who posts any kind of negative remarks about Mike Rinder is immediately accused of being a bot for the cult or being paid by the cult, please allow me to begin by saying that I have followed your appearances on TV ever since you escaped from the cult in 2007 – especially on the Aftermath TV show that you made with Leah Remini.
Overall, I have a great deal of admiration for you as well as all the other people who have spoken out against the cult for its terrible human rights abuses. IMHO, the worst abuses committed by this cult are:
1) forcibly breaking up families when one member criticises the cult or disagrees with one or more of their policies
2) forcing members to live in poverty because they must give almost all their money to the cult.
3) Telling many stupid lies about how this cult welcomes and supports all people regardless of race, creed or sexual orientation.
4) Forcibly confining people to their properties and refusing to allow them to leave.
5) Denying members of any or all of their basic human rights.
So, what are my negative remarks?
First and foremost, I have some minor criticisms of the way you appear on TV. On this recent Court TV episode, you appear wearing a shabby jacket that lookes like it was 20 years old and that you got from some Salvation Army outlet. I know that many people here will chastize me for saying this on the grounds that your physical appearance has nothing to do with your stance on human rights abuses and all the other fine work you do. But when it comes to TV, your appearance counts a great deal – obviously a great deal more than you seem to realize. How difficult would it be for you to wear a tie? Again, I’m sure many people will complain that has nothing to do with your impact. But it has a great deal to do with how you are perceived by the audience. You should know that most of the audience who has never heard of you or this cult will quickly discount all that you say just because of your appearance.
For Heaven’s sake, there are many people who advise people who appear in the public eye about their appearance. I would suggest that you just ask one of them to give you their opinion about how your appearance affects the impact you make when you appear on TV.
One other minor point is that the host appeared to be fully prepared while you seem to just “wing it”. After all your public appearances, I would suggest that you prepare a few brief scripts so that you can come across being as professional as possible. One glaring example from the Court TV appearance was when you seemed to be searching for the best word or phrase and chose to use “man” when you made the point that the primary purpose of the cult is to protect the cult and make sure it appears in the best light to all of mankind. In 2022, it may seem insignificant, but you really do not want to offend women by excluding them from these kinds of remarks. I know this will seem silly to most people who read this blog, but you really don’t want to refer to all people as “mankind” when you can use a more inclusive phrase. I know this may seem like an insignificant point. But if you would just prepare a few brief scripts on topics about which you know you will be speaking, you can easily improve your appearances and – more importantly – the impact you make on viewers.
There is just no reason in 2022 to appear on a national TV show and appear to just be “winging it” – especially when you are talking about issues that are so very important to so many victims of this cult. Surely you realize the victims of this cult depend and need your help. There is almost no one else who is willing to help them.
But, aside from my minor remarks, please keep up the great work you do!
It’s tough to have a win here. One on hand I am accused of making money hand over first doing this work, on the other I’m accused of being such a bum I buy 20 year old jackets from the Salvation Army…
Ah well. You can’t please all the people all the time!
TJW needs to get a life or at the very least, a hobby. Good grief, people are just looking for something to complain about. Thought your jacket was fine and you did a great job, as usual. I could never put myself out there the way that you do – I’m not thick skinned enough and would be crying if someone said my clothes looked ratty😂 cut mike some slack, TJW. He’s one of the good guys!
If Mike wanted to upgrade his appearance, he should have Leah Remini make him over. She made over Jefferey Augustine, husband of Karen de la Carriere, and he looked great after that makeover. His hair was cut and nice and moustache trimmed and suit nice. It was such a great difference.
A few years ago I made a donation to the Aftermath Society. This is a group of people who help victims of this cult when they escape. These victims have little education and few skills to help them get jobs. They need a lot of help getting started in life after escaping the cult.
Ever since that time this society has sent me emails asking for donations. Just recently they sent me a plea for winter clothing for a lady who had recently escaped. They specified all the sizes for this woman’s gloves, boots and other winter clothing. I had to wonder why they just didn’t ask for money. I have no access to any womens’ clothing. But I managed to figure out that I should just send them money instead.
