Mike Rinder's Blog

Something Can Be Done About It

Flag is Emptier than Ever

By 73 Comments

More evidence, as if it were needed, that scientology is failing.

Flag is empty. If there was massive international expansion, the number of people moving up the bridge would be increasing. Flag is the pinnacle of the empire and its state is a clear reflection on all of scientology.

This is the Oak Cove hotel at 7:30 pm the other night. As you can see, the place is virtually deserted.

 

This is the nearby retirement home that is the companion building to this one (they used to be part of the same community, but scientology bought the block closest to the Ft Harrison).

It is an old-age home…

They pay property tax and the residents generate income for the community.

 

Comments

  1. We were in Dunedin today it’s full of people strolling around. CW is dead. Creepy empty. People mostly avoid the whole area! 😑

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  2. Mark Rathbun did a good job. I am convinced that Mr. Miscavige should stay on his throne! Really! He did and does the best job to get Mr. Hubbards fictions and brutality onto a new level. If he goes on with his qualified work, these methods are outlawed for normal people into the same category as the Nazis or KGB. Forever.
    But if DM goes to prison, these harmful literature will be copied somehow (maybe from Kim in North Asia) as successful punishment methods and techniques to convince people to get self paid tortures.

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  3. Now you’ve done it, Mike. They’re gonna have to leave a hundred lights burning in the Oak Cove every night so it looks full.

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    • Lol was thinking the SAME thing! And now DM is having a temper tantrum because thanks “to that wicked SP Mike Rinder” their electric bill will skyrocket because they have to do the ol’ “make wrong.”

      Keep it up Mike! It’s astounding to see the increased awareness about scientology and CO$ tactics and so much of that is thanks to you, Leah and Aftermath. Can’t wait to see the newest venture!

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  4. Hi everyone, just wanted to say how moved I was by the enclosed Video, probably been shown a few times over the duration it is from 2013 and includes Mike but it just brings home the value we all have in being FREE to enjoy life, I have never been “in” but I follow Mike and Leah’s work, this week here in Australia we have a new series of their Aftermath show, yes we are behind but hey we are forward in time, anyway I pray for all those who have left the “cult” and those who have family members still inside this insidious ideology, my heart breaks for you in the hope that one day soon you will all be reunited.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0UFZVHfel4

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  5. All of downtown Clearwater is a ghost town on Friday and Saturday nights. It should be packed with residents and tourists. The beach is packed, nearby Dunedin is slammed… Clearwater is earily quiet.

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    • “I just saw a bumper sticker on a car on Sunset Point Rd, ” SCIENTOLOGY LIES”.”

      GREAT news. The word is spreading. Soon, it will be understood.

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  8. The Oak Grove was always excess capacity from the time they finished renovations – which were long-delayed, probably because it wasn’t a priority – from what I remember seeing. There have long been reports that it was largely empty, with what rooms were used being pressed into service for staff berthing, auditing or storage. I’ve tried to pay attention to it over the years as an interesting sort of bellwether, but if I’m off in any of my impressions and anyone has more accurate and specific information I’d love to hear it.

    I expect that ultimately Scientology will start to shrink its footprints in Clearwater and LA by abandoning far-flung properties almost no one knows about, and I think it likely they’ll do things like moving staff in to prime properties like the Oak Cove to create the appearance of a busy campus around Flag. But in cases like the Oak Cove, that would involve some tacit acknowledgment that they’re not going to need the capacity for some hoped-for flood of customers. I suppose it could be seen as sort of an “ideal” hotel, or yet another idle morgue, largely empty but kept open at significant unnecessary expense, under the belief that actual “expansion” is somehow always around the corner:

    ‘the Queen said. “The rule is, jam to-morrow and jam yesterday – but never jam to-day.”‘ Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking Glass

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    • Great article Mike. I remember right after the Oak Cove was built, that they would try to get parishoners to stay there by changing their reservations at the last minute while they were on the bus coming from the airport to their hotel. They did it to me twice by saying, “Oh, the Yachtsman is full so we’re putting you at the Oak Grove.” And of course I’d have to pay the difference in price. And once they pulled the switcheroo on a girl on the bus from the airport and she went ballistic and said she was refusing to stay at the Oak Grove because her reservation was at the Yachtsman and she practically went into tears over it.

