And they are us.
Ignore if you can the typos and grammar — what is so remarkable about these pronouncements is how unabashed the bubble dwellers are when they state everything they have been doing up to now has been squirrel. “You MUST do this new course/rundown/procedure/level/status NOW because we have been doing it all wrong for 20 years.”
“Return your money and make good on the screw ups you paid us for?”
“Are you kidding?”
“You are disaffected. Only COB can tell us everything
he implemented we have been doing is squirrel. Start on Steps A-E — it is your only hope to have an eternity.”
See the African blog this morning. Coincidentally, a different take on the exact same thing.
The squirrels are everywhere….
Well just as they say in Poltergeist Mike.
Glad to see ya missed me 😉
Reading Steve Latch’s letter was something. I figure like Ray he’s sold out and is trying to justify squirreling.
Sure he quotes an HCOB but its totally quoted out of context which is what I’ve come to expect from the Church of Squirrelotology. The HCOB is from the C/S Series and its about doing the Grades *after* OT III as part of the OT IV RD.
Aside from that he’s forwarding the usual party line woes us we’ve been dong it wrong for over 40 years and now we are supposedly doing it right.
What surprises me is that they haven’t totally come out and said the Tech Didn’t Work until some moron with an IQ smaller than his shoe size who probably hasn’t read through a whole Scientology book or ever completed a course has now altered Scientology enough to make it “workable”,
The guy must be an idiot savant or maybe just an idiot.
Brainwashed and extorted to believe anything that comes down the “command intention” pike.
In case some of you knew him over the years, I thought that you might like to know that Doug Fairchild passed away this week. Not a good stat. Corp Scn should keep stats on who dies and take that off of their 20,000 people left in Scientology to give a correct stat.
Anyway, for those who knew and loved him, here’s the announcement and a couple of pics for you:
GAT 2 = “Scientology Light”: Less Gains – Less Fulfilling
sets guy says
EXACT KEY VITAL where did these blokes learn English. Study tech is working out for them famously. Holly shit batman. Hard to read completely beside it being a drooling suckup to His Higness. Just upsetting.
There have been a few people today commenting on LRH’s real and/or alleged personal foibles and somehow relating them to whether the Techniques he discovered and put together are or are not effective. To my mind this is ludicrous. The only people who have anything pertinent to say about whether his developments are effective or not are those who have personally experienced them. I find it interesting that anyone has any particular interest in LRH’s reported personal flaws. Ultimately, this site (and many others) exist as a result of the impact of this man’s researches and developments. Does anyone care that Sir Isaac Newton was often paranoid and had at least one documented “nervous breakdown”? Has anyone decided that his work was flawed or that Calculus is bullshit as a result of his personal life?
Staying relevant is a matter of evaluating importances, and then not getting sidetracked from whatever one has decided has true importance.
Jane Doe says
Espiritu – exactly. I had this discussion with a friend of mine who is out. I think he’s a great guy but he got deluged with all of this anti-Ron stuff. He kept telling me that I “just haven’t gotten it yet” because I haven’t looked at enough stuff. “Look at this video with Jesse Prince…” this person, that person. I told him I’d already seen them.
“Then read this book and that book.” I told him that I was in Scn and had read those books while he was still chasing skirts and pounding down beers in a bar.
Basically, I told him that, regardless of what people say that Ron did or didn’t do, there’s nothing I can do about that now, the man is dead. End of story, finito. But his work, as you say, Espiritu, is his work, AND it works. So why should I spend my energy witch hunting a dead man when there is so much to do to help people? Plus, the energy I might use to expose Ron’s bad habits or lack of judgement I’d rather use to get that little Hitler fox out of the hen house. Priorities, my man, priorities.
Thanks for bringing up the point, Espiritu.
Jane Doe says
Hear Hear Indie 8 Mill! Well said! Priorities Priorities. Get the little prick out as first priority and use our energy for something that can be done about it NOW.
High five, Jane Doe. Yeah, and creating safe places for people to get standard delivery in the meantime. I know that there are some who are out that want nothing to do with organizing the indie field and, honestly, that’s their choice. That’s what’s so beautiful about the concept of Indie.
But some of us do like the idea – and I think it would serve all of the people who are coming out, not to mention all of us who want to get our next steps on the Bridge, to have some stable datum of where to get training and auditing and help for those who want to continue to deliver.
In Scientology in the 70’s, I was often preoccupied with how would we be able to keep delivering to such a receptive market. I feel the same way now. If people can’t get delivered to out here, they may feel that they could just grin and bear it, back with the little dictator. I hope we can be the change we want to be out here. 🙂
Jane Doe says
Well said, Indie 8 Million. We do need to prepare to deliver because the mass exodus is happening and many of them will want to continue their Bridge outside the church. I read on another site that dozens upon dozens of SO members will defect by April. They need to know that the Indies will help if they ask us and that they can actually DO their Bridge and receive spiritual enlightenment and case gain outside the church. Inside and on staff they never got the “free” auditing they were promised in their reg cycles to join up. Yes Indie 8 MIll, let’s be the change we want to see out here in the field.
Yes. As much as we all just want to step off and be free, as Ron said, we all have to make it. At least all who choose to. We will all have to find our way to how we can help with that.
Jane Doe says
The Oracle says
And someone had the good sense to take responsibility for violating others!
The Oracle says
This is major news! How fresh! How sensible! How promising! It just all quiet in Miami! Thank you Dennis Nobbe!
“but the more GAT the more blind they get to the point that they can’t see the squirrels when they look themselves at the mirror.”
Sad, but true. A well stated observation.
Zana, I’d like to see that photo with DM’s face on the squirrels and LRH’s face on the guy! 🙂
Seventyfive, December 19, 2013 at 10:44 pm: “I’m glad the F/N conversation happened on this blog, I’ve been curious about what other trained auditor’s thought about it all, from a technical point of view. Thoughts?”
I you still didn’t read it, the following might be of your interest.
Marty’s blog post and the comments.
Dan Koon | October 13, 2012 at 4:03 pm:
“ I have a software program written by Hank Levin in California that turns a laptop into a meter. I have used it and it is very workable. Automatic needle reset, Clock, session timer, TA counter and a really cool graph along the bottom of the dial that tracks the needle movement. An F/N makes a sine wave on the graph and it doesn’t have to go three cycles for you to know it is an F/N.”
Tech Corruption: Floating Needles by Jim Logan
I missed some of these postings earlier – especially Marty’s from 2010. ENLIGHTENING!
I highly recommend everyone go back and read for a superb perspective on “what happened.” Thanks for the references.
The Oracle says
The senior C/S lying. “All you have to do is come in.” He finishes the message with one big lie.
I’d like to take this opportunity to channel my inner Margot Channing (Bette Davis in “All About Eve”), stand on a stairway with my hand on my hip, look down at Messrs. Latch and Miscavige and say, “Fasten your seat belts. Its going to be a bumpy year”.
Jane Doe says
Yes Love it, Aqua. And I love the Bette Davis quote in another movie where she looks around, sneers as only she can, and says, “What a dump!”
Hallie Jane says
Great visual Aquamarine…..and you look maaaaaaaaarvelous!
While I was training at Flag in 2007, only one sup on the metering course could give you a pass on the F/N portion of Emeter drill 16 (specifically I remember F/N spotting on the checksheet on the 3rd time through the drills, and you were supposed to spot 10 F/N’s to a pass or something like that).
EVERYBODY (not a generality) was being word cleared in the same way by the Metering Course sups (same words being cleared, same dictionaries). Words like “Rhythmic” “even” “sweep”. I figured this was normal, and I didn’t find out until after all my Class IV training that the F/N definition was so mystical and convoluted.