What is my point? It is that when a large portion of a TV audience tunes into a discussion involving people they have never seen or heard of before, they are likely to just change the channel if the person speaking projects a poor appearance. When that happens, it is the victims of the cult who suffer. After all, Mike is on the board of the Aftermath Society. But I’m guessing that people who still suffer from the cult mentality are unable to see the parallel between emails asking people to donate womens’ winter boots Size 7 and Mike’s refusal to consider that his appearance impacts the victims of this cult.
Thomas, I think you should get yourself on TV and explain things to people as it seems like you have it down perfectly.
BTW, it is the Aftermath Foundation, not Society. You should be more careful about your utterances and prepare them properly before you type…
🙂
pluvosays
What an odd reply here in the comments section and so awry regarding the real essence of the article.
By the way, about your “winging it”, Mike Rinder is (with Tony Ortega) the best speaker explaining the many intricate subjects of Scientoogy succinct and understanably, giving as much information as possible in short time in interviews.
Sneaky, sneaky your last sentence. And such concern about the negative impact Mike Rinder has on “the “victims of this cult”.
Stevesays
I’m sure you had enough of checking yourself during your decades in the organization. The contrast between your tight winding at that time and your ease today is striking. Your natural truthfulness comes through. I probably don’t need to tell you this but don’t change a thing. With you, the message is the medium.
I though you looked and sounded very genuine. Thanks Mike for everything you do to help people now. I find it ironic that while in scientology, they convinced you you were saving the planet; while in reality that’s what you’ve been working at since you left…
Authenticity, clarity, simplicity, modesty – these are the qualities that penetrate into the psyche’s of people. These are powerful qualities emanating from someone who has , truthful, helpful message of great import which needs to reach masses of people. Mike is an expert at this.
Someone ought to draw up an “Ex Cult Member Rip Van Winkle Course ” to bone up and bring up to date those ex cult members who will be speaking publicly like you do, Mike.
I’m fine that Aftermath Foundation hires PR specialists for public speakers like yourself, for advice to you and others who speak up publicly on Scientology for the public’s benefit.
Adult education at a Univ of Florida facility, I’m sure you qualify and could get a grant easily, and do it online.
Or, Mike, there are surely people watching your public speaking who can privately contact you.
You are the perfect helpful speaker publicly these days, to help the public understand what official Scientology’s PR statements mean.
I thought you did exceptionally, and as a Rip Van Winkle Course non graduate myself, I miss the fine points others see.
Very odd remarks, TJW. Not quite an ad hominem attack, but wonder how you would hold up generally putting yourself out there? Oh, that’s right . . . you’re not doing it, either to show us your heightened fashion sense of what works on TV or for your knowledge and experience with the cult.
I just don’t see this fashion critique on Mike as legitimate. He looks appropriate and is very well spoken and doesn’t use jargon from the cult, which could lose a lot of new people trying to understand. So lemme see if I can understand you. . . He’s not enough of a fashionista so he’s doing a disservice to the victims who need him most?
Now, former Scientology pitbull and spokesmodel Tommy Davis would meet with your fashion sense and approval, TJW, but unfortunately, he doesn ‘t put himself out there anymore, either, after shilling for Miscavige and going away quietly to have a nice, privileged life that has been denied to many of his and the cults victims. And of course, Miscavige himself would definitely meet with your fashion sense approval. These two follow your expensive tailored suit and tie approach when they show up and shill for their cult.
The irony is that their focus on appearances along with their lies to an unwitting public is what keeps people coming into it and people looking at them like, “How can men who look like this be doing all these horrible things? I just don’t believe it.” A la Ted Bundy when his crimes started coming to light. Women found him attractive and he was quite vain about his appearance.
Many, many people before Mike Rinder, and MR himself have the courage to stand up to this criminal enterprise at great personal cost to themselves and their families along the way. And all this in the hope that the gross human rights violations stop.
Good to know what’s important to a person. Thanks, TJW, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about. Peace.
That’s a good point you made about Tommy Davis, Linda.
If rank and file Sea Org members pulled the stunts that TD pulled they would be utter and complete toast. They’d be lifers in RPF’s RPF or whatever passes for The Hole nowadays in Miscavige’s cult. Or they’d shipped off to God knows where and never heard from again.
But wait, whoa this is Tommy Davis, after all – Anne Archer’s little boy and loaded with dough and important wealthy connections via his birth father soooo…wouldn’t wanna make Big Momma angry or cut off the flow of dough from Davis Senior.