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  9. I have an idea. We should coordinate a day where, at every org on the planet, someone takes a picture or pictures. These pics would be of the parking for that org. Of course, it would show how empty the parking lots are. A prearranged time, like noon, or 6 PM. Then these photos sent to Mike, and Mike can have a post one day “Another Day in the Lie of Scamatology.” Post the pics. People can look. Of course, I think it’s a good idea. But that’s just me.

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      • They would, only if they knew!! They totally would. Actually, that could be kinda funny. We could make a date known, and the real date unknown, much earlier, take pictures both days. I would get a laugh out of both.

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        • Dotey,

          I like your idea too. I think its fantastic, actually.

          But we’d have scramble it so that OSA would have no defense.

          Here’s a way:

          On the blog here, without telling one another or Mike, we could EACH pick for ourselves:
          1) an org to photograph
          2) a day of the week
          3) a time of day.

          Then, each of us, again, WITHOUT SHARING IT HERE AND PREFERABLY WITHOUT SHARING IT AT ALL TO ANYONE would go on our self appointed rounds, take, each of us, our photos from our chosen orgs, label them as above, and send them off to Mike.

          Mike will have no idea what any of us are intending to send him (unless you brief him directly on his email but then OSA might try to hack him or shut him down so I wouldn’t advise that).

          Once Mike has collected what he decides is enough of these org parking lot photos he can put them up with info as to Org name, date and time but without, of course, naming us, not even our Blog names.

          We on this blog are from all over the world, are we not? Certainly from all over the US. Any or all of us can be taking our photos and no one, not even Mike, will know when any of them are coming in.

          In brief, Dotey, we COULD do your plan together, except we’d being doing it ” together” on an individual, non-communicated basis, so that OSA will never know what org is being photographed or when, or by whom.

          And of course, Mike may receive photos of the same org from different people but, so what?

          I’ve already got an org picked out 🙂 But I ain’t tellin’ 🙂

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          • I just realized there’s a flaw in what I wrote: we’d be sending our labeled photos to Mike and OSA might try to hack him. Let me think about this for a bit. To what safe email could we send our photos for Mike and eventually post? Suggestions welcome.

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            • could they be sent via text? Mike could be all spy op guy and obtain a burner phone to receive the text photos. Would require he obtain the phone, we could all send in $2.00 to cover the cost.

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              • Via text to Mike on a burner phone he keeps to receive our photos only is a brilliant idea, Komodo!
                I would definitely contribute toward the cost of it!

      • The last time I walked by the Denver Org, and not during a Rockies game, there were about 25 or 30 cars in the parking lot. And wondered if they had done something similar as you just described.

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        • Doug, I wonder if the Denver Org is leasing parking spaces to nearby businesses. From what I remember of the city they are in a perfect position to take advantage of that, just as they do with baseball game parking. They’ve got to be as desperate for money from any source, as many other orgs.

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      • This could be the next twist in COB’s scam to stash hundreds of millions … move on from empty (but lovely, in a creepy way) remodeled real estate to fleets of new, nice quality vehicles. Scn can equip every org with at least 30 to 50 late model vehicles, and the org staff can all take turns moving the cars from spot to spot, lot to lot, to make the Orgs look occupied and active. The staff all dress like valets anyway, so it just seems right.

        This long-term program for creating the appearance of Active Orgs could be designated “Developed Traffic” … maybe someone could even shorten that into a mnemonic of some sort.

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        • Pedrito, as obedient as the Class V org staffs are – at least the ones I knew when I was in – as snap-and-pop obedient as I observed them to be, there’s no way they’d go along with that. Seeing all those beautiful expensive cars in their org parking lots – just for show? Especially when most of them are so poor and not being paid anything near a living wage. I think that would be the straw that broke the backs of these camels. I’m answering you seriously although it just occurred to me that you might be pulling our collective leg 🙂

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          • But that’s part of the beauty of this idea. If they did try to keep up appearances for us they would sink money into cars that depreciate quickly, unlike real estate, and show the staff even more of what a scam it is.

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    • Dotey OT, the idea’s good, but how ’bout the same LOCAL time, say some random thursday @ 2 PM, the time when the greater number of staff and students have to be there to report their stats? I would expect that to be the time when the lots were most full.