As of 2008, there wasn’t anybody in the coachman saying out loud that an F/N had to have 3 sweeps, at least not to me. But it was conveyed very strongly by the metering sups by clearing the word “Rhythmic”.
I understood it like this: in order to have a rhythm, you gotta have 3 beats. Try creating a Rhythm by clapping your hands twice. It doesn’t work. 3 claps will make a rhythm. So if you take that same example and apply it to a meter, the needle would need to swing a total of 3 times, and on that 3rd turn I would consider it floating as soon as the needle made the turn, I didn’t wait for it to continue to sweep back across the dial. I applied this through all my auditor training at Flag and never got into any trouble.
My big question that I never dared ask was, “Couldn’t LRH have clarified it a bit more if it was so important?” Which had me realize that while an F/N is a signal meter read, it is nowhere near as important as TR’s, ARC, auditor code, etc.
As I audited more and more (internship and the field) I stopped giving so much importance to the significance of the mystical F/N definition. If the PC was hatted and programmed correctly, and my comm cycle, ARC, and TR’s didn’t suck, the damn needle would float very obviously at the end of a process (cog, VGI’s). And if I didn’t see it float then I carried on. And if I accidentally overran the pc I corrected it. I wasn’t the best auditor but I always cared way more about what the PC’s indicators were than the meter.
I can totally see how an auditor glued to the meter waiting for a “3 swing F/N” could overrun a released PC, and I also see how a “2 swing F/N” might not be an F/N at all (in my opinion). But with management putting so much emphasis on F/N’s and threatening heavy ethics for miscalling F/N’s there is a new generation of GAG auditors who ignore their PC’s altogether, missing the whole point of Scientology (a great strategy if you want to destroy winning PC’s and Auditors).
Whether an auditor calls an F/N that isn’t there, or misses an F/N, chances are it will be evident that something went wrong in the session very shortly afterward, and then corrected accordingly.
I’m glad the F/N conversation happened on this blog, I’ve been curious about what other trained auditor’s thought about it all, from a technical point of view. Thoughts?
BTW, thanks for the blog Mike. We’ve never met but I always thought you were a good dude whenever you gave speeches, media, etc.
There is also this reference from HCOB “Dry and Wet Hands Make False TA”:
“The only other conditions I know of that make an auditor mess up a pc’s TA are:
…(с) A ‘fleeting F/N’ where the pc F/Ns so briefly the auditor misses it and
“So briefly” that the auditor can miss it tells me that the key is whether or not the needle is actually FLOATING – not how many swings it might make if it had continued longer.
I think that reference wipes out the 3-swing rule.
Sophia, I agree. Hard to see how a 3-swing F/N would even be considered as “brief” as a fall.
Honestly the only reason you started concentrating on the 3 or whatever swings was because if you were on video (I held examiner for months; heck, I even had Rinder in front of me on a few occasions) or look-in, and mis-called an F/N, it was Doubt, out of the chair, and scrubbing bathrooms with a toothbrush. If you were lucky.
If you were unlucky, you were assigned to Base Crew.
Third floor bathrooms weren’t fun, I can tell you that.
So that 3 swing F/N must be the Fleeting F/N.
WOW! Someone was forcing their MISUNDERSTOOD of the word rhythm on everyone! Ask a musician! No such thing that you need three beats to make a rhythm – that’s false data. Rhythm is established instantly. A musician can tell the rhythm the conductor is giving in the first microsecond initial sweep of his gesture – you don’t have to wait for beat 2-3-4 or whatever.
HA HA! Wrong definition of rhythm – probably due to use of “glossaries” and not real dictionaries – leading to conceptual MISunderstanding!
I think there are many people who would look at a motion that is flowing, regular, smooth, graceful, etc, and would use the word “rhythmic” to describe that motion, whether or not there was any kind of pattern, or repetition or recurrence involved with it, and even if it was only a single motion in one direction. An example is Aquamarine considering her single, smooth leg raise to be a rhythmic motion. Such persons might very well call one, well-executed, smooth swing of a baseball bat a rhythmic swing. I believe I’ve heard this usage of the word fairly frequently. It is my opinion that this was how LRH was using the word in the F/N definition.
The problem is, that is not in line with how most dictionaries define the word “rhythm.”
Movement or variation characterized by the regular recurrence or alternation of different quantities or conditions.
Procedure or routine characterized by regularly recurring elements, activities or factors.
Flow, movement, procedure, etc, characterized by basically regular recurrence of elements or features, as beat, or accent, in alternation with opposite or different elements or features.
Regular recurrence (recurring at regular intervals),
I haven’t been able to find a dictionary definition of “rhythm” that does not involve repetition or recurrence.
Dictionaries don’t always include all of the ways that people use words.
Dictionaries are not set up to specifically copy what people do with words. They give the definitions and if people are not using the word within those definitions, it’s really the wrong word for that particular useage. Perhaps LRH wasn’t clearing the words himself? I always thought of an F/N to be a smooth flowing needle, without stops or hesitations. It looked as if it were floating in air, “weightless”. That, with GIs, was pretty damned indicative that “something” had been achieved by the pc. I don’t think we’ll ever know where the untrained non-auditor and unadudited COB came up with his 3x decision…nor why he made it. I believe the best we’ll see is “because I said so!”
Yes, I agree with what you say – it’s a smooth flowing needle. However, it doesn’t just move in one direction. either rising or falling – It goes back and forth, or left and right. So it was totally correct for LRH to state that it is rhythmic and thus has repetition or recurrence. The definition he gave fits every F/N – UNLESS it is so brief that it doesn’t have enough time to go the back and forth, which it would do IF it lasted longer. That’s why the definition of “fleeting F/N” (in the Tech Dictionary) is important to know. That seems to be DM’s missing definition – either that, or he has some more sinister motive.
Very good. I sure can agree to that.
Yes, from a musician’s viewpoint, rhythmic has to do with at least two “beats”. You can’t have one beat to have a rhythm. Like in a metronome, you have to have 1,2. 3 is not necessary to be rhythmic.
Correction. I thought it was in the Tech Dictionary but just now double checked and it isn’t. However, it’s in the reference I quoted above – HCOB “Dry and Wet Hands Make False TA”:
“A ‘fleeting F/N’ where the pc F/Ns so briefly the auditor misses it…”
I for one really appreciate your experience and viewpoint. I especially like your point about the new generations of GAG auditors who ignore their PC’s all together. I think DM wants to take the human factor out of tech delivery. Fox example he’s replaced div 6 initial contact with a video of him talking. GAT 1 seemed to really focus on turning training into a Parrot approach. Many years ago, I once had an experienced auditor that said “no shit” for his ack. He made it sound so natural and had such good ARC that I didn’t think about it until later. The point is that good TR’s, ARC and really connecting to the PC seem to trump rote procedure. I don’t think that DM’s dream of trained robots delivering his concept of what auditing is about will ever bear meaningful fruit.
I’m not sure Misconceived has plans for any kind of auditing at all. The general emotion I think being generated is FEAR. Fear of doing it wrong, fear of being declared, fear of lower conditions, fear of having to do it all over again…and again…and again, fear of “losing my eternity” (whatever the hell that means) and fear of anyone ever finding out that you’ve begun having doubts.
(love this name! 🙂
And in trying to eliminate the human factor DM tries to minimize Scientology Axiom 51:
POSTULATES AND LIVE COMMUNICATION NOT BEING M E S T AND BEING SENIOR TO
M E S T CAN ACCOMPLISH CHANGE IN M E S T WITHOUT BRINGING ABOUT A PERSISTENCE OF M E S T. THUS AUDITING AN OCCUR.
It’s a direct and efficient assault to kill the technology from a MEST being’s viewpoint without trying to be viewed as such and then market and package it up as being the hero who improves the tech that LRH ‘was so negligentin putting out’.