Davis Junior was a diletante and incompetent, made huge mistakes and blew, but never mind, that’s OK, he’s no Degraded Being as would be any other Sea Org member who screwed up royally and blew. Oh no, little Tommy did not “betray his group”.
Its sickening, the injustice of his preferential treatment. One would think Anne Archer and her husband Terry Jastrow would be embarrassed – deeply embarrassed.
When you say, ” Thanks, TJW, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about.” I wonder if you can recognize this is the exact same language that committed members of this cult (like John Travolta and Tom Cruise) when they are asked if they ever read anything on the Internet which exposes the truth.
The language they use is almost identical to your language. They say, “Why in the world would I ever want to read anything written by someone who is critical of my religion?” No thank you. They don’t want to know the truth because they are afraid of what they might find.
Leaving the cult is not enough. People who just leave seem to substitute one cult for another. If you just look at all the remarks made to Mike, they just praise him for all the fine work he has done. But no one can say anything critical about Mike. If people consider him to be perfect and that he can never do anything wrong, that is a real big warning sign they have just substituted one cult leader for another.
Do you work for OSA? Asking for a friend 🤦🏻♂️. Man, I have never seen anyone in this blog nitpick as hard as you did.
Mike has bent over backwards and sacrificed so much and keeps sacrificing to air Scn’s continued abuse. I think he’s got bigger things to worry about besides his jacket and “winging it”.
Frankly, it makes him appear human and relatable, just being exactly who he is.
I agree with what Mike said in your back-and-forth. I think you should get on TV. It’ll take some of the pressure off of Mike! Let’s see who does it better. I call dibs on Mike!
As Hubbard’s son Nibs stated in depositions, Scientology ‘was not for L. Ron Hubbard himself.’
What Scientology WAS created and meant for, is Hubbard’s devious, but very intelligent control (the lack of FREE awareness, the ‘blinkered’ or very narrowed Perception, the PRETENSE of goals, and the highly destructive separation, respectively enforced allegiance) of OTHERS.
By giving people some wins that are well within the limits, or the ‘bubble,’ that he wanted to and DID keep people enclosed in,
as his ‘adherents,’ but kept Blind to Perceiving the actual nature of him, and the spiritual inflictions by Hubbard.
(Typically Debbi Cook, and this FreeZone guy Captain Bill – those who never looked through the malicious nature of Hubbard nor at his deadly inflictions, but that Alan Walter, etc., etc. however, were forced to discover.)
Any doubt about being at the last stage of Age of Paranoia.
Now the court proceedings and its verdict shall be part of publc record.
Same time Spokes Person distance herself by identifying as Catholic, a face of 3 decades turn out to be of stranger/ professional who did it as paid job. This reminds me Tommy interview with Martin Bashir
Yeah. Like Monique Yingling wanted to say, “Don’t hate me. I’m not a scientologist. I just play one on TV.” As a Catholic, she truly should be ashamed to helping an organization so full of human rights abuses. But I know she isn’t.
It reminds me , when some one asked about product at Dollar Store ( inferior goods store) the attendants distance themselves saying, sorry I never used them.🤣🤣🤣
You never waste your words, Mike. So succinct and informative. Your accent doesn’t hurt either. So pleasant to hear. Thank you for your courage. As a cult survivor, I count on your example.
Great interview, Mike. Leaves little doubt about the mindset and intentions of Scientology.
Good Job Mike, very effective.
I remember when Scientology spokes person Tommy Davis stated on national TV that there was no such thing as disconnection in Scientology. For those ex Scientologists that lost their jobs, parents, siblings, children etc due to the disconnection policy of Scientology, it was very upsetting. It motivated many of them to write books, speak to the media, the FBI, etc. The backlash can not be understated. Scientologists also saw for themselves that their “church” was lying. To see Scientology publicly state that there is no policy to prevent their members from reporting to authorities the criminal actions of fellow members only shows that Scientology did not learn its lesson. Every Scientologists knows that the statement is a lie and opens the question as to what else is their “church” lying about. The lie is easily proven and it will come back to bite Scientology.