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      • I would like to do this, as I think it would illustrate the point. But I think the point is is needs to be coordinated off the grid. Like you said, all at the same time on a day and time that you would expect they should be busy. No excuses. Hell, I hope they are reading this and someone is like “Oh shit, we have to do something about this.” Like allow people to store their cars on the grounds, or some such thing. But the idea is that someone can see ALL the orgs are boneyards. Flag is a bit different, parking lot wise. They have the parking deck up the street, I used to park in it when there were no places at the Oak Cove, which was often.

        Mike, let’s do this! I know, I know, you got bigger better things to do, and I want you to do them. You are kicking ass!! I have two people out on my own, that I have worked on, and I have two more in the works. I would love to spring about 500 more, and make some news!

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  10. Yep, looking back on Youtube videos shows that Flog has been pretty deserted for at least a decade now. Which is about the time you see promo for Class XII auditors going out to orgs to give seminars.

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    • But, but, but…. Aren’t the xIIs sentenced to the fleecewinds “for the duration”? /they have to be where the Twit™ can charge the most, where the marks can’t get to an airport & fly home until TPTB grant them their release?

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  11. Mike this scenario may also worsen in the short term. Italy as far as I remember has always had a good flow of public towards Flag. Italy is now the 4th country in the world with the most people infected with the coronavirus. The worst place is the north where there are the largest orgs and the Sea org. As the virus spreads, entire areas and cities are quarantined where you can neither go out nor enter but not even leave the house. A few weeks like this has already created problems for many companies. Imagine the orgs that live on a weekly basis and only a few have perhaps some reserves but need an ok to use them. So from here the flows to Flag will go down drastically. I don’t think the US will let them in.

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    • Loosingmyreligion, that is an excellent point. Italy was Flag’s main group and now they aren’t letting people in the us from countries that are hard hit with corona virus, so this will really hurt Flag even more than it is already hurting.

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      • Sure, furthermore this ‘stop’ could even last more because this small form of life appears to spread also in an apsyntomatic way thus it doesn’t need to have the host sick or with fever. Even people that recovered and are OK when checked have still this virus inside.
        Here one can learn what really means “fast expanding”.

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    • The US State Dept website has no restrictions on travel from Italy to USA. I also queried a person that works at State in D.C. no known restrictions.

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      • So far no restrictions I know I was just prospecting a quite sure possibity that could come soon. Here in Italy we are today at almost 700 infected abd 14 dead and 10 regions on top of 20 with cases. The problem is that this virus is not so deadly but highly contagious and a risk that could collapse hospitals and sanitary posts.

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  12. That is hilarious. I see 15 lights at the Oak Cove and 64 at the retirement home. It must be bingo night that retirement home, such homes are almost always full. The Oak Cove does pay taxes and the employees of that Clam establishment must be paid minimum wage at least.

    Reporter: Why all the dark rooms at the Oak Cove?
    Dan Sherman or Karin Pouw: We happily rent to disembodied spirits in our church. We don’t discriminate against the differently located. Not as long as we have their credit card numbers.

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    • The Oak Cove only pays taxes on rooms used for lodging by paying customers. It’s otherwise exempt from property taxes, if I recall what I’ve seen. There have long been reports of the rooms that aren’t empty, being used for things like storage, auditing rooms or staff berthing, and there may now be few if any paying guests whose stays would be taxed.

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  13. Pictures like this make my heart sing. I know david miscavige must still be having meltdowns and this is just a reminder of it. 🙂

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  14. I hate to be picky here Mike, but don’t Scientologists stay at the org ‘doing Scientology’ until very late every night while at flag? If they don’t get back until late, they’d likely only have their lights on for about a half an hour before they go to sleep; and even if every room was full, they could have staggered or erratic return times. The combination of the two could result in a building that looks virtually empty, like this. I’m not sure that any picture of the building at night would be an accurate representation of occupancy…

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    • Most people who are at Flag are NOT on training. They are on auditing. They spend an hour or two a day in session. The rest of the time they sit by the pool or in front of a reg. If they want some privacy they go to their rooms.