It has become quite obvious that DM’s weakest spot is ACTUAL live communication!
I think the floating needle is an indicator. But ask the question what the F/N is indicating. First of all this depends on the level of the PC. Starting PC or OT soandso is a bit of a difference. Basically the E-Meter registers the mind. If there is charge. Charge blowing = Fall. Charge piling up = rising. Charge stuck = more or less a stuck needle. Floating needle = no charge currently at this time on the subject. You say „boats“ and if the PC is in session and looking at the subject then it can produce a fall, a rise or nothing happens. If the PC is not stuck or under other chargy influence then the needle would loosly float back and forth. Does not mean the PC is happy or had a cognition or whatever. Only indicates that this subject is not (currently) influencing the PC. Not equal to no charge on that subject. Currently no charge. According his current awareness level.
Thus it does not matter how many times the needle floats back and forth. No influence, needle floats. Thats it. Any other needle reaction you as auditor take action. Until flat which should be indicated by a floating needle. But not at all times. If it took 5 hours to flatten and PC is hungry the needle might not float. But you as an auditor know (through other indicators of the PC) that this process is flat. Then you do not indicate „your needle is floating“ as this would be a lie. You indicate to him that the process is flat and you end the session. The real gimmic is that you have to understand the tech. Then all data fall into place. Learning verbatim is not a good solution when handling life.
“There is no substitute for understanding.” LRH
Jane Doe says
+1, Seventy five
“Fasten your SEAR belt” is right!!! LOL
Flexible Flyer says
No thanks if I want that kind of case gain I’ll install my new copper grounding rod, tip-plated with gold for better conductivity.
If Davie was smart, he would wear a tin foil hat and connect it to his grounding rods, so that it would ward off all the entheta directed toward him.
Which reminds me – Hay Davie, MSH sends her regards.
Although he says that the new grades are faster than the old grades, I find no reason to believe him. With all the false PR put out by RCS, I would not be surprised that the new grades actually take longer than the old grades.
And the sad thing is that I know this person. But had no idea he fell into the Kool-Aide punch bowl. I really thought he had his own self determinism. This is so very sad to see happen to someone who I thought was a caring person.
I just hope that this will end soon, before more people get hurt.
Jose Chung says
The Photo is priceless.
Joe Pendleton says
In DMSMH, LRH claimed to have made many clears and described all their many fantastic attributes. Just a couple of years later he was working on the six processes to REALLY make clear a reality, then somehow in the mid sixties, John McMaster was labeled the first “real” clear. Then it was discovered that clears were still reactive because of OTHER beings’ reactive minds. When OT3s were found to be STILL reactive and casey, it was discovered that there were still OTHER beings who were even in worse condition than the previous ones and THEY needed to be handled for the previous clear to be in an unaberrative state ….. and yadda yadda yadda. And maybe this is ALL TRUE. I can’t say for sure that it’s not.
So, if you are telling me that all the folks who attested to the grades in the 70s to now actually DEMONSTRATE the abilities that they have attested to, I can only say that I have observed MUCH to the contrary.
Joe, I attested to a lot of things over the course of my in time with Scio. I never figured on getting huge “powers” and really paid no attention to the supposed wild claims. I do know that as I progressed up the line that I became a very different person. That was in my own reality and it was confirmed to me by friends and fellow staff. Not everything was handled, by a long shot. I’m still working on things I would like to handle this lifetime. I stayed in as long as I did because I *was* progressing and was helping others to do so, as well. I actually never measured my progress by supposed claims made by others. It wasn’t necessary.
Power Processing was a huge landmark for me. After that particular one, I felt as if I were walking about two inches off the ground. And that sensation lasted for over 3 months. So if I hadn’t become Superman, I really didn’t care. Most of those I knew well seemed to feel very much as I did.
That the organization has not held up to the promises is not a surprise. I believe, however, that the slack is being taken up by the indies in a steadily growing movement. It may be that there will be a new name, a new direction, to get away from the dreadful reputation the current regime has made for itself. I can only hope that current staff will not become too badly damaged, though I can’t see how thing will play out that way.
Joe Pendleton says
Gman – totally dig what you are saying. I also had tremendous wins in auditing,, though not sure I ever fully reached one of the stated ep’s. I was also never interested in any of the Advance Mag/Philadelphia lecture “superpowers” – When I got in in 1970, what I wanted was more certainty of self and increased ability to postulate. Yes, of course I made great progress in those areas and learned a LOT more I had never anticipated.
My post was really a comment about the subjective nature of auditing, but especially about the changing viewpoint of what is necessary to be done to achieve the stated/promised goals of an able and free being. As an auditor and CS, I felt I fully understand how to achieve these goals with standard tech in the 70s to 2006 when I left. And …. is Mr. Latch CORRECT in what he now promises? Well ……. I don’t know. As I am not “in” anymore, I will never know from personal experience. Will what Latch & Miscavige promise come to pass? We’ll see. But I do need to point out that as there are no longer NEW people coming into Scientology, this GAT2 will be done on folks who mostly have been in Scientology for years, If not decades.
BUT… I will close by saying as I have noted in the past, that from my personal observation of clears and OTs over the past four plus decades, in respect to ability, confront, courage and in being “aberration free”, I not only think most if not all of these people could use some hundred hours of objectives, but they could highly benefit from doing their grades towards achieving more stable and real ep’s, if these ep’s are in fact achievable.
MS-2 and the rest of the indie field are gradually taking over the subject, and resuming forward progress. The truth will prevail. It is already happening.
The BS will be dropped, but to complete this, the whole history of how the C of S went off the rails is needed to understand the mechanics in order to avoid it in the future.
Current staff are still digging a deeper hole for themselves to get out of. (Still doable, but more work. I also wish that they would at least stop digging – sigh.)
Oh well, here is to a bright New Year!
Maybe the squirrels should just start their own Church.
xxxmorrisxxx, so true, love your suggested statement. That’s what I always wanted to point out to auditors/supervisors/C/Ss but never came up with the right words. If the needle is floating, isn’t it floating at each point in its duration? I think the answer was “you don’t know for sure til the 3rd swing”. And I was really bad at making 3 swings. Guess I needed more training.
Cat daddy says
Bridge to Total Fail
To a certain extent, this 3 swing F/N is LRH’s responsibility as much as anyone’s. I’m a NED auditor, and I can’t tell you how many people I have seen being word cleared on the word “rhythmic” to try to figure out this LRH definition. Digging as deep as they can to find the right def. that fits. And many times not really finding it. It’s obvious it’s not three sweeps, or else the def. would say “Rhythmic SWEEPS of the dial”. But throwing the word “Rhythmic into the def. has caused a lot of wasted time for many many students. So really you have to depend on lots of other LRH explanations and definitions of an F/N, even though he says no other def. is correct.
Right, overrunincalif! I agree with you completely. I just recently, on the Golf Channel, heard a pro-golfer’s swing described as “beautifully rhythmical”, by a sophisticated South African announcer. And the golfer only had two sweeps (a golf swing would never have more).
Good observation- thanks.
Gerhard Waterkamp says
…and that again has is roots in “source” telling us how it is. Rather than bringing about a deeper understanding what causes a F/N and therefore being able to resolve this from a higher level of understanding. But here they are stuck in literalistic word acrobatics discussing the description of a phenomenon without really understanding it.
overrunincalif, respectfully, what’s confusing about the word “rhythmic”? A rhythmic sweep would be smooth and even, not jagged, the needle moving not faster in some places and slower in others, but moving across the dial at an even pace. Have you ever had a professional massage? Its rhythmic. And you’re right, LRH does not say “sweeps”, it is “sweep”. The Dwarf’s dub-in know-best must be 3 sweeps comes from God knows where.