I’ve read all the replies to my post and it truly saddens me that most everyone ignored my motive – which was to help Mike be more effective in TV appearances. Seems to me that many people who post here may have left one cult only to substitute another cult in its place. People here now seem to refuse to accept even the slightest negative remark about Mike – regardless of the truth or my motive.
Well, so be it. If Mike insists on appearing on national TV looking like a clown, it really doesn’t cause me any harm. The person who gets harmed is the lady who recently escaped the cult and now needs winter clothing. I tried to offer Mike some advice to make his TV appearances more effective. Although it did contain a minor negative point, what does it say about the mindset of former cult members? IMHO, they’ve just substituted one leader for another. It appears that no one must ever make any negative remark about Mike. So many posts made on this blog contain nothing but praise for Mike. There’s nothing wrong with praising Mike. He has done a tremendous amount of good in the fight against this cult. But it’s hard to swallow when so many people refuse to accept anything containing the slightest negative remark – regardless of the truth or underlying motive.
Thomas, you expressed your opinion in a public forum criticizing the clothes I wear on TV and that I am not “well-prepared.” So you know, I don’t want to look like the perfectly suited, scripted and rehearsed David Miscavige that is what represents scientology to the world.
Others don’t agree with your opinions and express theirs, some even critical of you.
And in reply, you quickly descend into the straw man argument that they are “substituting one cult for another” and I am their new cult leader…
Oh dear.
If you were really worried about the well being of the woman we are helping through the Aftermath Foundation with winter clothes (and many other things), you would spend your time doing something to help her and others like her. Submit your information to volunteer at the Aftermath Foundation website.
Seriously, if you don’t like a few comments on a blog criticizing you for the opinions you expressed here, I don’t think you would enjoy the lies and criticisms you would have to endure if you actually said anything negative about scientology. Let me know when you schedule your first TV appearance talking about the cult so you can put your expertise into practice. I will be sure to watch and then thank you for your courage, no matter what jacket you wear.
Mic drop.
You are missing the point. It’s not about your “slightest negative remark”/remarks.
Consider the following excerpt from a post here by Linda Olsen:
“Thanks, TJW, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about.”
Do you recognize this language? It is almost identical to people who are committed to the cult – like John Travolta and Kirstie Allen.
When asked if they have ever read any of the articles on the Internet exposing the horrors and abuses of this cult, they answer in words to the effect, “Of course not! Why would I ever want to read anything written by someone who is critical of my religion?”
I always marvel that people are willing to act like Ostriches and stick their heads in the sand so they do not have to consider the truth.
But here we have one poster who is saying the same thing. She says, “Thanks, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about.”
Don’t you see this is the same cult party line? People try to make fun of me because I said that many former members of this cult are still stuck in the same “cult think”. But can you not see that in action – right here in this blog?
I think this is terribly sad. People who leave the cult believe they are healed. But they still carry the same old cult think with them. More is needed to heal people then just leaving the cult. It’s a good first step. But if that’s all people do, they will still think and act the same way. It’s not enough to just substitute one cult leader for another.
In any case, I have nothing more to say about this subject. I’m sure that many of you will be happy to know I am “over and out” on this topic. I just wish you would take a closer look at yourself and see if there is any truth to the fact that even though you may have left this cult, you are still acting and thinking in the same way.
I sincerely wish you all the best of luck in cutting the strings that keep you tied down in the bubble.
Finally, one poster chastized me saying that if I was really wanting to help I would have made some contributions to the Aftermath Foundation and to support the cult.
Many of you may not belive me. But I have sent more than $400 to the Aftermath Society and I sent $500 to support Shelly Ashbridge when her son was in that terrible car accident.
Some of you will accuse me of false bravado and bragging. But if I wanted to do that, I would have done it right after Shelly’s son had that accident some six months ago.
That was actually the event that really soured me against Mike. After sending $500 to help Shelly’s family, I asked Mike to do me a very tiny favor that would have taken him less than one minute. But he refused saying that he was too busy to help me with such a thing. It was then I realized that when he says he is eternally grateful to everyone who sends him money to support his work, that he is not being truthful.
“That was actually the event that really soured me against Mike.”
All your various verbose explanations, complaints, accusations and all the fuss and that is the crux of the matter (which you couldn’t handle with Mike directly to your satisfaction and are annoyed about)?!? Sad.
Thanks for helping! Btw., I did that too, and not only on one occasion when it was needed (monetary), albeit without any expectations and demands.