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      • As another point, in the 80’s and early 90’s the auditing waiting area at the Fort Harrison was a busy and exciting place. There would usually be between 50 and 150 public in the waiting area. They would talk with friends, sing, read, play board games, call friends at a phone bank provided so as to talk about their wins, etc. By the late 90’s you were lucky to find 3 people in the waiting area and that was only because their session was to start at any minute. Besides the lack of public on service, public were hiding from all the various reg and recruitment units desperately searching for a live body to grab on to. If there were any public in the Oak Cove when you took the picture they probably had a chair wedged under their door knob and kept the light off hoping they wouldn’t be discovered.

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      • Kk, thanks. I was under the impression that marathon sessions and “we want you here all day every day” was what staff pushed for. I also got that idea from the series “Oh No Ross and Carrie” did on scientology. I’m a neverin, so i don’t know specifics like what it’s like at Flag.

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  15. Flag is so dead. I see more tourists in front of the SP building posing for pictures than people going in. The Oak Cove is dark every night when I drive back over the causeway from my job at the beach. Same with the building built for Tom..total darkness.
    I’m going to a concert tonight at the Capitol Theater on Cleveland. I have a stack of Aftermath cards to place around.
    And just last night I saw poor Sea Org girl walking down Osceola from the Sandcastle towards the Ft. Harrison carring a very heavy bin of books or something. She was by herself and it was about 9:30pm

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  16. What happened to the other berthing facilities? IIRC, there was what HAD been a Quality Inn on the other side of town, which required bus service to the FH and CW Bank building, then an old Holiday Inn within walking distance of the FH. I heard that the QI was where they dumped all pretension of child care

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    • The QI was sold decades ago. THere are a number of other hotels/motels that were purchased. A couple on Cleveland St. 3 old motels a couple of miles north on Ft. Harrison. THe Osceola across from the Sandcastle.

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  17. Flag is empty and I would gladly go to Clearwater and walk around with my polished gold OT VIII bracelet and e-meter. I like the Starbucks on the corner of Cleveland and Ft. Harrison. It would be great fun to remember the good old days when Flag was booming in the late 1970’s and 1980’s. The Thai restaurant is still open last time I checked and so was the Christian Science reading room. The Clearwater public Library is still open and contains a lot of ant-Scientology books. I remember the exact day I started OT VII at the Sand Castle. It was the 4th of July, 1986. Davey, meet me for lunch old buddy.

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    • When Flag was booming? Heh, thanks for keeping it booming. Scientology did a lot of harm to me and others. I don’t understand why you think it was good that Scientology ever boomed. Oh well, I am glad Flag is DEAD! The entire organization is circling the drain. I wish the US Government would do their job and shut the whole thing down and give us our money back. Scientology is a scam.

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      • When Flag boomed, I made a lot of friends. Most of them are dead. I meant to show the contrast that Flag did boom when no one knew it was a scam.

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    • I’m surprised to hear that the local Clearwater public library has anti-$cientology books. One would think OSA would be in there stealing and destroying such entheta. Maybe the library has security cameras on sections where books routinely go missing.

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      • I donated two copies of my book – Lucifer’s Bridge. They posted one in Clearwater and one at the main branch.

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      • Sea Org members have been forbidden to go in the library for a couple of decades. Flag Security can be seen checking the library on its rounds to ensure this is not violated by staff.

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        • Here I go again and sorry, Rogers &Hammerstein.

          Flog’s PR Anthem Song.

          We could make believe
          We’re busy!
          Only make believe
          We’re upstat too!

          Some M’Orgs find
          Peace of mind
          In pretending.
          Couldn’t you?
          Couldn’t I?
          Couldn’t we?

          Make believe our Stats are Soaring?
          ‘Stead of down and crashed,
          Just say we’re Full!
          Might as well
          Lie and say “WE ARE FULL!”
          Though we know ourselves
          Its BULL.

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      • I saw the photos of those damned balloons deflated on the beach and that little baby turtle that died eating them – God, I do hate these lying bastards! Lie, lie, lie – “biodegradable” balloons my ass. How do they live with themselves?

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  19. As we use to say in Italy: essere alla frutta.
    (literally Having arrived at the fruit. Fruits are usually the last dish you get served in a meal. Then is over)

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