My own opinion is that the Dwarf has an MU on “sweep”.
The word is not confusing at all. That’s the problem.
You said “A rhythmic sweep would be smooth and even, not jagged”,
that’s fine, but has nothing to do with the definition “Rhythmic”
I suggest you look up “Rhythm, and Rhythmic”
Ok, you’re on:
Rhythm: “A regular, repeated pattern of sounds or movements”
So, when the needle moves smoothly and evenly and not jaggedly across the dial for however far it goes, wouldn’t this be “a regular, repeated pattern of movementS? Because so long as the the needle has moved AT ALL, THAT is a “movement” of the needle, correct? And then another movement, and another and another etc etc until, starting from HERE, it ends up THERE. There are a whole bunch of movementS occurring, but because these movementS are EACH OF THEM of completely uniform velocity, its impossible to tell them apart, so it looks like ONE movement but it isn’t.
Ask a pro ballet dancer who can raise her leg from the floor to over her head in one, fluid movement how long she practiced until she could do that, and her how many times her earlier efforts resulted in a series of much smaller movements to get her leg up that high, until her muscles became strong enough to make it look like “one movement”.
Ok, now get mad at me 🙂
Excellent viewpoint and data, Aquamarine.
How many auditors and word clearers and examiners know in their gut that if you don’t call an F/N right when it happens, then it goes away, unless it is an “unkillable” F/N which is the result of a really big win. But the “unkillable” F/N is only a small percentage of F/Ns you will see.
I’m not mad at you, as I mentioned before, this definition has been a thorn in the side of many. The problem in using the word Rhythm is that, even in the definition you used, there is that word “repeated”. Now I understand your interpretation of it, and that sounds fine. There are a few definitions of this word. The majority of them have “repeated”, “recurrent” etc. in the definition. Which can lead one to believe that if it has rhythm, then it has to happen more than once. Which is true in most cases. So it can get confusing, and has caused confusion for many. That’s my point. This definition has become confusing for many people, for many years. That’s a fact. And continues to this day. I’m not debating the definition of the word. I’m simply pointing out that it is, and has been, a confusing one. How else could DM get away with 3 swings? Which we all agree, is ridiculous. I just think LRH should have been a bit clearer on this, and not create so much confusion and controversy.
One of my favorite HCOBs is The Time Track and Engram Running By Chains, Bulletin 1. “Recent researches I have done in the field of aesthetics tend to indicate that rhythm is the source of present time.” LRH. Just another place he has used the word rhythm. Myself, I can see rhythm in a single flow, sort of a continuance repetition of itself. Is your present time smooth or going back and forth? Mines pretty smooth.
I meant to use the word, ‘continuous’ and not ‘continuance’.
overrunincalif, you may have a missing definition of “sweep.” Besides “a swinging or curving movement or stroke, as of the arm or an oar,” there is also “the steady motion of something.”
No, I understand “Sweep”. My point is that many have had confusion with this definition. And I understand why. That’s all. LRH could have been a bit clearer on this. Especially considering the importance of this word. He did not have the foresight to see the confusion his definition would subsequently create. Or maybe he did.
I think it was MADE confusing. Before the “3 swing” idea essentially became enforced, there wasn’t a question of “number of swings” – it was a matter of drilling enough to be able to recognize whether or not the needle was actually floating, i.e. it was the character of the movement.
Good spotting, Marildi
Thanks. The other definition that is pretty good is “the act of sweeping.”
Gus Cox says
That’s part of the problem – students in the Academy struggling over what “rhythmic” “sweep” and all that means just to figure out wtf an F/N is. All you have to do is see a few of them and you’ll know what one is. I’ve even heard of people getting shown Art Series stuff to try and get them to “cognite” that it must be 3 sweeps. I suppose if you torture a reference long enough, it’ll confess to whatever that asshole Miscavige wants.
Jesus F Christ, just look at the PC in front of you. Is the needle floating? Done. The Academies are just spinning students into torturing every word. The point of the Academy is get people in the chair, so they can *see* this stuff, and understand it. Higher skill comes in on the BC. If you fuck up and mis-call an F/N, it’s just Grades, it won’t kill the guy. Just go back and fix it ferchrissakes. You’re supposed to be co-auditing this stuff anyway, so it’s not like you’re out $thousands for an intensive. But over-running a cogniting, VGIs PC on anything while waiting for the goddamned meter to dance for little-dick Davey is gonna make them go away.
Look at the PC. Then look at the needle. Is it floating? Thank you.
Cat daddy says
Wasn’t David Miscavige the Senior Case Supervisor for Lisa ?
Why yes he was !
Alex Castillo says
Mike, thank you for jumping in to defend my words. Meet the other end of the extremists. One end houses the seriously addicted Cool-Aid drinkers and the other end houses the over the top disaffected people who are convinced they were done-in by LRH and all of his work.
Alex, please note that at no time have I ever complained of being “done in” by anyone, least of all LRH. I got great gains and some spectacular auditing. In all of those sessions and years, I only had ONE poor auditing session. That was always amazing to me. However, in a very early time, I was privy to a great deal of information which I was able to check out regarding LRH personally. He was not what he claimed to be. That didn’t stop me from going forward with my growth. As well, I was a valuable staff member. And if one is an “extremist” for speaking truth, so be it. There is nothing I said which hasn’t been publicly disclosed, and backed up, for quite some time.
As for Formost, all I can say is that is the first time I can ever recall being linked to an “ilk”. LOL
Hey wait a minute thegman77, I thought I was the ‘ilk”. 😉
You practically jumped on him for having wins and liking LRH and the tech.
I mean, I think admin tech is bunk, and I thought “day-umm!”.
Jane Doe says
Why doesn’t anyone in the Church apply some logic to the “3 sweeps” F/N? If the needle is only floating after three sweeps, what was it doing on the first two? The standard auditor/examiner statement should become: “Your needle is floating. And your needle was floating (while I was staring at you and introverting you).”
From the brand new Student Hat Dictionary:
floating needle: a rhythmic sweep of the E-Meter dial at a slow, even pace of the needle, back and forth, back and forth, with change in the width of the swing except perhaps to widen as the pc gets off the last small bits of charge. A floating needle signals the completion of an auditing action. Literally, floating means moving slowly on the surface of water of through air. Abbreviation, F/N. (HCOB 23 Mar, 78 RC, Clearing Words)
From the new Book of E-Meter Drills:
Same as above with following at the end in brackets – (Note that it can get so wide that you have to shift the Tone Arm back and forth,back and forth, to keep the needle on the dial, in which case you have a floating Tone Arm.)
From the new Scientology C/S-1 Illustrated:
Same as above with the addition of – It is also called a free needle as it indicates the preclear is free of the charge in the reactive mind that had been affecting him.
Beneath is an illustration of an E-meter dial with three arrows halfway between Rise and Set and over to Fall – one right, one left, one right – to indicate three swings of the needle.
Note that in none of the definitions above is it explicitly stated that three swings constitutes an F/N. In fact, (Unless my grade-school math is completely OUT) “back and forth, back and forth” only amounts to TWO swings….But, I digress.
Could it be that the unspoken and unenforceable KAWB definition of an F/N was just way too obviously Squirrel to make it into any of these new ‘basic’ references in the Planet-shattering realm of GAT II?
Apparently, CI is now enforceable only through line drawings.
The Hell, you say….
Joe Pendleton says
Back and forth, back and forth ….. isn’t that a minimum of FOUR swings? One back and forth is a minimum of TWO swings. THREE swings? A compromise. (yes, things were better in “the swinging sixties” – which lasted to about 1974 or so.) I do recall the E Meter book I studied at ASHO in 2002 saying that the American Mark V didn’t FN. Say what?…. tell me something I DON’T know!