You were great Mike Rinder !!!
What people should understand is, L. Ron was bff (and stole his girlfriend) with Jack Parsons in the early 1940s and were OTO occultists silly enough to perform an actual Babalon Moonchild ritual. And in regular postal contact with Aleister Crowley, who (when it suited him) fancied himself a priest of Lucifer.
Incredible job Mike, quoting the Ethics Book, and making it crystal clear, Scientology was lying with their statement.
Incredible, how far things have come, so a former official, can go on TV, quote Hubbard, pretty much making it evident, how Scientology lies.
Amazing moment.
Tom Cruise needs to do the Volunteer Minister’s Course, and start putting ethics in on the Scientology celebrities, starting with Danny Masterson.
Tom, years ago, ought to have done the VM Course, and then done Danny’s ethics handling. Tom ought to have gotten Danny to turn himself in, just admit his guilt, and save the world from this charade that is unnecessary (necessary only due to Danny never getting his “ethics” in, and Tom ought to have stepped in years ago).
The Scientology celebs need an Ethics Officer with clout and understanding, someone to get the fellow celebs to cop for their felonies, and own up and admit their guilt, spare the world the legal charade, just fess up and do their time, pay the victims what is due them.
That’d be something to take note of, if Tom Cruise would step up and do that, or had he stepped up and done that.
You were also on Nightline last night. 🙂 Tick Tock! 🤣
Yes Tory. I am going to publish a list tomorrow to update the media appearances for those who may have missed them and would like to see/listen.
cob needs to go to some really good auditing. He may just realize he did something in a past life to pull this in on himself.
Well, that’s my “funny” for today. He would never allow that I am sure.
Well he is atleast a good MC ( Master of Ceremony)
Have you ever seen any Head of an organization being MC ?
For example Academy Awards , who is MC ?
Chairman of American Academy of Motion pictures? Or
Senior Celebrities like Steven Spielberg or Harrison Ford or Danziel Washington?
No No & No
It’s always a Comedian , MC of Academy awards show.
Its a job of lower stature , performed by some in late 20′ to mid 40’s.
That’s why I always equate them with Comedy Circus 🎪
For probably the first time in my life post Scientology I feel a real sense of honesty, justice and human enlightenment concerning the abusive nature of Scientology is now being accepted and viewed broadly and objectively by the legal system within the United States. In that I mean the general public is being addressed in this Masterson case to accept that there are two sides or multiple ways to view how a religion goes about its business and in particular how it goes about protecting itself. Faith is a good thing, blind faith is potentially a very dangerous course to engage.
L. Ron Hubbard for all his work, promises of freedom for all and broad impingement on the lives of others very carefully engaged in far reaching sedition against the authorities of all nations and creeds.
Scientology really needs to be viewed for what it does, has as its policies and how it manipulates the protective barriers afforded to the spiritual rights and freedoms available within many cultures.
It is destructive at its core.
I truly hope this criminal case looks at all factors involved for what they truly are, not what they are perceived to be without careful examination. A fair trial in other words.
It’s interesting to me how the law loses it’s mind whenever the word religion is invoked.
Imagine the headlines if Danny Masterson worked for a large corporation, say Microsoft, and was a high ranking executive, and three woman who worked under him came forward and claimed he had sexually assaulted them. Then, Microsoft had their HR dept. and lawyers swiftly threaten them with termination, lawsuits, and taking steps to prohibit them from finding employment with other companies.
Nobody in their right mind would suggest that the case should not involve a deep investigation of Microsoft, their policies, or their corporate culture in dealing with serious accusations such as these.
And if there was ever a “religion” that acted more like a corporation…
BTW Mike, I think you looked quite dapper.
I was told by a HealthEast human services person that being right was unhealthy. Being right is a fundamental function of a health care system. I decided at that moment to quit while I was ahead.
I lived in the scientology bubble for 37 years. Since 1999, I haven’t owned a TV. I have never seen an episode of Reality TV or “That 70s Show.” The only reason I know that Danny Masterson is an actor is through anti-scientology websites such as this because I also don’t read the newspaper (and never have). It’s very interesting watching the downward trajectory of Masterson and scientology.
I noted you did not use Scieno terminology in your interview. Excellent.
I use that characteristic as a measure of just how far the ex’es mind has shaken the scieno mind set.
You are winning. Please continue.
I have a few minor negative remarks about your appearances on TV – especially this recent Court TV show. But, since it has been my experience that anyone who posts any kind of negative remarks about Mike Rinder is immediately accused of being a bot for the cult or being paid by the cult, please allow me to begin by saying that I have followed your appearances on TV ever since you escaped from the cult in 2007 – especially on the Aftermath TV show that you made with Leah Remini.
Overall, I have a great deal of admiration for you as well as all the other people who have spoken out against the cult for its terrible human rights abuses. IMHO, the worst abuses committed by this cult are:
1) forcibly breaking up families when one member criticises the cult or disagrees with one or more of their policies
2) forcing members to live in poverty because they must give almost all their money to the cult.
3) Telling many stupid lies about how this cult welcomes and supports all people regardless of race, creed or sexual orientation.
4) Forcibly confining people to their properties and refusing to allow them to leave.
5) Denying members of any or all of their basic human rights.
So, what are my negative remarks?
First and foremost, I have some minor criticisms of the way you appear on TV. On this recent Court TV episode, you appear wearing a shabby jacket that lookes like it was 20 years old and that you got from some Salvation Army outlet. I know that many people here will chastize me for saying this on the grounds that your physical appearance has nothing to do with your stance on human rights abuses and all the other fine work you do. But when it comes to TV, your appearance counts a great deal – obviously a great deal more than you seem to realize. How difficult would it be for you to wear a tie? Again, I’m sure many people will complain that has nothing to do with your impact. But it has a great deal to do with how you are perceived by the audience. You should know that most of the audience who has never heard of you or this cult will quickly discount all that you say just because of your appearance.
For Heaven’s sake, there are many people who advise people who appear in the public eye about their appearance. I would suggest that you just ask one of them to give you their opinion about how your appearance affects the impact you make when you appear on TV.
One other minor point is that the host appeared to be fully prepared while you seem to just “wing it”. After all your public appearances, I would suggest that you prepare a few brief scripts so that you can come across being as professional as possible. One glaring example from the Court TV appearance was when you seemed to be searching for the best word or phrase and chose to use “man” when you made the point that the primary purpose of the cult is to protect the cult and make sure it appears in the best light to all of mankind. In 2022, it may seem insignificant, but you really do not want to offend women by excluding them from these kinds of remarks. I know this will seem silly to most people who read this blog, but you really don’t want to refer to all people as “mankind” when you can use a more inclusive phrase. I know this may seem like an insignificant point. But if you would just prepare a few brief scripts on topics about which you know you will be speaking, you can easily improve your appearances and – more importantly – the impact you make on viewers.
There is just no reason in 2022 to appear on a national TV show and appear to just be “winging it” – especially when you are talking about issues that are so very important to so many victims of this cult. Surely you realize the victims of this cult depend and need your help. There is almost no one else who is willing to help them.
But, aside from my minor remarks, please keep up the great work you do!
It’s tough to have a win here. One on hand I am accused of making money hand over first doing this work, on the other I’m accused of being such a bum I buy 20 year old jackets from the Salvation Army…
Ah well. You can’t please all the people all the time!
TJW needs to get a life or at the very least, a hobby. Good grief, people are just looking for something to complain about. Thought your jacket was fine and you did a great job, as usual. I could never put myself out there the way that you do – I’m not thick skinned enough and would be crying if someone said my clothes looked ratty😂 cut mike some slack, TJW. He’s one of the good guys!
If Mike wanted to upgrade his appearance, he should have Leah Remini make him over. She made over Jefferey Augustine, husband of Karen de la Carriere, and he looked great after that makeover. His hair was cut and nice and moustache trimmed and suit nice. It was such a great difference.
I’m good. Not looking for a “makeover”
A few years ago I made a donation to the Aftermath Society. This is a group of people who help victims of this cult when they escape. These victims have little education and few skills to help them get jobs. They need a lot of help getting started in life after escaping the cult.
Ever since that time this society has sent me emails asking for donations. Just recently they sent me a plea for winter clothing for a lady who had recently escaped. They specified all the sizes for this woman’s gloves, boots and other winter clothing. I had to wonder why they just didn’t ask for money. I have no access to any womens’ clothing. But I managed to figure out that I should just send them money instead.