I am apparently unclear as to what KAWB means by three (3)…’back and forth, back and forth’ is indeed FOUR.
If counted from side to side, the line drawing in the C/S-1 shows THREE individual motions.
If we again use your ‘back and forth, back and forth’ count as two each, then a three swing F/N – ‘back and forth, back and forth’ three times would then equal SIX.
No wonder then, that the Bridge is at full stop.
The Student Hat should at a minimum include basic arithmetic, and perhaps a metronome…..
Jane Doe says
Jeff, you left out one word (“no”) on the first definition of F/N. It is on second line of the definition, it should read, “…back and forth, back and forth, with no change in the width of…”
Thanks for the catch.
Typing too fast….Damn spillcheckers.
Obviously, my MU on the subject is what exactly constitutes a swing.
Jeff, here’s the link to a great article about floating needles that might help. http://www.scientology-cult.com/tech-corruption-floating-needles.html
Yeah… Auditor to PC after cog with VGI’s; “Oh, I’m sorry that was only 2 sweeps, we need to continue the process.” – even if he doesn’t say it, you know the PC’s thinking it.
Alex Castillo says
I was not there in the 80’s. Please read my post again. I was a Flag Evaluator from 1975 to 1981, the year I left. That was before the Mission Holder’s Massacre. As for Hubbard’s personal life, I was never interested in it. If you think that actually verifying that a great deal of people were benefitting from the services they took is dreaming, then I guess you are right. By the way, you are not telling me anything I don’t already know.
Jose Chung says
David Miscavige is Narcissistic Sociopath,if you don’t know what that is you best find out before
you put any money into Scientology. All the Status in the World won’t make you Clear or OT.
I can expound for hours but my word is Buy a book on Narcissism,there are plenty, find out on your own turf
Nuff said. Visit a bookstore or shop online amazon.com. do something good for YOURSELF.
I find it interesting how heavily the speed of delivery being so much faster now is being promoted. If they are still waiting for 3 sweeps for F/N’s, I just don’t see cases running faster. I had friend confess on her last trip to Flag she was recalling pleasure moments to get through the 3 sweeps redefinition (to be honest, I think it was 6 month check, not grades.) But the point is… as a PC, if the auditor bypasses a F/N the PC is NOT getting the gains LRH intended. Kinda makes the whole speed of grades delivery thing a farce.
Jens TINGLEFF says
Sssshh! Don’t tell anyone that it’s common among old timers to be able to obtain F/N at will…
Hallie Jane says
All you need to do is come in!!!!!!!!!! OH!!!!!!!!! I guess I don’t need a six figure bank account after all. I guess I won’t have to sell my house, my kids and work till I drop after all. Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I thought the same thing. I’d love to see someone with some brass go into SFO and say “here I am for my auditing”, then watch the staff blanch when shown the letter which says “All you need to do is come in”. When the person (who will no doubt be routed to a reg) says “all it said I needed to do is come in! it doesn’t say I need to show you a credit card, or pay anything, or go into debt. it says I needed to come in. i came in. where’s my auditing?” Imagine if 100 people did that. The whole staff might, after a week, “get it”. The business of delivering what we promise is being taken seriously by people, and we can’t deliver it!
Roy Macgregor says
David Miscavige is like a live demonstration of the word “arbitary” which LRH defined as being when the solution to a problem then becomes itself a new problem.
A. Back in the 80’s David Miscavige comes to power and hates the idea of easily obtained wins and fast bridge progress so he demands that grades checksheets are compiled that require PCs to be run on EVERY single imaginable process before getting to the actual grades process and being allowed to attest. (Dan Koon has made mention of this event a number of times).
B. Then David Miscagive realizes that despite these new checklists being in use for some years, people are still getting through the grades and actually having great wins. He hits the roof and demands that a new definition of F/N be crafted that requires auditors to sit and wait for the needle to swing 3 times before a process can be deemed complete. As a result David Miscavige achieves his EP where each single grade can take 50 to 100 hours to complete and grades are taking years to get through.
C. Then Flag Service Organization business slows to a crawl as it becomes impossible to find a new clear or even a grade 4 completion anywhere in the world. FSO is running on re-cycling OT VIIs. This is a huge problem because FSO sends most of the money it makes up to Int where David Miscavige then gets to spend it. David Miscagive sees his personal slush fund as well as pay and bonuses dropping and dropping so he hits the roof. His solution is to offer stripped down quickie grades but ONLY at Flag. The result is a huge GI boom at the FSO because now all preclears world-wide can only get through the grades by going to Flag. This gets glossed over as a “grades pilot” but the pilot goes on for eight years. Meantime target achieved- David Miscavige is back getting a river of money from Flag. Hidden in the background droves of people are getting quickie grades and then disappearing from Scientology for good.
D. The Class V network goes into complete flatlined cardiac arrest. Auditor training was completely road-blocked by DM’s metering course way back in 1993. The Class V orgs struggled forward on auditing pcs but then in the mid 2000’s Flag starts hoovering up every grades pc in the world. After a few years of this smaller orgs started to flatline and after 8 years even larger orgs were flatlining as well. This becomes a huge flap because all these 20 million dollar buildings are completely empty and photos of deserted buildings are starting to show up Mikes blog. A new “handling” is needed.
E. Quickie grades are now released to all Class V orgs to deliver, under the guise of GAG II Still painful waiting for your 3 swing F/N, but far less auditing to painfully crawl through.
That brings us to the present moment.
My prediction is that there will be a short term small bump in business for Class V orgs and then they will get hit in the face with the crappy results that you get from quickie grades.
And make no mistake- these are quickie grades. What people are getting now very little more than the original “Quad Grades” when you simply ran the one grades process and nothing else. Later on came Expanded Grades with vastly expanded wins and results. These new grades should be called Collapsed Grades.
So we can expect to see handling step F in a few years. I have no idea what that will be. I am not an actual sociopatchic SP so I could not begin to fathom what David Miscavige will come up next when the orgs seriously flatline with tons of unhappy people who got quickie grades refusing to have anything further to do with Scientology.
But it is fascinating to see the solution to the problem that was the solution to the problem that was the solution to the problem that would have never been required if David Miscavige had been dragged kicking and screaming to the RPF 30 years ago. People like DM make you think that perhaps that current RPF does have a real purpose after all. Oh hold on – DM is the one who blew out the RPF program from 6 months to 6-10 years.
There is a similar chain associated with auditor training, and a similar chain associated with attainment of OT. What you get when you leave a squirrel in charge for long enough. Round and round, round and round. The new and improved version of the earlier new and improved version of the earlier new and improved version of the…..is that my tail I am seeing?
Solution: Get auditing in the Indy field where regular old LRH tech is used along with good basic training (TRs and real metering skills).
Jane Doe says
OMG Roy, this is one of the best summations and astute comment on the track of the tech, and especially the Grades, since DM took over that I have ever read. This bears repeating. Please repost it on all the other blogs. And maybe Mike can save this in his pocket for a time when he is too busy to post a blog that day and re-post this comment of yours as the blog. And I remember when I heard about the Grades pilot done at Flag where you complete so much faster, my two thoughts were: Quickie Grades and stealing lower org public so that Flag can make the money on them and keep them for their NED and Clear cycles and on up the Bridge. Flag was ripping off lower org public. It was like the Federal government taking over all the lower echelons of government so that we have one big federal government state. DM is sucking the GI and life out of these lower orgs to feed the fat hog. The saying goes, ‘pigs get fat but hogs get slaughtered,” meaning that if you are too greedy, you will die. To put it another way, pretty soon the parasite overtakes the host and the host dies and so does the parasite. Your days are numbered, Davie.