What is my point? It is that when a large portion of a TV audience tunes into a discussion involving people they have never seen or heard of before, they are likely to just change the channel if the person speaking projects a poor appearance. When that happens, it is the victims of the cult who suffer. After all, Mike is on the board of the Aftermath Society. But I’m guessing that people who still suffer from the cult mentality are unable to see the parallel between emails asking people to donate womens’ winter boots Size 7 and Mike’s refusal to consider that his appearance impacts the victims of this cult.
Thomas, I think you should get yourself on TV and explain things to people as it seems like you have it down perfectly.
BTW, it is the Aftermath Foundation, not Society. You should be more careful about your utterances and prepare them properly before you type…
🙂
What an odd reply here in the comments section and so awry regarding the real essence of the article.
By the way, about your “winging it”, Mike Rinder is (with Tony Ortega) the best speaker explaining the many intricate subjects of Scientoogy succinct and understanably, giving as much information as possible in short time in interviews.
Sneaky, sneaky your last sentence. And such concern about the negative impact Mike Rinder has on “the “victims of this cult”.
I’m sure you had enough of checking yourself during your decades in the organization. The contrast between your tight winding at that time and your ease today is striking. Your natural truthfulness comes through. I probably don’t need to tell you this but don’t change a thing. With you, the message is the medium.
Heck, I didn’t even notice what the jacket looked like.. Tie? What tie? I only wear ties to funerals and weddings. This was neither.
Keep up the good work. Do do a fine job. And I am sure you make cob cringe every time you get on air. Good for you!
I though you looked and sounded very genuine. Thanks Mike for everything you do to help people now. I find it ironic that while in scientology, they convinced you you were saving the planet; while in reality that’s what you’ve been working at since you left…
You are out of Scientology. You are doing good. You are a good person.
We love you and applaud you for all you have done and continue to do.
This is all that matters.
Beautifully said.
Authenticity, clarity, simplicity, modesty – these are the qualities that penetrate into the psyche’s of people. These are powerful qualities emanating from someone who has , truthful, helpful message of great import which needs to reach masses of people. Mike is an expert at this.
Well done, Mike!
Mike, you just need a PR handler, is all, LOL.
Someone ought to draw up an “Ex Cult Member Rip Van Winkle Course ” to bone up and bring up to date those ex cult members who will be speaking publicly like you do, Mike.
I’m fine that Aftermath Foundation hires PR specialists for public speakers like yourself, for advice to you and others who speak up publicly on Scientology for the public’s benefit.
Adult education at a Univ of Florida facility, I’m sure you qualify and could get a grant easily, and do it online.
Or, Mike, there are surely people watching your public speaking who can privately contact you.
You are the perfect helpful speaker publicly these days, to help the public understand what official Scientology’s PR statements mean.
I thought you did exceptionally, and as a Rip Van Winkle Course non graduate myself, I miss the fine points others see.
Idiot alert!!
Very odd remarks, TJW. Not quite an ad hominem attack, but wonder how you would hold up generally putting yourself out there? Oh, that’s right . . . you’re not doing it, either to show us your heightened fashion sense of what works on TV or for your knowledge and experience with the cult.
I just don’t see this fashion critique on Mike as legitimate. He looks appropriate and is very well spoken and doesn’t use jargon from the cult, which could lose a lot of new people trying to understand. So lemme see if I can understand you. . . He’s not enough of a fashionista so he’s doing a disservice to the victims who need him most?
Now, former Scientology pitbull and spokesmodel Tommy Davis would meet with your fashion sense and approval, TJW, but unfortunately, he doesn ‘t put himself out there anymore, either, after shilling for Miscavige and going away quietly to have a nice, privileged life that has been denied to many of his and the cults victims. And of course, Miscavige himself would definitely meet with your fashion sense approval. These two follow your expensive tailored suit and tie approach when they show up and shill for their cult.
The irony is that their focus on appearances along with their lies to an unwitting public is what keeps people coming into it and people looking at them like, “How can men who look like this be doing all these horrible things? I just don’t believe it.” A la Ted Bundy when his crimes started coming to light. Women found him attractive and he was quite vain about his appearance.
Many, many people before Mike Rinder, and MR himself have the courage to stand up to this criminal enterprise at great personal cost to themselves and their families along the way. And all this in the hope that the gross human rights violations stop.
Good to know what’s important to a person. Thanks, TJW, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about. Peace.
That’s a good point you made about Tommy Davis, Linda.
If rank and file Sea Org members pulled the stunts that TD pulled they would be utter and complete toast. They’d be lifers in RPF’s RPF or whatever passes for The Hole nowadays in Miscavige’s cult. Or they’d shipped off to God knows where and never heard from again.
But wait, whoa this is Tommy Davis, after all – Anne Archer’s little boy and loaded with dough and important wealthy connections via his birth father soooo…wouldn’t wanna make Big Momma angry or cut off the flow of dough from Davis Senior.
Davis Junior was a diletante and incompetent, made huge mistakes and blew, but never mind, that’s OK, he’s no Degraded Being as would be any other Sea Org member who screwed up royally and blew. Oh no, little Tommy did not “betray his group”.
Its sickening, the injustice of his preferential treatment. One would think Anne Archer and her husband Terry Jastrow would be embarrassed – deeply embarrassed.
But I digress; end of rant.
And not that anyone cares particularly but just to acknowledge that my editing time ran out and I misspelled “dilettante”.
When you say, ” Thanks, TJW, for showing as much of yourself as I care to see or know about.” I wonder if you can recognize this is the exact same language that committed members of this cult (like John Travolta and Tom Cruise) when they are asked if they ever read anything on the Internet which exposes the truth.
The language they use is almost identical to your language. They say, “Why in the world would I ever want to read anything written by someone who is critical of my religion?” No thank you. They don’t want to know the truth because they are afraid of what they might find.
Leaving the cult is not enough. People who just leave seem to substitute one cult for another. If you just look at all the remarks made to Mike, they just praise him for all the fine work he has done. But no one can say anything critical about Mike. If people consider him to be perfect and that he can never do anything wrong, that is a real big warning sign they have just substituted one cult leader for another.
Objectively, tjw has an overinflated view of his own opinions.
@ TJW. What a bizarre comment. You write so much without saying anything.
Is this LRH 3.0 ?
What’s that smell?
Do you work for OSA? Asking for a friend 🤦🏻♂️. Man, I have never seen anyone in this blog nitpick as hard as you did.
Mike has bent over backwards and sacrificed so much and keeps sacrificing to air Scn’s continued abuse. I think he’s got bigger things to worry about besides his jacket and “winging it”.
Frankly, it makes him appear human and relatable, just being exactly who he is.
I agree with what Mike said in your back-and-forth. I think you should get on TV. It’ll take some of the pressure off of Mike! Let’s see who does it better. I call dibs on Mike!
I like to add to your interview:
As Hubbard’s son Nibs stated in depositions, Scientology ‘was not for L. Ron Hubbard himself.’
What Scientology WAS created and meant for, is Hubbard’s devious, but very intelligent control (the lack of FREE awareness, the ‘blinkered’ or very narrowed Perception, the PRETENSE of goals, and the highly destructive separation, respectively enforced allegiance) of OTHERS.
By giving people some wins that are well within the limits, or the ‘bubble,’ that he wanted to and DID keep people enclosed in,
as his ‘adherents,’ but kept Blind to Perceiving the actual nature of him, and the spiritual inflictions by Hubbard.
(Typically Debbi Cook, and this FreeZone guy Captain Bill – those who never looked through the malicious nature of Hubbard nor at his deadly inflictions, but that Alan Walter, etc., etc. however, were forced to discover.)
Any doubt about being at the last stage of Age of Paranoia.
Now the court proceedings and its verdict shall be part of publc record.
Same time Spokes Person distance herself by identifying as Catholic, a face of 3 decades turn out to be of stranger/ professional who did it as paid job. This reminds me Tommy interview with Martin Bashir
Yeah. Like Monique Yingling wanted to say, “Don’t hate me. I’m not a scientologist. I just play one on TV.” As a Catholic, she truly should be ashamed to helping an organization so full of human rights abuses. But I know she isn’t.
It reminds me , when some one asked about product at Dollar Store ( inferior goods store) the attendants distance themselves saying, sorry I never used them.🤣🤣🤣