Brilliant sumnation, Roy.
From the new Grades Processes Handbook:
Title Page for Expanded ARC Straightwire, Processes 1-5
Run all reading processes and flows in the sequence given.
Title Page for Expanded Grade Straightwire Section II, Processes 6-26
If the preclear is audited through the first section of this checklist yet does not achieve the ability gained for Expanded ARC Straightwire, the Case Supervisor has the auditor run additional processes from Section II.
These Section II processes are run in the sequence laid out until the the preclear achieves the ability gained for Expanded ARC Straightwire.
Grades 0-IV are divided up in a similar fashion..
As far as I can tell, the only things missing from this GAT II edition is the Expanded Grades Checklists themselves (the sequence in the Handbook itself IS the checksheet), and the Expanded Grades References from the earlier three volume pack (1994), which included the issues and transcripts of lectures relevant to the Grades. It seems like this a simplified and perhaps streamlined version of that – It expands on it from 150 Grades Processes to 214.
Obviously, those additional 64 Processes are the difference, thus justifying the re-institution of Quickie Grades. The ‘Section II’ bit is just there in the cause of thoroughness.
If I had a nickel for every time I heard Scientology say “It was broken, but now it’s fixed!” “We cleaned it up”
“No more SP’S on the line” “Yes, we know it was bad before, but now it’s good!” etc etc. I might even be able to afford an intensive. It’s like a broken record.
Chrissie W says
Stephen has been a Senior C/S since the first GAT. He trained with my brother. I think my brother was the best man at his wedding. Stephen is in a unique position where his family is loaded and pays for him to be on staff. This is a 40something year old man who has a wife and children, who has never needed to make money. He is a really nice guy but only knows how to sling the BS he is “trained” to.
I don’t call that a nice guy. I don’t know the dude, but I call that a sycophant. Dangerous. Very dangerous. 1.1 on the Tone Scale.
I trained with Steve. That’s a pretty good assessment.
I know the Latch’s well.
What strikes me as funny is that while undermining whatever tech was delivered before Miscavige just sorted it all out for us again.. (despite any real Tech training to speak of) Stephen Latch signs off his letter with his “Flag trained Class VII”. Wouldn’t that training be suspect as having been done before GAT II?
Idle Morgue says
Steve Latch is from the Latch Whale clan. He is a died in the wool kool aide drinker and mainlines it daily. He is too far gone and by his crazy letter – can’t even tell that his own church has been hijacked and is run by an evil dictator!! San Fran Org has dwindled down to nothing! I hear they don’t have many staff members left..and lots of SP Declares issued over the past few years….so get on the rocket ride out of there if there are any lurkers from SF. Scientology cult is dying and dwindling down to nothing! Jump ship and gain your sanity back!!
They say they can ASSURE you you will reach Clear and OT. Is there a money back guarantee? Can ANYONE SHOW me a Clear or OT? SHOW me total recall or OT powers. Ron couldn’t do it. David Miscavige can’t do it. Nobody EVER has shown the abilities of a Clear or OT. There has NEVER been a Clear or Operating Thetan. Let’s see some PROOF before any money is exchanged.
The essence of ANY religious exchange is that no proof is needed or required.
The selling of Indulgences has been abolished, as has the public declaring of people as Fair Game, but the practices themselves remain in force.
Alex castillo says
Miscavige has killed every workable scientology process, including the auditors and C/Ss who could deliver them within the “church”, and has replaced them with squirrell crap that doesn’t work, no matter how good the PC is. Now he is selling stuff that doesn’t require an Auditor i.e. Purif, Op Pro by Dup, etc. And even those simple, basic processes have been squirrelled and rendered ineffective in terms of results. However, the Real scientology tech is OUT THERE being correctly delivered by honest, caring people. When I look back, I am so happy to have made the decision to leave in 1981 when I saw that criminal David Miscavige coming into the scene.
I didn’t know David Miscavige; I was in the GO. However, I knew there was a rotten apple, third-party, in the barrel somewhere. I observed that in GO/CMO relations. I also knew there was nothing much I could do about things, given the circumstances. D/A’d as a member of a pariah group if ever I said a thing, I sensed the ground rumbling and a steam roller on its way. No way was I going to let myself get squashed! Fortuitously, some things arose that gave me “reasons” to have to leave. I saw some former fellow staff again a year later, they were all so down-tone, confused, and depressed looking. Whether it was providence or divinity – I considered myself blessed to have gotten out from under that oppression when I did.
I, thankfully, missed that bus by “that” much. My other half at the time was going through the quals to go into the GO. Apparently, they didn’t want me because I was “PTS” according to them. That was new news to me. Turns out maybe I was PTS to the “better half.”
Either way, thank the Gods, I missed that boat to London and that ship to the torture chamber.
I wonder what would happen if Apple or IBM or Microsoft did the same thing. “Opps with did it all wrong and now after 30+ years we have figured it out. All licenses are here by revoked and there will be no credit for the zillions you have already givent us, and you have to purchase all new licenses so you have access to the golden age of 20th century technology!” . . . . . .
Good point. And – on top of that – what if Apple and IBM and Microsoft ran their businesses with slave labor? And didn’t have to pay taxes?
Right? Any other marketable product would undergo a “recall”. Sure new models come out that you can CHOOSE to upgrade but if you are happy with your original investment, no one forces you to upgrade.
I have been seating here for a few minutes trying to say something about your valuable and so valid a comment but it is such a good comment and so true that I cannot see what else can be added to it to make it better. It just hit me how bad and how mob-like the church has gotten. It saddens me because there are so many good and big hearted genuine people still in.
+1 Corvus. Extremely sad, indeed.
I know this kid. He just another ‘silver spoon sucker’ as his father owns the largest Chiropractic practice in the SF Bay Area. A real ‘know best’. Very dangerous putting even a smiggin of LRH Tech into those hands.
Quiet Guy says
Dear Pericles, As an auditor I’ve had to clean up his messes. Not his C/Sing but his personal contact with pc.
Pericles, t’s not exactly a being given a “silver spoon” to have dedicated as much time and energy as Steve has to train up to Senior C/S – and for simply being a full-time staff member. He may have it easier than other staff IF his father supports him (although I wouldn’t assume that), but it’s still no walk in the park, regardless. If you’ve been an org staff member, I’m sure you would know this.
It may be too late for me to fasten my seat belt now. After Debbie Cook’s letter came out I flew straight through the windshield in a horrific crash and did a face plant right into the middle of reality road.
I appreciate the Independent Auditors who were out there waiting and helped me with my road rash.
I am in awe…how could they believe this? Steve Latch was a good character and did care for his pcs, but the more GAT the more blind they get to the point that they can’t see the squirrels when they look themselves at the mirror.
Martin Padfield says
What a garbled message. Is the first para beginning “For some time..” an LRH quote or not. Is the 2nd para his words or Ron’s? What does any of this even mean? How many PCs are in the SFO Day Org winning right now? THAT would be something specific. How many grades have already been completed in the last three weeks since GAG II? Hm? Roughly? Was it all squirrel before GAG II? Didn’t PCs achieve actual grade chart progress before GAG II? If so, why not simply declare every single Scientologist pre – November 2013 for failing to apply KSW 1 – 10 and start again? I give up. Really.
Odd Thomas says
Martin – I agree it is maddening. I have seen this gibberish many times over the last 40+ years. It ALWAYS follows duress in one form or another. Threats to one’s family, to one’s future, to one’s eternity. There is no understanding in Steve’s words. He is pushing a concept, that deep within, he disagrees with but sees no way out of, so his words come out lacking conviction or a sense of cohesion. It’s really sad, reading such drivel.
Quiet Guy says
Poor Steve Latch! There’s not a single spark of “Steve” left in that message.
Alex Castillo says
I did my grades in the mid 70’s while in the SO at flag and i have never lost the terrific gains i had on all four grades. Your answer is: altered scientology processes don’t work! And that is what David Miscavige has been selling for the past at least 20 years. Improvements on an already altered process (including mandatory 3 swing F/N, can only enhance the NO RESULT effect. don’t be so surprised:))
And who set him up to do it, Alex?
Congrats on your grades, Alex. But I disagree the processes did anything. It took a willing pc to do all the work and a good auditor to guide him. Processes are just words. They do nothing in and of themselves.
Mike Rinder says
This is like saying a song or poetry can have no effect because “its just words.”
You are welcome to comment here, but careful about your tone (more in your other response to Alex) where you take a confrontational and pretty condescending position of telling him that his experiences were not real because you know better. O nly I can do that on this blog…. 🙂
And by the way, I have known Alex for nearly 40 years and consider him a good friend and I don’t like anything that smacks of “attacks” on my friends.
So be a biut more careful gman or you will find yourself in the trash bin. I posted both comments now, but I am giving you fair warning.
Jane Doe says
Exactly, Mike. Thank you for warning the gman. Strike one for him.
Good, Mike! Well put.
Mike: I never had a thought of invalidating anyone’s wins. That’s anathema to me. Nor do I feel in any way antago towards Alex. I’ve had many, many of my own wins, as well. But finally realized that it was just me and the auditor doing the work and LRH getting glorified. I knew, due to my various posts, that LRH lied a lot. While I can give him credit for a great deal, he was by no means any kind of “saint” and never deserved the unremitting gushing he got for so long. Nor the credit for anyone’s wins. Those could only be gained and earned by the student or pc.
Gerhard Waterkamp says
Hi gman, first I thought the outpoint was that DM took over Scientology and corrupted a good thing. As I knew from my own experience the tech in large parts works and can be very beneficial. After reading the “Barefaced Messiah”, the viewpoint changed. DM taking over was just a logical consequence of the madness. He removed any remaining compassion from the culture stepped up the craziness and greed. The “outpoint” now appears to be, how the tech could come out of all the initial craziness? It is almost unbelievable how the working good parts of the tech could be emanated from this world of wretched lies, carelessness towards other human beings and the amount of betrayal committed.
It is easy to throw out the baby with the bathwater, but in midst of all that deceitfulness and lies there was something different at work. I guess I still need to figure out what that was.
In any case nothing is as it appears, and sometimes one just needs to have the patience to live with the contradictions and acknowledge them as that until one discovers more of the truth.
Right. The processes & procedures LRH developed had nothing to do with it. After all, any 2 guys walking down the street can just play around with a GSR and get the same results, just like any 2 Eskimos can be thrown into the cockpit of an airliner and perform a perfect take-off. This comment is all too typical of someone who hasn’t got the first clue what Scientology even is.
Gman and Gerhard: The best I can make of this conundrum of extreme contradictions is that, in addition to his personal flaws, LRH really did think he was AT WAR. I came to that conclusion based on the data in Marty’s last book, where he documented that there was in fact a powerful conspiracy to wipe out Scientology – and it went on for 3 decades, starting in 1950.
I believe that would be a correct view. I think he truly believed that he might be assassinated. (Miscavige apparently has the same concerns, has armed body guards and had a special armoured vehicle built for his local travel and always flies via private jet.) Certainly the “war” footing was born out by the Operation Snow White which turned out to be quite a caper. The US government was more highly penetrated by GO operatives than, apparently, was ever done by the USSR. I still wonder how the Feds got wind of it. Of course, it was later indicated that it had all been MSH’s program and that he’d known nothing of it.
thegman: “I think he truly believed that he might be assassinated.”
I do too. Marty also wrote in his book that out of all the conspirators the APA was especially bent on taking down LRH, due to the fact that in *Science of Survival* it was clear that he was onto their vicious mind-control program when he wrote about having discovered pc’s who had been PDH’d. Marty said it was a wonder LRH WASN’T assassinated and added that probably the only reason was because he had become pretty well known – therefore, the APA and the others had to settle for character assassination.
I completely understand your point Mike. This is your blog and he is your friend. But I think it is important to accept that at some point in this evolution of de-hypnotization, people are going to express resentment towards the founder. In fact, I think it is a natural consequence of being educated to some facts of Scientology and it’s founder. It is a sign of healing not a sign of nattering.
But yes, sometimes us LRH naysayers can push the envelope. But we have an important work to do.
BTW, thank you for putting up with me. To me, it says a lot about you that you tolerate me. And thank you everyone else that puts up with me.
I do apologize if I have ever offended anyone, but my motive is not to be negative or offend. Nor to make less of your hard earned gains in Scientology.
My motive is good. You guys used to be my spiritual family.
Mike Rinder says
Brian — I understand and agree that all viewpoints are helpful in working out what is right and wrong and where one sits in the overall scheme of things. I am pretty lenient about letting everyone have their say. And I did post those comments from gman. I just wanted my view to be known. As there is one thing I REALLY value and that is real friends. And Alex is a real friend of mine. So, I tend to be a bit prickly about that.
Personally, I’d prefer your ilk to be booted off this site by Mike like they do on the ScnAfrica blog. Seems to me ESMB is a appropriate playground for you. You’ll make lots of friends in no time.
Hey Foremost, I appreciate your voice. I agree with Mike when he said above:
“Brian — I understand and agree that all viewpoints are helpful in working out what is right and wrong and where one sits in the overall scheme of things.”
I truly want to hear your voice, Foremost.
I promise no ad hominem’s and will listen as best I can as to why you wish me from MIke’s blog. If you don’t that’s fine too. I am simply curious.
Maybe you can help me see something more clearly. I mean that.
Understood. Loyal friendship: a good thing.
Glad you stood up for Alix. I don’t know Alix, but I appreciate his posts, and he has expressed many things that ring true for me. I hope to read more from him and wouldn’t want to see him discouraged from posting.
And just for the record, gman, I loved my expanded grades – done nearly 40 years ago. I still have those gains and cherish the memories. I was off lines as a Scientologist for 30 odd years (in good standing) – finished advanced University degrees, pursued a prof. career, married, pursued artistic & community (non Scn) activities. Not only am I grateful to others – my auditor, C/Ses, staff friends, LRH, etc. – I had a great time doing those grades – fascinating forays into uncharted and unexpected aspects of mind and spirit, so many realizations, lots and lots of laughter and smiles. This is not to invalidate many spiritual conversations I’ve had through the years with others (including non-Scientologists along the way), but conversation and auditing just aren’t the same.
Gman, you seem to have a goal of trying to convince us that we got nothing from Scientology, and we are deluded to think we did. Your opinion, your goal, not mine.
By the way, one of my biggest bonus wins on OTIII – in spite of all this talk about Jokers & Degraders… a much more nimble sense of humor! For some, that would be no big deal, but for me, I needed that!
Mary Rathernotsay says
How do you manage do do this? Way cool.
“It’s NOT that there are fewer processes done.”
That up there is a full blown unsolicited denial.
Here is the textbook material on what the legal field thinks of unsolicited denials btw:
But nothing, nothing at all, makes us lick our chops like hearing an unsolicited denial. An unsolicited denial is when someone being interviewed spontaneously refutes a statement that was never made. A classic example is when someone says, “It’s not like I was feeling guilty or anything,” when feelings of guilt were not any part of the previous discussion. Where did the guilt in that statement come from? From within! Another personal favorite of mine is, “It’s not like I cared what they thought about me.”
The thing about unsolicited denials that gets us so excited is that they are signposts that point towards the truth. If you don’t care what people think about you, then why did you bring it up? When a person says, “It’s not like…” that means, instead, “It definitely could be like…” We are now sniffing down the trail of truths that may have previously evaded us. But nothing, nothing at all, makes us lick our chops like hearing an unsolicited denial. An unsolicited denial is when someone being interviewed spontaneously refutes a statement that was never made. A classic example is when someone says, “It’s not like I was feeling guilty or anything,” when feelings of guilt were not any part of the previous discussion. Where did the guilt in that statement come from? From within! Another personal favorite of mine is, “It’s not like I cared what they thought about me.”
The thing about unsolicited denials that gets us so excited is that they are signposts that point towards the truth. If you don’t care what people think about you, then why did you bring it up? When a person says, “It’s not like…” that means, instead, “It definitely could be like…” We are now sniffing down the trail of truths that may have previously evaded us
Aha! So the vital piece of data wasn’t in the HCOB’s after all, it was in an LRH ED. That explains everything.
Good news! OT VII’s & VIII’s will only have to do the grades (for the umpteenth time), for 100 hours!!!
I love the photo! Was that staged? I’d like to see that photo with DM’sface on the guy. Good choice. The squirrels are attacking DM. 🙂
The squirrels attacking DM? Those squirrels should pick on someone their own size!
gato rojo says
I’ve seen it as part of a commercial running for AT&T or something–the squirrels sneak up on the guy and no matter what he does they aren’t scared away and they start jumping on him and biting him. Then at the end there is some kind of line about how no matter what happens to you you can always go home and watch Ice Age with your kids. (On their home entertainment equipment.) It is pretty funny in more ways than they even know.
Mike Rinder says
gj — its from a tv ad for Direct TV. You can google it….
Thanks. Just watched it. I’m amazed how they made it. Good choice, Mike!
Thanks again for your wonderful work.
All these “improvements” and yet Grade 0 completions still cannot communicate freely on any subject.
ALex Castillo says
Sorry to off topic. I missed the previous train to the land of Truth..
Alex Castillo says
Mike, this post has sent me on a trip down memory lane!!
As some of you may know, I was a Flag Bureau evaluator from 1975 to 1981. I was in charge of evaluating individual Orgs as well as what we used to call “continents”. At one time I was in charge of all class IV Orgs in the UK. In 1980 the WDC sent me on mission to all the UK Orgs (except Saint Hill)to handle various problems found through extensive evals, mainly (surprise, surprise) GI and dissafected EDs/COs.
I did missions in London Fdn (CO Ron (Hoppy) Hopkins), Manchester (CO Ira Chalef), Plymouth (ED was an american girl) and HAPI. Previous to my mission to HAPI, an eval was done calling for replacing the ED and getting a rather failing org back on it’s
feet. Just in case people don’t know, HAPI was never a very successful org in terms of volume of delivery. As far back as 1980, their staff was extremely poorly paid, most of the staff I met were having to do moonlighting in order to pursue their Scientology careers. The Org’s location is ideal for foot traffic and their main problem was they didn’t have enough Auditors and C/Ss to deliver a higher volume. It had a Flag Rep, an LRH Comm and an Assistant Guardian (GO). The staff were fully committed to their posts and I remember the main thing they hated was “missions” from FOLO UK who always came to “handle the GI”. Overall a nice and very committed bunch of people intent on clearing Scotland. The Hubbard Academy of Personal Independence (HAPI) was given that name based on PR Series Surveys designed to find the most acceptable name for the country. For the Scots, Indepence has always been a very big button and that is why, through survey tech, LRH decided to call it Hubbard Academy of Personal Independence. Same with Mexico. All existing orgs in Mexico are not registered as a church, which would not be ethnically accepted by the population and the government. They are called Asociacion civil (Civil Associations). During the years LRH was running the show, it was most important to be ACCEPTED to begin with and that led to the wide use of the PR Series surveys. Scotland would have been up in arms if HAPI had been called a church and Mexico would have been the same. If you look at what orgs used to be called around the world, you will notice that the given names were based on that country’s cultural values and not blanket “church od scientology”. Acceptance was key so that we could attract public to try our services. Even the prices for services had been surveyed to find what the working people of that country could afford. And we did it! Between 1975 and 1985 we boomed Scientology and Dianetics across the world. It just goes to show you the degree of ignorance, greed and insanity that drives David Miscavige. The PR Series is dead, long live David Miscavige. Evaluation Tech is dead, long live DM. Making Auditors, C/Ss and course Supervisors is dead, long live Miscavige. LRH’s Tech and Admin are dead, long live COB. In my personal view, COB/David Miscavige/DM is fully responsible for turning an effective help method into a despicable, criminal activity now called the Church of Scientology. Look back to the times when LRH was around and compare those times with PT. Sad but true.
Alex Castillo says
PS, by the way, it was in HAPI where I found the person who would eventually become my loving, beautiful wife and companion. She was the Flag Rep at that time. Our love is now over 30 years young and getting better!
Hallie Jane says
Good data Alex, thanks! It’s wonderful you found a loving companion despite the madness! I’m on year 34 with my hubby and he’s a data series evaluator too. Logic is a beautiful thing and a great asset to a marriage. 🙂
Alex, you were in dreamland if you thought things were good at any time in the 80s. The Mission system was dissolved through plain chicanery and theft, a totally illegal acquisition of multiple booming organizations along with all their bank accounts. LRH was still very much around. It’s clear in retrospect that he couldn’t find an SP if it were parked on his doorstep…as it was. Hubbard had been lying and lying and lying about himself, his history, his real plans for decades.
There were lots of wins. I credit those to the pcs themselves and auditors who still very much cared about those pcs. Hubbard was plainly only interested in making money and shifting it offshore to his own accounts. I personally knew two of the couriers to carried those millions over. None of it ever went into the orgs. It only came OUT of them.
How could anyone credit him with skills and knowledge when, for instance, his own 2d was in a complete shambles for years? Talk about an unhappy family! And he let MS take the full blame for his attack on the US government, never lifting a finger or saying a word. He just kept running. And one can hardly speak of any serious positive impact on the 3D! He left a total mess behind him. His could hardly be called “a succesful life.”
Alex, thanks for the data. This sort of info is what I love about these blogs, stories from guys on the ground of the Tech working!!
gman, what Mike said!!
THAT’S IT!!!!!!!!!!!! CAN I HAVE YOUR ATTENTION!!!
thegman77 has attested to Cognitive Dissonance Completion.
Standing O, applause.
To “Thegman77” – Well, if you notice, Alex didn’t say “the 80’s.” He said until ’81. ’82 is when the mission holders were run over with a steam roller. I was on staff in the late 70’s and it was Booming!
I can’t say how much Ron was on the line at that time, just saying that during the ’70s was some of the biggest expansion.
You can say whatever you want about Ron but the fact is that it didn’t start falling on it’s ass until Little Big Man stepped in and started to be the kingpin racketeer.
There’s my 2-cents-worth.
Odd Thomas says
I was at St. Hill in the late 70s, working in the Finance Bureau and every week I saw every stat for every org on the planet and I can attest that there were a lot of Orgs that did well during this period. Not all by any stretch, but there were some hot spots for sure. Miami, Milan, Mexico City, San Francisco and several others. As I have said previously on other posts – the Orgs that did the best were Indies at heart. They had strong EDs, strong Exec Councils and defied the constant bait and badger that masqueraded as management during that decade.
Evals that tracked the implementation of common sense, logic, compassion and a few key PLs worked magically. Those that tried to convert every square peg into a round one – failed.
I wish Ron had delivered the bridge “the way he intended”.
At least it’s faster now. It’s been faster ever since I can remember.
lol, that picture’s great, Mike